Keeping Acros...

[zsuzsu]

i do feed like crazy, and still disagree, and all carbon based life needs p04. i agree grossly elevated p04 stunts growth but there is no such thing as a living reef without p04, on the earth , or in our homes. and that is fact. undetectable with a 25 dollar test kit means nothing, the organisms can be using it up as it enters the system or is being bound to something else or skimmed off. leaving test results in the dust. again sanjay is around 100ppm with an epic colorful algae free reef. when i overfed the zeo tank it was nice but i was on the edge of nutrient issues ( ie. cyano or algae) its a good system, its just a bit more stable and colorful with a bit of n03 and p04

 

[Ashish Patel]

Love the red pill analogy. Acropora keeping is simple but difficult if that makes sense.

Low, but present inorganic waste levels (nitrate and phosphate), and high levels of actual food (high input high export)

STABLE major and minor elements in their ideal natural seawater concentrations range

FLOW (probably the most overlooked but most important “parameter” often overlooked by new sps keepers). High water volume turnover. Limit dead spots. Avoid direct blasts but the entire water column should always be moving, and fast.

Adequate light levels and spectrum.

Those areas are totally under your control and fairly simple to maintain. The challenge is keeping them stable in the long haul. Your tests will dictate everything. You won’t dose if you don’t test a regularly depleting calcium and alkalinity level. Water changes may be enough for a while.

To me the biggest challenge in acropora keeping is staying pest free. Acropora have so many pests associated with them it’s easy to wipe out a tank with a single new specimen, even if you dip it. Knowing where to source your acros and understanding good quarantine practices will help you succeed in the long run.

Also...some acros are just flat out more fussy. Even those of us with years under our belts will bring home the occasional frag to have it die overnight. It happens

WOW - This has to be the most accurate post on keeping Acros happy! IMO anyway - Good one!

 

[Centerline]

Read the masters water pramameter article I posted and decide for yourself what you think is best for your tank. UNLS - No way will I ever go back to that way of keeping SPS.

I couldn't agree with you more. I ran UNLS for a couple of years and certainly didn't see the coloration I felt I should have. Once I started adding N03 and P04 things started coloring right up and growing much faster.

 

[Centerline]

i do feed like crazy, and still disagree, and all carbon based life needs p04. i agree grossly elevated p04 stunts growth but there is no such thing as a living reef without p04, on the earth , or in our homes. and that is fact. undetectable with a 25 dollar test kit means nothing, the organisms can be using it up as it enters the system or is being bound to something else or skimmed off. leaving test results in the dust. again sanjay is around 100ppm with an epic colorful algae free reef. when i overfed the zeo tank it was nice but i was on the edge of nutrient issues ( ie. cyano or algae) its a good system, its just a bit more stable and colorful with a bit of n03 and p04

I had a problem where my tank would gobble N03 and P04 - constant dosing, pale colors, crappy growth. And the dosing had me walking on eggshells...

 

[Ashish Patel]

I would respectfully disagree. I've seen way too many reefers struggle to keep acros and sps in general due to starving them with 0 nutrients over the years. This compounding with extreme light intensities with no means of measuring PAR. Not every hobbyist will have the time to spot feed them, nor dosing elements or AA's.

Natural reef eco systems have a abundance of micro fauna and foods to feed corals, not our glass boxes.

I've seen amazing tanks with ULNS as well as high nutrient - its soo difficult to say who's system would benefit from what nutrient level. Every tanks age, biological filter and bio load is different so no one really know the best nutrient level that is optimum. Forcing higher nutrients in a newer SPS tank started with dryrock could increase risk of problematic algaes. My tank is sitting at 0.02 Phosphates and 0.2 Nitrates , when I went chasing other peoples numbers it caused more problems for my tank. I believe the best thing is to feed heavy, test nutrients and supplement feed if its low and increase nutrient export if too high. All in all I don't believe removing nutrients via chemical and dosing Nitrates is necessary. Simple solution is to match your ALK with your nutrient levels. If your nutrients level are maintained naturally it will be less risk of it going out of wack which will surely cause more issues with your ALK. For example, imagine my tank using GFO to keep my PO at 0.02, If something goes wrong and my low ALK could become a problem.. I am confident my nutrients will remain stable since I only use marinepure block, refugium and a skimmer. Not sure if this all make sense

 

[zsuzsu]

I couldn't agree with you more. I ran UNLS for a couple of years and certainly didn't see the coloration I felt I should have. Once I started adding N03 and P04 things started coloring right up and growing much faster.

word

 

[Centerline]

I've seen amazing tanks with ULNS as well as high nutrient - its soo difficult to say who's system would benefit from what nutrient level. Every tanks age, biological filter and bio load is different so no one really know the best nutrient level that is optimum. Forcing higher nutrients in a newer SPS tank started with dryrock could increase risk of problematic algaes. My tank is sitting at 0.02 Phosphates and 0.2 Nitrates , when I went chasing other peoples numbers it caused more problems for my tank. I believe the best thing is to feed heavy, test nutrients and supplement feed if its low and increase nutrient export if too high. All in all I don't believe removing nutrients via chemical and dosing Nitrates is necessary. Simple solution is to match your ALK with your nutrient levels. If your nutrients level are maintained naturally it will be less risk of it going out of wack which will surely cause more issues with your ALK. For example, imagine my tank using GFO to keep my PO at 0.02, If something goes wrong and my low ALK could become a problem.. I am confident my nutrients will remain stable since I only use marinepure block, refugium and a skimmer. Not sure if this all make sense

I don't really understand what you mean by matching alk with nutrients. Can you expanded on this a tad? P04 at .02 looks fine to me. 0.2 nitrates seems very low and in my last sps tank (death by hurricane Irma) tank would yield very pale corals. BTW, I agree with most of your post, just interested in the alk/nutrient part.

 

[enveetie]

What size is your tank?

This question is important because it gives me and you an idea of how much fluctuation in alk your tank is experiencing. If you already have stony corals in there, then they should be using alk. Since you are not dosing, the alk declines and declines until you do a water change, and it jumps back up, and declines and declines until the next WC. The more water you have, the less drastic the dip, the smaller the volume, the larger the dip. If you add more acros without dosing, the dips get more pronounced.

Overall, these dips and fluctuations, especially with alk is what makes keeping acros "hard". Proper dosing spaced out over time minimizes these dips and fluctuations, a key part of making keeping acros "easy". So if you have a large tank and testing shows alk and calc decline slllooooowly, then go ahead and add those acros. If you show them declining a lot (typical in small tanks), don't add them until you've got dosing figured out.

 

[Ashish Patel]

I don't really understand what you mean by matching alk with nutrients. Can you expanded on this a tad? P04 at .02 looks fine to me. 0.2 nitrates seems very low and in my last sps tank (death by hurricane Irma) tank would yield very pale corals. BTW, I agree with most of your post, just interested in the alk/nutrient part.

My colors are not fading at that range, their pretty solid dark colors. I don't run mechanical filters and turn my skimmer of for 6 hours at night. I was running ALk close to 9DKH. Now slowly bringing it down to 7.5-8. High nutrients /Nitrates 5PPM+ can handle more ALK and would probably have negative effect going down to 7. I had some issues in my tank probably because of fluctuating nutrients, alk,and probably because I added sps 2 months after setting up with dry rock.. I think I've figured it out finally! lol

 

[Centerline]

My colors are not fading at that range, their pretty solid dark colors. I don't run mechanical filters and turn my skimmer of for 6 hours at night. I was running ALk close to 9DKH. Now slowly bringing it down to 7.5-8. High nutrients /Nitrates 5PPM+ can handle more ALK and would probably have negative effect going down to 7. I had some issues in my tank probably because of fluctuating nutrients, alk,and probably because I added sps 2 months after setting up with dry rock.. I think I've figured it out finally! lol

Thank you!

 

[tripdad]

The most successful tanks always have the same thing in common. Good random flow, good quality light of the correct spectrum , and lots of nutrient input with enough nutrient removal to keep the system balanced. On the last point is where everyone argues, even in this thread. The best tanks, Zeo, berlin, aquaforest, triton, red sea, simple method all have one thing in common. They have food available to the coral when it needs it. You can put in just enough, have little removal methods and low levels of residuals, you can pour in a ton of food, have huge removal methods and have low levels of residual nutrients , something in between, even zeovit is the same, you strip everything out then add back in all the necessary nutrients. This is how the ocean really works. It is NOT low nutrient on a reef as some state, it IS low residual nutrient. In other words, the organisms will take advantage of every scrap of food to survive and grow. If there is a nutrient excess anywhere then something will come along and exploit it leaving "low" residual nutrients in the end. Everything in the ocean creates food for something else as well as eats other things to survive. In our little glass boxes we do not have all that life so we do our best. All that matters is that the corals have all the food/nutrients/elements they need when they need them. Each tank is different in nutrients, micro fauna, planktonic life, bacterial life, etc.. That's why the argument, because no two tanks are the same. You have to read YOUR biotope and respond to it's needs. That is what experience gives you, the knowledge to respond , or not to respond sometimes, just let things settle out. There is no one method that is "right". They are ALL "right" so long as your animals thrive. My personal choice is high nutrient import with high export so at the end of the day I have little measurable "waste" in the water column. But that's just my choice.

 

[REEFIN RIOS]

I personally don't think they are too hard to keep. I've never had an issue with keeping my tanks low of nutrients though. I actually dose nitrates which the acros love and gave them much more color. I've never had to battle with any pests either so my opinion may change in the future lol.

Heat is the biggest problem I've had. If my tank gets much above 82-83 my acros start dropping off quick. Mass extinction event :\

If I accidentally spike the Alkalinity the acros don't like it much either. But I've had some lps that faired worse than the acros.

I'm sure you'll do fine without dosing for a while and relying on water changes. I've had issues with my dosing system where for an extended period my Ca was down to 370 and alk dkh was 4.5. The acros still looked good and colored up, just didn't grow much

I keep my tank at 82 and my acro and my bounce love it! Tbh this acro is looking a whole lot better than other ones I kept in the past. I norm diddnt have much luck with acros but I got hooked back in with this smooth skin I have; I pay much more attention to everything now so I guess that’s why.

 

[DarthSimon]

The most successful tanks always have the same thing in common. Good random flow, good quality light of the correct spectrum , and lots of nutrient input with enough nutrient removal to keep the system balanced. On the last point is where everyone argues, even in this thread. The best tanks, Zeo, berlin, aquaforest, triton, red sea, simple method all have one thing in common. They have food available to the coral when it needs it. You can put in just enough, have little removal methods and low levels of residuals, you can pour in a ton of food, have huge removal methods and have low levels of residual nutrients , something in between, even zeovit is the same, you strip everything out then add back in all the necessary nutrients. This is how the ocean really works. It is NOT low nutrient on a reef as some state, it IS low residual nutrient. In other words, the organisms will take advantage of every scrap of food to survive and grow. If there is a nutrient excess anywhere then something will come along and exploit it leaving "low" residual nutrients in the end. Everything in the ocean creates food for something else as well as eats other things to survive. In our little glass boxes we do not have all that life so we do our best. All that matters is that the corals have all the food/nutrients/elements they need when they need them. Each tank is different in nutrients, micro fauna, planktonic life, bacterial life, etc.. That's why the argument, because no two tanks are the same. You have to read YOUR biotope and respond to it's needs. That is what experience gives you, the knowledge to respond , or not to respond sometimes, just let things settle out. There is no one method that is "right". They are ALL "right" so long as your animals thrive. My personal choice is high nutrient import with high export so at the end of the day I have little measurable "waste" in the water column. But that's just my choice.

Phenomenal post!!

 

[Fishfinder]

The most successful tanks always have the same thing in common. Good random flow, good quality light of the correct spectrum , and lots of nutrient input with enough nutrient removal to keep the system balanced. On the last point is where everyone argues, even in this thread. The best tanks, Zeo, berlin, aquaforest, triton, red sea, simple method all have one thing in common. They have food available to the coral when it needs it. You can put in just enough, have little removal methods and low levels of residuals, you can pour in a ton of food, have huge removal methods and have low levels of residual nutrients , something in between, even zeovit is the same, you strip everything out then add back in all the necessary nutrients. This is how the ocean really works. It is NOT low nutrient on a reef as some state, it IS low residual nutrient. In other words, the organisms will take advantage of every scrap of food to survive and grow. If there is a nutrient excess anywhere then something will come along and exploit it leaving "low" residual nutrients in the end. Everything in the ocean creates food for something else as well as eats other things to survive. In our little glass boxes we do not have all that life so we do our best. All that matters is that the corals have all the food/nutrients/elements they need when they need them. Each tank is different in nutrients, micro fauna, planktonic life, bacterial life, etc.. That's why the argument, because no two tanks are the same. You have to read YOUR biotope and respond to it's needs. That is what experience gives you, the knowledge to respond , or not to respond sometimes, just let things settle out. There is no one method that is "right". They are ALL "right" so long as your animals thrive. My personal choice is high nutrient import with high export so at the end of the day I have little measurable "waste" in the water column. But that's just my choice.

Post of the year!

 

[VR28man]

Old thread that was resurrected. But I'd like to give my thanks to everyone here - it's been very informative.

 

[Ashish Patel]

I felt the same way about that post.. If one can follow that and find the balance and keep it stable everyone will be successful.. But as everything its easier said than done!

 

[jordimex]

I carry quite a few easy SPS Corals:
Hulk Green slimer, cliffs acropora, spongodes monti, ORA neon green birdsnest, purple tip slimer, minefield cyphastrea, mystic sunset monti, RR nautispiral

Many more too.

could you build me a pack?

 

[BoomCorals]

could you build me a pack?

Sure just PM me let me know your price point.