Is this HLLE?

[grimreefr]

I thought only tangs got hlle so maybe this is something else. I noticed a few days ago my clownfish had her mouth open and wouldn’t close it. She was still eating and acting normal. I looked it up and most info found said she could’ve rubbed or bitten down on a stinging organism. I do have aptasia in the tank so figured she would recover.

I have kept monitoring her daily and within one day it has gotten way worse. It looks like she now has a hole in her face. She has stopped eating and isn’t as active and is now mostly in a defensive survival mode.

There are other fish in the tank all who are eating and active as usual. A much smaller clarkii that is paired up with this much bigger clarkii, a small striped damsel, and a small scopas tang.

The tank is fed seaweed daily. Gets mostly mysis and brine (live and frozen) shrimp but also krill, flakes and pellets. I try to vary the diet.

Water parameters are:
Salinity: 1.025
No3: 10
Po4: .03
Dkh: 8
Temp: 76

Anyone ever seen this? She looks awful and this is one of my favorite fish.

 

[crazyfishmom]

Poor baby. I agree she does not look good.

#fishmedic

Hopefully the fish medic gang will be around soon and can offer help.

 

[Jekyl]

Looks to be damage but can you please post some white light photos?

 

[MnFish1]

is there another clown in the tank? Often if so, pairs of clowns will lock lips (like cichlids) - when pairing - which can cause the mouth to look like this. Additionally, flukes can cause a 'yawning' behavior (which would not necessarily look like this). Other fish can develop HLLE - but it does not look this. This looks like (as others have said) an injury from whatever cause. I might consider moving the fish to a hospital tank - so that in case it is a bullying issue, that it would be easier to manage - can you give any more information - about your fish, tank. Any new additions, etc?

PS - if indeed the fish has drastically changed over hours, it could signify ongoing injury (stings, bites, fights, etc) or an underlying infection - and I might consider an empiric broad spectrum antibiotic in a hospital tank.

 

[grimreefr]

I’ll try to get a pic under better lighting.

It’s strange because she is the dominant fish in the tank. I know the lock mouth behavior you speak of and I’ve never seen them exhibit that. I’m stumped but I do have aqua cipro at home that I can try I just fear the stress of netting her is going to do her in.

 

[grimreefr]

The last thing I added to the tank was berghias nudis to help eradicate the aptasia. I don’t know what would happen if she had found one and tried eating one.

 

[MnFish1]

The last thing I added to the tank was berghias nudis to help eradicate the aptasia. I don’t know what would happen if she had found one and tried eating one.

Nothing - probably. I don't think moving her to a new tank would 'hurt'. You may want to try to set up a phone and video the tank for a couple hours - and see if you see any aggression? The concerning thing to me is the comment that it seems to be relatively quickly worsening? @Jay Hemdal may have an idea

 

[MnFish1]

PS - cipro would be a broad spectrum antibiotic. however, I don't know the dose for fish - and it can have toxicity depending on levels and perhaps the type of fish. I would lean more towards kanamycin/neomycin/maracyn 2 (not all of them - but one of them)

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I’m struggling to remember ever seeing a clownfish with HLLE. I think I may have seen a maroon clown that got it.

This looks like an injury, sudden onset would also point to that, as HLLE develops slowly over months.

 

[grimreefr]

Her condition is worsening. She now has fairly large cysts on her face. I didn’t have any of the antibiotics mentioned. I found dosing on another thread for cipro and am going to try that.

Lights were already off when I got home but I shined a flashlight on her and snapped some pics. I think her days are numbered but am more curious to know what this is as I’ve never encountered it before in any of my clowns.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Her condition is worsening. She now has fairly large cysts on her face. I didn’t have any of the antibiotics mentioned. I found dosing on another thread for cipro and am going to try that.

Lights were already off when I got home but I shined a flashlight on her and snapped some pics. I think her days are numbered but am more curious to know what this is as I’ve never encountered it before in any of my clowns.

Sorry - I can't tell you exactly what this is, but it does seem to be an infection. The open mouth and the lesions near the mouth both seem to imply an injury, but maybe the infection started from within the fish? Did the open mouth start later, or did it show up first?

I don't normally use Cipro as a bath, so I can't advise you on a dose.

Jay

 

[grimreefr]

Open mouth started first. She still was active and eating with the open mouth.

 

[MnFish1]

FWIW - are you using a cipro 'dip' or a keeping the fish in a tank with cipro constantly

 

[grimreefr]

I decided to do it in tank for two reasons.

The first, less stress for the fish because if I have to net her it’s not going to be easy and she’s is going to get stressed out probably to death.

Second, I have a frogspawn that I’ve had for almost three years that I grew from one head to 13 and has recently stopped opening all the way like it normally used to. I don’t see any of the normal things so I’m thinking maybe it has something bacterial.

Two birds…