Keep Kessil or go Radion

[A. grandis]

PAR meters don’t work on Kessil lights. Fact. They are light canons.

Could you please let us know more about that...
I've heard that many LEDs can't be read by PAR meters.
Other people say that the new meters are able to read.
What's the truth?
Grandis.

 

[saltwaterpicaso]

the par meters are not capable of reading the kessil the right way but they are very strong I had radions and they are just as strong

 

[A. grandis]

the par meters are not capable of reading the kessil the right way but they are very strong I had radions and they are just as strong

How can we prove that?
Why is that?
Grandis.

 

[BlennyKravitz]

How can we prove that?
Why is that?
Grandis.

I was told by Kessil directly that PAR meters don’t work. I’m using Apex’ on mine and there’s no way it can be accurate.

 

[Newb73]

How can we prove that?
Why is that?
Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

I was told by Kessil directly that PAR meters don’t work. I’m using Apex’ on mine and there’s no way it can be accurate.

So this tests performed by BRS with the Kessil aren't accurate at all then?
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/e...-t5-hybrid-fixture-brstv-investigates.331769/

Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

I saw that video. Please point the minutes..
Grandis.

 

[Newb73]

I saw that video. Please point the minutes..
Grandis.

He spends quite a lot of time explaining how PAR has limited usage, PUR is malarchy, lumems is more about just whats visible and PAR is also an outdated measurement (from the 60s) based on whats VISIBLE and usable in agriculture......not designed for aquaculture at all.

Spectrum doesn't get enough conversation.

The spectrum on Kessils are near perfect and 90watts of power is 90 watts of power...all in exactly the right spectrums. The Hydras can get close if tuned right as can Radions.

He very clearly states a few times that PAR meters are zeroed/calibrated in a T5 standard which does not measure the sane as LEDs.

He also explains very clearly that MH, T5s and full spectrum lights all give off usable photons but are less efficient as the corals do not utilize certain ranges of those photons...although this varies from coral to coral they are overall giving off wavelengths that are not very usable to many corals yet register higher both to the human eye and an a PAR meter.

This is similar to the original Kessil explanations but it's worth it to watch the whole video.

LEDs are subject to burn corals due to lensing and must be turned down, but that can create problems for corals deeper in the tank and THAT is the fundamental challenge with LEDs.....not the PAR standard from the 60s. They do have superior spectrum abilities as they can be turned to the precise needs of corals with no wasted extraneous energy going to spectrums which are not used.

Shadowing with acro is also a problem w LEDs which he did not touch on at all but he did a good job of convincing me that some of that same shadowing occurs in nature anyway as well.

 

[A. grandis]

He spends quite a lot of time explaining how PAR has limited usage, PUR is malarchy, lumems is more about just whats visible and PAR is also an outdated measurement (from the 60s) based on whats VISIBLE and usable in agriculture......not designed for aquaculture at all.

Spectrum doesn't get enough conversation.

The spectrum on Kessils are near perfect and 90watts of power is 90 watts of power...all in exactly the right spectrums. The Hydras can get close if tuned right as can Radions.

He very clearly states a few times that PAR meters are zeroed/calibrated in a T5 standard which does not measure the sane as LEDs.

He also explains very clearly that MH, T5s and full spectrum lights all give off usable photons but are less efficient as the corals do not utilize certain ranges of those photons...although this varies from coral to coral they are overall giving off wavelengths that are not very usable to many corals yet register higher both to the human eye and an a PAR meter.

This is similar to the original Kessil explanations but it's worth it to watch the whole video.

LEDs are subject to burn corals due to lensing and must be turned down, but that can create problems for corals deeper in the tank and THAT is the fundamental challenge with LEDs.....not the PAR standard from the 60s. They do have superior spectrum abilities as they can be turned to the precise needs of corals with no wasted extraneous energy going to spectrums which are not used.

Shadowing with acro is also a problem w LEDs which he did not touch on at all but he did a good job of convincing me that some of that same shadowing occurs in nature anyway as well.

Thanks very much for the reply!
I'm doing too many things together right now and will spend some time later to rematch the video...
If Kessil said that the PAR meters can't read it, like BlennyKravitz said, then we better believe.
Grandis.

 

[madweazl]

the par meters are not capable of reading the kessil the right way but they are very strong I had radions and they are just as strong

What on earth makes you believe this? A typical PAR meter measures intensities from (roughtly) 400-700nm.

I was told by Kessil directly that PAR meters don’t work. I’m using Apex’ on mine and there’s no way it can be accurate.

I've seen a number of people mention this over the years but I've never heard from Kessil. They may have mentioned that PAR wasnt the end all be all to measuring the suitability of light sources but never that PAR meters didn't work on their lights (as if they had some sort of voodoo happening within the array).

 

[Newb73]

What on earth makes you believe this? A typical PAR meter measures intensities from (roughtly) 400-700nm.



I've seen a number of people mention this over the years but I've never heard from Kessil. They may have mentioned that PAR wasnt the end all be all to measuring the suitability of light sources but never that PAR meters didn't work on their lights (as if they had some sort of voodoo happening within the array).

PAR is an outdated parameter from the 60s designed around agriculture not aquaculture and PAR meters are designed and calibrated based on T5 light sources, not LED

 

[madweazl]

PAR is an outdated parameter from the 60s designed around agriculture not aquaculture and PAR meters are designed and calibrated based on T5 light sources, not LED

I think you need to do a little more homework on what PAR actually is.

 

[Newb73]

I think you need to do a little more homework on what PAR actually is.

 

[Velcro]

I’d be saying par doesn’t matter too if I owned the reefbrite company. Those things are overpriced and have unimpressive par.

 

[Newb73]

I’d be saying par doesn’t matter too if I owned the reefbrite company. Those things are overpriced and have unimpressive par.

I don't think he said "doesn't matter", just pointing out that the a newer tech combined with older diagnostics might not be the best fit.

We don't name Intel CPUs based solely on mhz anymore either as slower mhz chips can often out perform faster clocked chips depending on their core architecture and SIMD coding.

Doesn't make mhz completely irrelevant as it is still one part of the performance formula, but there is no way you can gauge actual real work performance based on mhz alone.

 

[A. grandis]

The PAR meters are calibrate to be used with T5s.
So probably any PAR measurements of combo lights including T5s will read basically the good reading from the T5s!!
It's a matter of choosing to believe in an expert, like Mr. Tullio, or to CLOSE your eyes and ears, to the video and believe into whatever you want to believe in.

Also, if people actually called Kessil, and they said that, what else matters? They made their lights!

Unfortunately this video has been highly ignored and that shows how people are in that "express LED train", AKA hype!

Grandis.

 

[Velcro]

/facepalm

 

[Newb73]

/facepalm

Is that facepalm because you don't understand cpu architecture or because you honestly believe PAR is the defacto comprehensive standard for measuring any light in any circumstance (and consider the analogy inexact).

 

[Velcro]

Is that facepalm because you don't understand cpu architecture or because you honestly believe PAR is the defacto comprehensive standard for measuring any light in any circumstance (and consider the analogy inexact).

Well I wasn’t even directing that at you, but since you asked... Generally, if you are going to make an analogy, it’s best to do so using an example that the majority of the audience will understand. I hope you feel super smart though!

 

[A. grandis]

Well I wasn’t even directing that at you, but since you asked... Generally, if you are going to make an analogy, it’s best to do so using an example that the majority of the audience will understand. I hope you feel super smart though!

Did you understand the video?
Were you able to read and understand my post?
I try to post so everyone can understand, including the kids.
Grandis.