Macroalgae and recommendations and a plea for information!

[Introvertedmaniack]

Hello everyone! I've wanted to get some macroalgae in my 65L tank for a whiilleeee and recently my LFS was kind enough to give me a small cutting of a macroalgae (im not sure which species though) and now I want some more! I'll attach some pics of my tank (the rock is a bit sparse, i plan to get around 2 more rocks to fill out some space) so you guys can get an idea of the space. my tank has 4 peppermint shrimp, 2 astrea snails, a single squat lobster that came on some rock i got from the LFS, and 3 (i think) brittle stars that were also a surprise with the rock. i've got plenty of sand for things to "root" into if they need, but I'm pretty sure my tank is a bit low on the nutrient levels needed for macroalgae to truly flourish. So, I'm also looking for some fertiliser recommendations! I'm open to suggestions, but I'm pretty new to keeping marine tank, so I'm not sure if I can use something like NeoNitro safely. any advice is welcome!

 

[aftrout]

Tank looks great as a start especially with the layout. Regarding macro algae, it looks like mermaid cup algae (Acetabularia sp).

I assume you will not have a large bio load of fish. If so, I would remove the sponge filter. That will be a huge nutrient sink and I think removing will help in your macro algae growth. The rock will develop the necessary bio load to handle the tank as it matures.

 

[Introvertedmaniack]

Tank looks great as a start especially with the layout. Regarding macro algae, it looks like mermaid cup algae (Acetabularia sp).

I assume you will not have a large bio load of fish. If so, I would remove the sponge filter. That will be a huge nutrient sink and I think removing will help in your macro algae growth. The rock will develop the necessary bio load to handle the tank as it matures.

i mostly have the sponge filter to add more oxygen to the tank and to try and produce More Biofilm to make food for my peppermints since my tank doesn't seem to grow enough on the surfaces

 

[aftrout]

i mostly have the sponge filter to add more oxygen to the tank and to try and produce More Biofilm to make food for my peppermints since my tank doesn't seem to grow enough on the surfaces

Understand. maybe need to some some light supplemental feeding of the peppermints. They don't need much and are good scavengers.

 

[Introvertedmaniack]

Understand. maybe need to some some light supplemental feeding of the peppermints. They don't need much and are good scavengers.

yeah, i feed them a little bit of Hikari carnivore pellets and crab cuisine every other day or so so make sure they have enough. I have some freeze-dried mysis shrimp too but so far those have been MUCH more trouble than they're worth in terms of exploding my ammonia. my tank had been running for at least 3 - 5 months before i added any animals, so it's odd that my tank doesn't like to produce the good stuff. my main filter is a seachem tidal HOB filter with coarse sponge, fine floss, actived carbon, and then some bio-matrix rocks so my filter system itself should be fine to do that heavy lifting, i just get worried about different things. you know how it is, im sure.

 

[Tom.E]

Not sure...but the squat lobster may damage or uproot any macros. Except for hermits, I've never been a fan of mixing macroalgae and crabs. They've always been a PITA.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

If you need nitrogen, neonitro is fine, but I recommend food grade sodium or calcium nitrate, or ammonium bicarbonate. Cheaper, as concentrated as you want, and with a purity guarantee hobby products lack. :)

I dose ammonium bicarbonate.

 

[Introvertedmaniack]

If you need nitrogen, neonitro is fine, but I recommend food grade sodium or calcium nitrate, or ammonium bicarbonate. Cheaper, as concentrated as you want, and with a purity guarantee hobby products lack. :)

I dose ammonium bicarbonate.

thats very good information, thank you! do you have any recommendations for some good macroalgae to put in my lovely little tank? I'd love suggestions for that too! :]

 

[Introvertedmaniack]

Not sure...but the squat lobster may damage or uproot any macros. Except for hermits, I've never been a fan of mixing macroalgae and crabs. They've always been a PITA.

as far as I'm aware, i've only got 1 squat lobster and he hasn't touched the macroalgae i've got in the tank at the moment. Do you have any macroalgae suggestions for my lil tank? I'd love to hear them if you do! or any warnings for other macroalgaes

 

[Tom.E]

Try starting off with Gracilaria. Many choices...so it would be easier asking about specific algae that catch your eye.

​

 

[Subsea]

i mostly have the sponge filter to add more oxygen to the tank and to try and produce More Biofilm to make food for my peppermints since my tank doesn't seem to grow enough on the surfaces

Remove sponge and leave air bubblers. The same applies for sponge & filter floss in your HOB. Live rock & substrate supplies surface area for bacteria colonization.

Either feed more & get more janitors or add a fertilizer and trace minerals

 

[Introvertedmaniack]

Remove sponge and leave air bubblers. The same applies for sponge & filter floss in your HOB. Live rock & substrate supplies surface area for bacteria colonization.

Either feed more & get more janitors or add a fertilizer and trace minerals

the sponge and floss in the HOB is just mechanical filtration, nothing more. I already occasionally dose with redsea magnesium, calcium, and KH supplements if my parameters are low in testing. I do also have NOPOX but since that seemed to cause my water to go cloudy with a bacteria bloom i've stopped using it (as per the advice i received in a different thread). I'm a bit nervous to feed more since its very easy for an ammonia spike to go crazy in a tank as small as mine and i've been battling that ammonia spike since (65L) :( are there any particular fertilizers that might help? also, by air bubblers, do you mean something like an airstone or is this a piece of equipment i've not seen this far? i also need to find a peppermint shrimp and such safe fertilizer that i can use safely as a novice tank keeper, which seems a touch challenging thus far!

 

[Subsea]

the sponge and floss in the HOB is just mechanical filtration, nothing more. I already occasionally dose with redsea magnesium, calcium, and KH supplements if my parameters are low in testing. I do also have NOPOX but since that seemed to cause my water to go cloudy with a bacteria bloom i've stopped using it (as per the advice i received in a different thread). I'm a bit nervous to feed more since its very easy for an ammonia spike to go crazy in a tank as small as mine and i've been battling that ammonia spike since (65L) :( are there any particular fertilizers that might help? also, by air bubblers, do you mean something like an airstone or is this a piece of equipment i've not seen this far? i also need to find a peppermint shrimp and such safe fertilizer that i can use safely as a novice tank keeper, which seems a touch challenging thus far!

Yes to air stone.

What part of the balancing act is challenging? Measuring parameters or administering dosage?

PS: after 55 years in this hobby, I find very little consensus on these forums. There are many different ways to operate a reef tank.
Help us to help you by better discribing your methods.

 

[Introvertedmaniack]

Yes to air stone.

What part of the balancing act is challenging? Measuring parameters or administering dosage?

PS: after 55 years in this hobby, I find very little consensus on these forums. There are many different ways to operate a reef tank.
Help us to help you by better discriminate your methods.

I assume the precise dosing and the background knowledge you need to dose appropriately. testing is easy, just perform the test and record the results according to the instructions. but dosing phosphates or nitrates seem like something that is very easy to over-correct, doing more harm than good. I don't want to accidentally create a situation where I poison my peppermints in my desire to chase macroalgae! it could be that the warnings on the labels sound much more severe than it actually is. I am also aware that a lot of tank keepers vehemently discourage over-reliance on bottle products, but I really don't see the fuss for a lot of things.
so my main issue would be the dosing and making sure my tank would be safe and sound with it. I also need to make sure that I can still find a way to encourage biofilm growth, maybe tank fertilisers would help with that too though? im unsure

 

[Subsea]

@Introvertedmanjack

If your focus is more biology and less technology, an invertebrate tank with Macroalgae is a sustainable goal.

I am quite knowledgeable about seaweed and its requirements.

Seaweed and coral both prefer ammonia to nitrates. When you say that floss is for mechanical filtration, I say it is a nitrate factory with bacteria feeding on accumulating detritus.
Your bacteria bloom is an indication that you don’t have enough consumers of nutrients. Algae is a primary consumer of nutrients, with the Big 3: N:P:K as well as trace minerals. The N:P ratio of micro algae (phytoplankton) is 16:1. As a generalization, the N:P ratio of macro algae (seaweed) is 32:1. While the ratio of nutrients in the water is not necessary to be the same, only that that nutrients are available.

Nitrogen limited tanks are difficult for me to operate long term. In this 55G tank the apex predator is a peppermint shrimp. I dose 20ml of ammonia twice a day and twice a week I add 0.10 ml of concentrated liquid kelp.

What is the lighting in your 37 liter tank?
And what are the parameters in the tank?

 

[Introvertedmaniack]

@Introvertedmanjack

If your focus is more biology and less technology, an invertebrate tank with Macroalgae is a sustainable goal.

I am quite knowledgeable about seaweed and its requirements.

Seaweed and coral both prefer ammonia to nitrates. When you say that floss is for mechanical filtration, I say it is a nitrate factory with bacteria feeding on accumulating detritus.
Your bacteria bloom is an indication that you don’t have enough consumers of nutrients. Algae is a primary consumer of nutrients, with the Big 3: N:P:K as well as trace minerals. The N:P ratio of micro algae (phytoplankton) is 16:1. As a generalization, the N:P ratio of macro algae (seaweed) is 32:1. While the ratio of nutrients in the water is not necessary to be the same, only that that nutrients are available.

Nitrogen limited tanks are difficult for me to operate long term. In this 55G tank the apex predator is a peppermint shrimp. I dose 20ml of ammonia twice a day and twice a week I add 0.10 ml of concentrated liquid kelp.

What is the lighting in your 37 liter tank?
And what are the parameters in the tank?

my parameters as of Nov. 11th are temp: 26 celcius, salinity: 35 ppt, ammonia 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 10ppm, phosphate 0.5 - 1 ppm, 8.5 dKH, pH about 8.5, magnesium 1650 ppm, calcium 460 ppm. my light is just a white LED strip thingy that came with my tank as a kit. it's not ideal but finding a decent marine light is EXPENSIVE so i've just stuck with it so far :/

 

[Subsea]

With respect to lighting, in my experiences, less intensity is better than more. I like viewing a light spectrum between 6000 - 10,000 Kevin. The seaweed will adjust to what it gets.

For green, a meadow of Caulerpa in the substrate is attractive. Keep it off your live rock as the holdfast are difficult to remove.

For reds: Gracilaria, Halamenia and Bortacladia are nice. With lower light intensity, I recommend Bortacladia. It is collected in 30’-130’ of water and when I get it from the divers, it is a dark burgundy. When subjected to more light, it turns fire engine red and if subjected to intense light, it turns yellow orange and disintegrates.

Check out some options:

Red Grape Algae

Botryocladia sp. — Red Grape Algae Handpicked red grapes from Florida’s underwater vineyard. What You Get A bold, sculptural red macroalga collected offshore in the Gulf of Mexico, typically from ledges and hard-bottom habitat at 30–60 ft. Its signature look comes from bright red, grape-like...

gulfcoasteco.myshopify.com

 

[Introvertedmaniack]

i see! I have no idea what I can get locally in my city but from in my local LFS i'm pretty sure i've seen mostly green stuff. when my first macroalgae died the store owner said it was because i don't use RODI water (can't afford a system) but thats the first i've ever heard of such an issue. i assumed it must have been my light or pH (low at the time) or something like that i'll need to see what's available tomorrow when I go get my rock and wave maker! for context: I live in Australia so not all the same species are available, but some are!

With respect to lighting, in my experiences, less intensity is better than more. I like viewing a light spectrum between 6000 - 10,000 Kevin. The seaweed will adjust to what it gets.

For green, a meadow of Caulerpa in the substrate is attractive. Keep it off your live rock as the holdfast are difficult to remove.

For reds: Gracilaria, Halamenia and Bortacladia are nice. With lower light intensity, I recommend Bortacladia. It is collected in 30’-130’ of water and when I get it from the divers, it is a dark burgundy. When subjected to more light, it turns fire engine red and if subjected to intense light, it turns yellow orange and disintegrates.

Check out some options:

Red Grape Algae

Botryocladia sp. — Red Grape Algae Handpicked red grapes from Florida’s underwater vineyard. What You Get A bold, sculptural red macroalga collected offshore in the Gulf of Mexico, typically from ledges and hard-bottom habitat at 30–60 ft. Its signature look comes from bright red, grape-like...

gulfcoasteco.myshopify.com

 

[Subsea]

“store owner said it was because i don't use RODI water“

I totally disagree with this statement. In my seaweed growout systems, I add groundwater at a TDS of 950ppm.

 

[Introvertedmaniack]

“store owner said it was because i don't use RODI water“

I totally disagree with this statement.

my dad who has a horticulture background and is a fishing enthusiast says the same. the way we see it, nothing in the wild has access to water THAT pure and clean so it can't be that. Marine biology has taught me that eveb though some things require very specific conditions, nothing requires perfect conditions. it just frustrates me that I don't know what I did wrong the store owner said that macroalgae he gave me was meant to be pretty hardy, but i think I might have just placed it wrong or something.