Mindstream

MnFish1

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You were talking about the unreliability of peristaltic pumps while explaining why you would get a trident.

The trident has a peristaltic pump.

I found that confusing, no worries :)
Yeah - sorry - I was saying - I would go to a non-peristaltic pump - any day - I hadn't researched the GHL - I thought it was different - I think I was thinking of the Abexa. (Please dont tell me that this is also a peristaltic pump lol - I didnt check before posting)

EDIT - I meant a testing system with no peristaltic pump requirement. If there is nothing else - I would consider a trident
 

Silver14SS

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You just finished making one long *** winded post about my information being lies. I have asked you for proof and now your deflecting by telling us to believe in your common sense theories ;Yawn Excuse me if I would rather take the word of an employee who in September had nothing to worry about rather than believe in your personal Common sense theory that is biased by your disgruntled feelings towards the company
You said announcements were coming and production is meeting July backlog. Announcements haven't been made, posters who ordered in July haven't received theirs. That would make the statements true or false? I specifically didn't use the phrases lies or liar and even included that you are the messenger, not the one creating the false information.

What proof do you have to the volume of orders other than the feeling that someone was being truthful? I'm sure you've looked on the web for more feedback about the product. Surely there would be more than what exists if hundreds have been delivered and thousands ordered. It's like you flat our refuse to consider the possibility they aren't being honest with you.

Sure I'm disgruntled, this product had such promise and the execution has likely doomed it. It's a net loss for the hobby. Aside from Daniel, I'm not familiar with anyone on this forum who actually received one and it's been trouble free.

Gee you spent so much time looking at my posts and you don't know;)
90% or so? Based on your posts being dismissive of others who's posts are heavily weighted to one topic, we should be suspect of this? I'm following the example you set :)

Oh that's what your up to! It's refreshing to see somebody so interested in saving people from closed order pages and on top of that trying to save credit card companies from incurring debt.:rolleyes:
There are probably still people with a pending order who haven't cancelled. I hope they, those who've requested a refund through their payment source, and the credit card companies don't suffer a loss. Credit card companies weren't an exhaustive list as indicated by the word nobody preceding it in the sentence.
 

MnFish1

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You said announcements were coming and production is meeting July backlog. Announcements haven't been made, posters who ordered in July haven't received theirs. That would make the statements true or false? I specifically didn't use the phrases lies or liar and even included that you are the messenger, not the one creating the false information.

What proof do you have to the volume of orders other than the feeling that someone was being truthful? I'm sure you've looked on the web for more feedback about the product. Surely there would be more than what exists if hundreds have been delivered and thousands ordered. It's like you flat our refuse to consider the possibility they aren't being honest with you.

Sure I'm disgruntled, this product had such promise and the execution has likely doomed it. It's a net loss for the hobby. Aside from Daniel, I'm not familiar with anyone on this forum who actually received one and it's been trouble free.



90% or so? Based on your posts being dismissive of others who's posts are heavily weighted to one topic, we should be suspect of this? I'm following the example you set :)



There are probably still people with a pending order who haven't cancelled. I hope they, those who've requested a refund through their payment source, and the credit card companies don't suffer a loss. Credit card companies weren't an exhaustive list as indicated by the word nobody preceding it in the sentence.
You make some valid points - but - I would say that you (and others) do not seem to have the valiant knight attitude on other threads (i.e. saving people from their own stupid purchases (perhaps) or behaviors). So - no offense - why here
 

Dj City

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You make some valid points - but - I would say that you (and others) do not seem to have the valiant knight attitude on other threads (i.e. saving people from their own stupid purchases (perhaps) or behaviors). So - no offense - why here
Because it's painful to see fellow reefers be taken advantage of in this way.

It's like seeing an abused spouse defend their abuser.

I've read this entire thread and it is more than apparent that thre company as said "untrue" statements if you believe the messenger.

It's strange that for the most part you had 1 person that was in touch with this company and that person relayed info for the company but nobody else could contact them in any form.

People asking for proof of wrongdoing or asking people to disprove the words of the person who supposedly speaks to MS.

I'm sorry but this has got to be the most pathetic thread on R2R.
It really is sad.

Here is some hard truth.

Unless you are part of the Mindstream executive board (if they have a board) you have no idea what's really going on and you can only see what is plain to see.
What's plain to see is that there is no product moving out their doors.
What's plan to see is people that paid for a Mindstream 5 to 6 months ago STILL have not received their product.
What's plain to see is that their is no communication. (This is not a case where no news is good news)
What's plain to see is this has been the case for months.

I don't like to see people being taken advantage of.
It's painful to see people defending their abuser.
 
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Dj City

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And how is this false? They did get more orders than expected at Macna and a lot more than expected on July 1st. Do you have some proof to the contrary? If so please present it.

10/15


Once again any proof this is not accurate info on the orders? I also stated already that their announcements are the only thing that was sketchy. The staff members typically said to me their should be or maybe an announced made. I did say in the post that They will hopefully be making a positive announcement. I would hope you read the "Hopefully" part.

10/26


11/06


Same thing again. Do you have any proof that this is not true?

11/10


And how many other people have already confirmed that they were indeed putting in a robotic construction line. Do you have any proof to the contrary?


Why do you think that is impossible when they have been promoting the product for three years and then suddenly open up an order page. You must have thought it was a good investment if you purchased one! So why don't you believe a couple of thousand other reefers had the same idea?

11/15

Announcement post again, your stretching it now...

11/15


Once again most people heard about the robotic system so whats your point?
Do you think industrial robots come pre packaged ready to make mindstream disks?

11/19


Announcement again..

Once again the same statement in another post.



You should lose interest because you could find nothing and just kept repeating my posts on three topics.

1) July 1st was when they got in the bulk of their orders and it was a huge amount.

Please show us something to say this is wrong.

2) They made disks as fast as they could by hand but then bought a robotic automation system.

Several got this same info. If you have some proof this is wrong then please state it.

3) All of the Announcements they hoped to make.

I already said this was the only thing that was sketchy as they always had a problem with communication from day one.

What a waste of time post to respond to
I'm not trying to be antagonistic but I see you asking if people can DISprove what you say...
Can you PROVE any of what YOU say?

Why are you the only one who can get in touch with Mindstream?
Why should we believe what you say?

Again, not trying to be antagonistic but really and truly trying to understand.
 

ArcticAcropora

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It's been said before but I want this to work out so badly I'll say it again.

I hope somebody figures out how to improve this technology/business and bring a device like this to market. One device to test all those parameters would be a game changer for all of us. If the biz fails someone's gotta buy the patent or whatever and make it work. It'd be a money maker for sure!
 

saf1

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You make some valid points - but - I would say that you (and others) do not seem to have the valiant knight attitude on other threads (i.e. saving people from their own stupid purchases (perhaps) or behaviors). So - no offense - why here
No one here has said HAHA - you got suckered (not saying you said this - just what came into my mind when I read your reply).

I think more or less everyone has been reasonable. However, when one says how great the product is vs. others, well, you are going to get a response. The one thing we all have in common though is wanting pre-orders to either be filled, refunded, or get communication.

I will say this though. Yesterday I read my first post with someone having a MS and clearly stated that the results are not what they expected. I must say that one took me aback a bit. I also expected to hear a bit more from Melevsreef on the MS. I don't mean this disrespectful but he sort of likes to talk about things like that, early units, or brag if you will, and nothing has been said. Not that he is the be all end all.

I do agree - why do we keep posting in the thread though? I don't know, passes the time I guess...or I'm just curious to see if anyone has heard anything and lastly, well, it is gossip.
 

Mr4000

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Well do you want to receive a MS that doesn't work right, i sure don't and i've been waiting for months also.And yes, no communication is not a good thing even if there is something wrong with it let everyone know. They have supposibly been beta testing for years so what seems to be the problem. I ended up getting a trident, couldn't be happier, but i will wait to see if the MS ever comes about, hopefully it does and works right.
 

kzp

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Anyone else read the thread (you can search it on R2R) of a MS owner that says his unit doesn't work at all, and has not been able to get ahold of an IT agent at MS for WEEKS. That is simply unconscionable! Not only are they not fulfilling orders, they are not even supporting all of the existing actual owners! Can anyone imagine a Dell, Comcast, or fill in the blank not supporting owners/subscribers after weeks of calls? We all know the answer. To you, MnFish1, I STILL have not gotten my money back from either MS or AEx, so that disproves your notion that you are unaware of anyone who has not gotten their money back from someone--now you are aware. By the way, I ordered on 7/1/19, the 1st day it was available for general sales.
 

thepotoo

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I was a beta tester and live a couple miles down the road from the SAI offices. I took analytical chemistry in college with one of the co-founders (Giuseppe). Several of the employees have been over to my fish room. I gave them a bunch of coral and ~80 pounds of live rock to help set up reef tanks.

I know that all of the employees I've met are decent, well-meaning people. I also know that there isn't a lot of experience in running a company, and this definitely shows in all the delays and the lack of communication.

Companies today tend to engage their customers on social media. SAI doesn't. They are very "old school" like this - I'd often go weeks without hearing anything, and then they'd stop by with a new monitor or a new test or something.

This is a new class of product, there are absolutely going to be unforeseen issues. (If you're considering buying this, I would wait for the second generation, as with all other products.)

I will mention that I never once saw it work. I talked with the only other beta testers I have met IRL and he never saw it work either. Based on this, and their complete lack of communication, I sold my unit as soon as I got it. But to be fair to them, I never actually tried a production unit.

If you haven't gotten your unit, you need to email their support about it or call their office. They aren't reading this thread, and they don't care about their [lack of] image on social media.

In order to succeed, they need:
1) The chemistry needs to be valid. Specifically, the equations used to calculate parameters must work in all tanks. I have never seen exactly what equations are used myself, but the readings they provided would drift horribly over the course of a day/week in my reef. They said I was the only one with this problem, and I wonder if they decided to launch without addressing this.
2) The supply line needs to work. I know they switched manufacturers for both the main unit and disks a couple times over the course of the beta. There could easily be supply/manufacturing problems here.
3) The business has to succeed - there is definitely a right way and a wrong way to run a business, and I have seen even the best ideas crash and burn if executed poorly.

I am not convinced that this is the best idea in the world (give me just alk + phosphate + nitrate for $60 a month with no up front charge, and that's a good deal).

I am convinced that the execution could be a lot better here though. I have no idea if the VC money will run out before they are self-sufficient, but if/when people don't buy the product and the company goes under, your $1000 Mindstream will no longer work. That alone should be reason enough to steer clear.
 

rushbattle

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I was a beta tester and live a couple miles down the road from the SAI offices. I took analytical chemistry in college with one of the co-founders (Giuseppe). Several of the employees have been over to my fish room. I gave them a bunch of coral and ~80 pounds of live rock to help set up reef tanks.

I know that all of the employees I've met are decent, well-meaning people. I also know that there isn't a lot of experience in running a company, and this definitely shows in all the delays and the lack of communication.

Companies today tend to engage their customers on social media. SAI doesn't. They are very "old school" like this - I'd often go weeks without hearing anything, and then they'd stop by with a new monitor or a new test or something.

This is a new class of product, there are absolutely going to be unforeseen issues. (If you're considering buying this, I would wait for the second generation, as with all other products.)

I will mention that I never once saw it work. I talked with the only other beta testers I have met IRL and he never saw it work either. Based on this, and their complete lack of communication, I sold my unit as soon as I got it. But to be fair to them, I never actually tried a production unit.

If you haven't gotten your unit, you need to email their support about it or call their office. They aren't reading this thread, and they don't care about their [lack of] image on social media.

In order to succeed, they need:
1) The chemistry needs to be valid. Specifically, the equations used to calculate parameters must work in all tanks. I have never seen exactly what equations are used myself, but the readings they provided would drift horribly over the course of a day/week in my reef. They said I was the only one with this problem, and I wonder if they decided to launch without addressing this.
2) The supply line needs to work. I know they switched manufacturers for both the main unit and disks a couple times over the course of the beta. There could easily be supply/manufacturing problems here.
3) The business has to succeed - there is definitely a right way and a wrong way to run a business, and I have seen even the best ideas crash and burn if executed poorly.

I am not convinced that this is the best idea in the world (give me just alk + phosphate + nitrate for $60 a month with no up front charge, and that's a good deal).

I am convinced that the execution could be a lot better here though. I have no idea if the VC money will run out before they are self-sufficient, but if/when people don't buy the product and the company goes under, your $1000 Mindstream will no longer work. That alone should be reason enough to steer clear.
Super good information, thank you!!!
 

Tom reefman202

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Here's my MS dashboard from this morning. I have had mine for about 2 months and it is working well for me.


They ran into a bottleneck with making disks and had a bad run of disks, so I think that is what slowed them down. Hopefully, they are turning the corner.
 

Tom reefman202

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I wish I could give you some first hand experience but I have been waiting for 2 months and half. Asked seller when my order would ship and got a response saying there was no estimated shipping date. When I placed my order around MACNA they said 2 months lead time so go figure.
I am starting to get worried to be honest.
I ordered mine first week of July... same reply I got.. now no one answers my calls or emails... I may need a refund.. I got robbed
 

kzp

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I was a beta tester and live a couple miles down the road from the SAI offices. I took analytical chemistry in college with one of the co-founders (Giuseppe). Several of the employees have been over to my fish room. I gave them a bunch of coral and ~80 pounds of live rock to help set up reef tanks.

I know that all of the employees I've met are decent, well-meaning people. I also know that there isn't a lot of experience in running a company, and this definitely shows in all the delays and the lack of communication.

Companies today tend to engage their customers on social media. SAI doesn't. They are very "old school" like this - I'd often go weeks without hearing anything, and then they'd stop by with a new monitor or a new test or something.

This is a new class of product, there are absolutely going to be unforeseen issues. (If you're considering buying this, I would wait for the second generation, as with all other products.)

I will mention that I never once saw it work. I talked with the only other beta testers I have met IRL and he never saw it work either. Based on this, and their complete lack of communication, I sold my unit as soon as I got it. But to be fair to them, I never actually tried a production unit.

If you haven't gotten your unit, you need to email their support about it or call their office. They aren't reading this thread, and they don't care about their [lack of] image on social media.

In order to succeed, they need:
1) The chemistry needs to be valid. Specifically, the equations used to calculate parameters must work in all tanks. I have never seen exactly what equations are used myself, but the readings they provided would drift horribly over the course of a day/week in my reef. They said I was the only one with this problem, and I wonder if they decided to launch without addressing this.
2) The supply line needs to work. I know they switched manufacturers for both the main unit and disks a couple times over the course of the beta. There could easily be supply/manufacturing problems here.
3) The business has to succeed - there is definitely a right way and a wrong way to run a business, and I have seen even the best ideas crash and burn if executed poorly.

I am not convinced that this is the best idea in the world (give me just alk + phosphate + nitrate for $60 a month with no up front charge, and that's a good deal).

I am convinced that the execution could be a lot better here though. I have no idea if the VC money will run out before they are self-sufficient, but if/when people don't buy the product and the company goes under, your $1000 Mindstream will no longer work. That alone should be reason enough to steer clear.
Thank you so much for this worthwhile information. I just have a couple questions for you if you don't mind. 1st, are you aware that MS won't answer any phone calls or e-mails to anyone for weeks? You mentioned that they are "old school" and don't answer social media. That's fine except that they are now not answering anyone in any manner! Given that you live just a couple miles from the SAI office and you personally know at least one of the founders of the company, would it trouble you too much to possibly visit that office in person and ask someone there why they have decided to go silent? While you are there, you could also inform someone how angry and afraid many of your fellow reefers are given the fact that many of us (including me) are, at this point, out $1000.00 for 5 months (since 7/1/19) and have no way of reaching SAI to either request a refund or to get some idea as to when we can expect to receive our units. Then, you could report back to us. If you could do this one small favor, I know that you would be doing your fellow reefers a HUGE public service and potentially relieve a lot of our anxieties. One last question: are you even 100% certain that SAI is still in business, given that they have been unwilling (or unable) to be reached by any paying customers?
 

SandJ

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Were people promised an 8 week shipping window from day 1 of sales starting July 1st?
If so, when MS was at MACNA on September 1st they would have known at that point they were behind on orders. Therefore, them promising me an 8 week shipping time frame wound have been a blatant lie. And why offer $300 off at MACNA if you are already overrun with orders?

Mindstream has always promptly responded to my emails when I asked about a shipping update. Even when they only had bad news about shipping being delayed, they still responded. For them to completely stop responding now is very worrisome. My last contact was “we will send out an update next week and off a 10% discount”, yet that never happened.

I have never thought they were intentionally trying to scam. But there is nothing right about them taking my money, not delivering the product 4 weeks late and counting, and now no longer responding to emails or answering the phone. Their lack of response can only leave people to speculate about what is happening...and personally I can only imagine what is happening is not positive.

I know my judgement is skewed on this because it is something I really wanted and was ideal for my situation, and I bought it at 30% off (and was promised another 10% off but they stopped responding). When I explained to my husband what was happening, he immediately said to get a refund. If the same situation occurred with a Craigslist transaction I would have never tolerated it for this long.
 
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MnFish1

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Thank you so much for this worthwhile information. I just have a couple questions for you if you don't mind. 1st, are you aware that MS won't answer any phone calls or e-mails to anyone for weeks? You mentioned that they are "old school" and don't answer social media. That's fine except that they are now not answering anyone in any manner! Given that you live just a couple miles from the SAI office and you personally know at least one of the founders of the company, would it trouble you too much to possibly visit that office in person and ask someone there why they have decided to go silent? While you are there, you could also inform someone how angry and afraid many of your fellow reefers are given the fact that many of us (including me) are, at this point, out $1000.00 for 5 months (since 7/1/19) and have no way of reaching SAI to either request a refund or to get some idea as to when we can expect to receive our units. Then, you could report back to us. If you could do this one small favor, I know that you would be doing your fellow reefers a HUGE public service and potentially relieve a lot of our anxieties. One last question: are you even 100% certain that SAI is still in business, given that they have been unwilling (or unable) to be reached by any paying customers?
You have an agenda - you joined recently. All of your posts mention Mindstram - maybe you should try to help the rest of the hobbyists that need help with various issues - I t appears that your just prvokkng negativity (whether justified or not) - HERE. just get over it.
 

MnFish1

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Were people promised an 8 week shipping window from day 1 of sales starting July 1st?
Yes
If so, when MS was at MACNA on September 1st they would have known at that point they were behind on orders.
Seems like they should have

For them to completely stop responding now is very worrisome.
Agreed

For them to completely stop responding now is very worrisome. My last contact was “we will send out an update next week and off a 10% discount”, yet that never happened.
I got the discount

I have never thought they were intentionally trying to scam. But there is nothing right about them taking my money, not delivering the product 4 weeks late and counting, and now no longer responding to emails or answering the phone. Their lack of response can only leave people to speculate about what is happening...and personally I can only imagine what is happening is not positive.
Right IMHO
 

SDJustin

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FWIW.
I asked for an update on from on Friday 9/26 at around 9pm PST (about 4 weeks after I placed the order), and I heard back from them the next morning at around 8:30am saying the lead time was 6-8 weeks, my order is in the queue.

I asked for another update on Tuesday November 5th around 3:30pm PST and heard back from them on Thursday morning November 7th at around 5:30am that they are behind on filling orders.

Both times they got back to me within a reasonable amount of time.

I just sent another brief request for a status update.

I still have hope that they can deliver the product... will be a game changer if they can make it happen!

-Justin
 

saf1

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You have an agenda - you joined recently. All of your posts mention Mindstram - maybe you should try to help the rest of the hobbyists that need help with various issues - I t appears that your just prvokkng negativity (whether justified or not) - HERE. just get over it.
Actually to be fair when I read the post he replied to the thought actually crossed my mind too. If they do know one another, have stopped by, friends, etc - why not ask? I mean maybe I would have dialed it down a notch or two but if it really is like that then why not?
 
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