My 10+ year old Unicorn Tang died tonight

[LovesDogs_CatsRokay]

When this is over and you have saved the rest of your fish, I think you should consider contacting Neptune and telling them what happened. Perhaps they can help debug what happened and fix the problem in the software so that it doesn't happen to other people in the future.

 

[vertigo01]

Whats the possibility of severe liver damage from the over dose of Vodka?

Could that be the cause of the heavy breathing and lack of appetite?

 

[Roggio]

Thanks everyone for your thoughts and well wishes. I installed and air pump hoping it would save them. Currently only three of my seven large tangs are alive. The purple tang is very flush looking with a white film over his eyes. I set up a hospital tank in hopes of catching them. I feel so terrible- my naso I've had for six years was coming up to the glass struggling to breath. My thought was to get him out of the tank and maybe do a freshwater dip incase there were parasites on his gills. I ended up pinning him against the side of the tank for a moment before he broke free and hid in the rocks until he died. His last memory is me attacking him and dying in the dark I didn't sign up for this.

My theory is the massive dump of vodka and what must have been a jump in PH caused their immune systems to go down. I don't know what caused them to be flush and struggle to breath. They all struggled to breath at different times besides the blue hippo which ironically I thought was the most fragile fish. The fish were flashing which in my experience is a sign of ick but none had visible parasites besides the powder blue. I've changed out around 250 gallons of the total 600 gallons and plan on doing water changes for the next week. All of my SPS is dead. I lost almost everything in the hurricane and again when this happened. I'm going to let my tank sit for awhile.

I hope none of you ever have to go through this but incase you do what seemed to help was Selcom on their food, feeding high oil food like mysis, water changes, and lots of nori.

 

[Josh Kraft]

Where did you install the air pump?

Add it to your sump right under your return pump so it chops the bubbles and fills your tank with micro bubbles. It will look bad, but it will oxygenate your tank and attach bubbles to any particles bringing them to your overflow / skimmer.

 

[TheEngineer]

Ugh... I'm so sorry you are going through this

Don't blame yourself for the fish's demise. It may feel like you contributed to this, but clearly the fish was quite sick already. I think your idea to get them into another tank is a good one. Deep breaths, you can push through this.

 

[me & my baby]

This really is sad , I went threw something like this a little over a year ago and never did figure out what happened . I lost my regal that I raised from about 1” to about 6” over the corse of 5 years and my tusk from about 2” with it little spots to a 5” beautiful fish plus a lot more fish and all my corals . I hope works out good for you . If it wasn’t for my wife I wouldn’t still be in his hobby. I was ready to get rid of everything and move on but she love the tank so much . Over a year has passed and still in the recovery process .

 

[Garbonzo]

I recently lost a 7 yo royal gramma, and totally know that feeling. Sorry for your loss.

 

[Roggio]

Where did you install the air pump?

Add it to your sump right under your return pump so it chops the bubbles and fills your tank with micro bubbles. It will look bad, but it will oxygenate your tank and attach bubbles to any particles bringing them to your overflow / skimmer.

This for sure, sometimes I do this during bacterial blooms.

I'm going to be in Australia for a few months so I've went around to some of my local reef stores and picked rocks from their tanks that have some different species of sponges on them to serve as seed rocks as I let the tank sit. I've disconnected the APEX and stopped dosing vodka. Hopefully the tank will just sit and get stronger. I've seen some people with some old systems and it seems like they can do no wrong.

 

[Cnidoblast]

Is this scary Neptune bug only about dosing?
If I use the apex as a monitor and as a fallback if the heater fails I should be okay?

 

[Reefing-Around]

Not trying to disregard or dismiss what has happened to Roggio (truly sorry to hear), but I believe for every horror story about a controller, there are 20 plus stories of a controller saving someone's A**... Technology will always have its downside, but we have all made many more mistakes ourselves.. The best thing we can do is learn from others experiences and grow. This is the whole point of this site. Again, sorry this has happened and best wishes with the rest of your crew pulling thru...

 

[radiata]

...
My theory is the massive dump of vodka and what must have been a jump in PH caused their immune systems to go down.
...

I'm not sure your vodka theory is viable because of an experience I had many years ago. I was dosing vodka, and the the tubing I was using came apart (I think the vodka caused it to become slippery). Unfortunately I had the vodka housed above a large 150g Rubbermaid sump in the basement (doh!). When the tubing failed one night, I managed to siphon an almost full liter of cheap Ruskie stuff into my system. When I looked at my 180 DT the next day, the water was literally an opaque milk white from the accompanying bacterial explosion. I spent the day doing massive water changes. Somehow I only managed to lose a Marine Betta - I think it suffocated because of oxygen deprivation caused by the bacteria and by its being a relatively slow moving cave dwelling fish.

 

[twreefer]

So sorry for your loss. These things will happen from time to time, and you just have to grieve and then find a way to prevent in the future. Your plan for a slow tank recovery sounds good.

I have a Lopez Tang that suddenly took ill a couple of weeks ago with popeye and acting listlessly, stressed, and not eating. Eiblii angel was probably dogging him as well. He was so lethargic, I was able to catch him within seconds. I quickly popped him into my standing QT and he hid for a few days. Heavy doses of nori and and veggie pellets eventually coaxed him out. After about 10 days, he is very peppy and taking on a nice blue/purple sheen not seen in the DT. Only a slight case of popeye remains. I have saved other fish in past also, you just have to do your best and save those that you can when these things happen.

My APEX has been flawless for me, although I have never used it to dose. If there was a power outage, you may want to ensure you have "Fallback OFF" in the config.

 

[Cali9dub]

It looks like I found something.


******* peace of **** neptune product. I hate that company


Randomly it decided to dump all of my alk and calcium in my tank. It’s been dosing for months and randomly does this.

Their garbage product killed my pet I loved

Am I mistaken or can you program your apex to turn off your dosing pumps if your ph drops or raises to a dangerous level? Or can you program it to turn off the dosing pumps if a certain quantity of fluid has been exceeded ? I always had my calc reactor’s CO2 solenoid programmed to shut off if tank pH dipped below a prescribed number. Always worked for me, but I’ve never used the Dos pumps.

 

[radiata]

Roggio,

I'm saddened to hear of your loss caused by an apparent Apex failure. I'm inclined to think that Apex's forte is in electronics and in programming those electronics. Although their expansion into designer hardware (DOS, WAV, COR, etc) is a logical progression for the company, I wonder if they may have gotten in a little over their heads. When you utilize any newer product, you need to remember that the first Christians got fed to the hungriest lions. I bought a new DOS, but had second thoughts and sold it off before ever putting it on-line. (The nicest thing I can say about the DOS is that it has a unique reversible flow.) I elected to stay with my BSR dosers. It seems to me that your problem was caused by a DOS hardware failure as opposed to a software issue, but we'll never know. I've got a pair of WAVs, but I've been second guessing myself ever since for not going with Tunze Stream 3s - they've been making powerheads for a long time now, and the Stream 3s age guaranteed for five years vs. the WAV's one year. I'm very interested in the Apex Trident, and even have a lot of faith in the abilities of the person who designed it (per his talk at the last MACNA), but I'll wait for a lot of wonderful user experiences before I actually use Trident's feedback to fully automate the dosing of any supplements.

All that said, I don't think you'll find any better controller than the Apex. You might as well stick with the platform, even if you can never forgive them. I don't know your age, but at my years yet another steep learning curve is more than I can deal with.

Regards,
Bob

 

[quicksil328]

Sorry to hear about your Unicorn. I also have a Unicorn tang who is only about three years old now. He is my favorite fish so I can only imagine how upsetting this is for you.

 

[Pawtyphoon]

I'm not sure your vodka theory is viable because of an experience I had many years ago.

Roggio had the double hit of a vodka-induced bacterial bloom, sucking up all the oxygen, and massive spikes in calc and alk. to knock out his corals. Sounds like the controller couldn't have done more damage to his system if it caught fire and exploded.

 

[Joe Rice]

Truly sorry for your loss.

After the big alk overdose, what were your alk and pH levels testing at?

 

[Roggio]

I'm not sure your vodka theory is viable because of an experience I had many years ago. I was dosing vodka, and the the tubing I was using came apart (I think the vodka caused it to become slippery). Unfortunately I had the vodka housed above a large 150g Rubbermaid sump in the basement (doh!). When the tubing failed one night, I managed to siphon an almost full liter of cheap Ruskie stuff into my system. When I looked at my 180 DT the next day, the water was literally an opaque milk white from the accompanying bacterial explosion. I spent the day doing massive water changes. Somehow I only managed to lose a Marine Betta - I think it suffocated because of oxygen deprivation caused by the bacteria and by its being a relatively slow moving cave dwelling fish.

I appreciate your skepticism but our systems are certainly different and it was a huge dose of Alk and Calcium. I have several large fish that went into shock.

Am I mistaken or can you program your apex to turn off your dosing pumps if your ph drops or raises to a dangerous level? Or can you program it to turn off the dosing pumps if a certain quantity of fluid has been exceeded ? I always had my calc reactor’s CO2 solenoid programmed to shut off if tank pH dipped below a prescribed number. Always worked for me, but I’ve never used the Dos pumps.

You can, mine wasn’t set like that honestly. It would have failed anyway. Dispite my two double junction lab grade probes I spent a ton of money on the system did not refresh in time. I’m assuming it had to be a glitch with the Apex itself because both DoS ran for quite some time. I have several failsafes built in with my heater and my ATO.

Truly sorry for your loss.

After the big alk overdose, what were your alk and pH levels testing at?

Thank you

I have no idea. I raged and ripped my Apex out. I can’t tell you the last time I’ve been so upset and heartbroken. I planned on having my fish for 40 years or more. I’ve done everything I can to provide the best and healthiest environment I could.

 

[Eva Rose]

I just read your thread and am so very sorry for your losses. We get so attached to our fish. It is very painful to try to give them the healthiest environment only to have the very equipment that should aid you in this goal to backfire. I have an Apex that I use to notify me of equipment failure etc.

I do use dosing pumps too, because I have had to travel a lot the last 2 years. Sometimes circumstances (work etc.) force us to be away from home. So we still try to find ways to give our fish the best environment. I pay my neighbor (an experienced tank owner) to take care of my fish when I travel, but I did not want him to have to test and dose the corals. So I understand the point of view of installing dosing pumps. You wanted equipment to control and monitor dosing and invested in such. Now I’m concerned. I may redo my set-up as much as I travel. Because like you, my fish are my priority.

I totally understand your situation and empathize. It may not be of any comfort but you did provide your tangs a great environment for many years. The loss of them was not your fault. My sincere sympathies.

 

[Cory]

I would set up a new tank until you figure it out. Even just a 20 gallon. 100% new water. Or you can see if a reefer friend will take them. Hydrogen peroxide will help with o2. If you have impeller pumps, put them at the surface and chop the water. Creates a lot of bubbles.