Need science fair help ASAP

[Sooner Reefer]

Well still need an idea. Tried the How Do Corals Propigate? but apparintly that's not an expirement. Then I tried What Conditions Do Corals Grow Best In?(Lighting, Flow, Parameters, etc) but that was to broad. The teacher recommended How Does pH Affect Coral Growth?(picked it out of my list of conditions) but I figured since that flucuates throughout the day that wouldn't be good. So any whoo just need an idea. Was thinking how does lighting affect coral growth but that wouldn't work and would be expensive. Anyways just wanting some ideas.

 

[roshi719]

How about flow. would be much cheaper than lighting to vary and has a significant effect on growth

 

[gflat65]

I know of a school that studied the pulse rate of Xenia under different flow and lighting conditions. May be able to generate an idea from that. If it is something quantifiable and repeatable, they will likely give you a little a little room. You can measure water velocity pretty easily, par with a par meter, so that covers one end. Just have to find something to study. Growth rate of two pieces of the same coral, one fed, one not, etc. What grade?

 

[Sooner Reefer]

I'm a Sophmore in Highschool.

How about does the length of day affect fish? or re-word that into a better question. And just set up 2g tanks with cheap fluorscents with timers set to different times and just use fw fish (tetras or goldfish) as test subjects.

 

[paintballer768]

I'm a Sophmore in Highschool.

How about does the length of day affect fish? or re-word that into a better question. And just set up 2g tanks with cheap fluorscents with timers set to different times and just use fw fish (tetras or goldfish) as test subjects.

I suppose but any decent results would take months to get. I would recommend keeping your tank the way it is, but using flow as the independent variable. Place those xenia frags in different areas and take pics...not blurry ones haha. Then come back whenever the project is due and Im sure youll see happy or sad xenia in both places. Experiment solved lol

 

[tommyb]

You are kind of on the right track but what do you want to know? Do you want to know if it affects the growth of the fish? maybe overall health of it? I think this would be hard to do and not very accurate with just 2 fish.

When conducting an experiment you should only have 1 independent variable so you know what affected the results.. I agree I would possibly do different amounts of flow on coral growth and use zoanthids so you can count the polyps. Or even an easier one would be different distances from the light so put a frag up high one in the middle and one down low. Ths way you would only have to use one tank.

I think the best would be different lights but that would be pretty costly.

I am a science teacher btw.

 

[surfn]

why not just do something showing the nitrogen cycle? i.e. amonia is converted to nitrite, then to nitrate.......which can be utilized by plants.

that would be really easy. b/c you could setup a small tank with the intention of monitoring the bacterial cycle in the beginning, test all your parameters every day for the entire course of the cycle, and then graph each parameter vs. time in Microsoft Excel.

then if you want to go even further, you can describe in detail the biochemistry of how plants utilize nitrogen during photosynthesis. as an example, you could have the tank after it has completed the cycle and purposely put a large bioload in it to the point the nitrate is maxed out around 10-20ppm, and then introduce some macro algae plants and keep monitoring your nitrates every day. you should then see a decrease in nitrates over time after adding the macro algae or chaeto......or both. (again, graph everything in excel, and then you can print out large graph print outs to put on poster board)

trust me.......this kind of experiment would be a REAL winner as a soph in high school since you should be getting a very intro taste into the realms of biochemistry in plants and plant systems.

(I am a poor science PhD student btw.....lol)

 

[Sooner Reefer]

Ok thanks then I know I'm in good hands lol. I was thinking zoanthids too since you can count the polyps like you said. The fish expirement would be overall health if there is a difference because my fish don't seem to notice when the lights go off and I've always wondered that. I guess I could do the flow but that'd seem kinda boring lol. The lighting would be cool but I'd have to get like 10g for the lights to fit and idk if my bookstand could hold the weight. Smaller 2g or 5g would work but it'd be hard to get lights that small.

 

[paintballer768]

Ok thanks then I know I'm in good hands lol. I was thinking zoanthids too since you can count the polyps like you said. The fish expirement would be overall health if there is a difference because my fish don't seem to notice when the lights go off and I've always wondered that. I guess I could do the flow but that'd seem kinda boring lol. The lighting would be cool but I'd have to get like 10g for the lights to fit and idk if my bookstand could hold the weight. Smaller 2g or 5g would work but it'd be hard to get lights that small.

Hey Mike, I really like surfn's idea. Itd be really really easy for you lol. The zoanthids/xenia is a good one too, but setting up your 10 gallon again for a short period of time would be cake

 

[Sooner Reefer]

why not just do something showing the nitrogen cycle? i.e. amonia is converted to nitrite, then to nitrate.......which can be utilized by plants.

that would be really easy. b/c you could setup a small tank with the intention of monitoring the bacterial cycle in the beginning, test all your parameters every day for the entire course of the cycle, and then graph each parameter vs. time in Microsoft Excel.

then if you want to go even further, you can describe in detail the biochemistry of how plants utilize nitrogen during photosynthesis. as an example, you could have the tank after it has completed the cycle and purposely put a large bioload in it to the point the nitrate is maxed out around 10-20ppm, and then introduce some macro algae plants and keep monitoring your nitrates every day. you should then see a decrease in nitrates over time after adding the macro algae or chaeto......or both. (again, graph everything in excel, and then you can print out large graph print outs to put on poster board)

trust me.......this kind of experiment would be a REAL winner as a soph in high school since you should be getting a very intro taste into the realms of biochemistry in plants and plant systems.

(I am a poor science PhD student btw.....lol)

I really like the idea but how can we turn that into in expiramental question opposed to just doing researching and demonstrating?

 

[gflat65]

Research and demonstration kinda is experimentation. What Al's talking about would be a nice science fair project because so many things are measureable. You can have some posters illustrating the cycle. Showing how the macro removes the nitrates, etc. and documenting chaeto growth before and after being in a nutrient rich system. A lot depends on how much time you have, etc., too. Looks like you're in good hands with the fish nerds, though:D.

 

[Sooner Reefer]

How about: How does the Ocean naturally Remove its waste? \

 

[paintballer768]

How about: How does the Ocean naturally Remove its waste? \

Thatd be pretty good. If you choose that, you could go into detritus-consumers as well. Kind of like a point to the effect of "every living thing has a purpose in the ocean." Well I mean, I guess its true, but sea lice's point must be to sting the hell out of where your bathing suit touches your body :hammer:

 

[Sooner Reefer]

I like the idea. I could test Macro Algae, mangroves, and whatever else there is that naturally does that's testable. I guess detruis removing would be the inverts job and I don't know if you could test that. Input?

 

[surfn]

I really like the idea but how can we turn that into in expiramental question opposed to just doing researching and demonstrating?

well, at a high school level its not like you guys are doing "novel experiments" that have never been done before. so any type of experimental hypothesis you end up testing you could easily find an answer in a text book or research article somewhere before you actually do the experiment.

the subject matter is very relavent to information you should be able to find in your highschool biology book, AP highschool biology book, or college intro biology text book. thus the examples and information you provide your teacher should be easily able to relate to since its something you should learn in high school science class anyways.

coral growth and fish health is a very convoluted subject matter, and it will be very hard to put together an experiment like that, and will also be difficult to grade from a teacher's standpoint........as most high school science teachers probably don't know much about corals.

as far as contructing a hypothesis, just make it something like this "nitrogen cycle as a fuel source for photosynthesis"

 

[surfn]

then what you would do is have two, 5g tanks with small filters on them to provide adequate flow (do not use any carbon filters). both tanks would get an equal amount of live rock and sand. then you would monitor the cycle on both tanks by testing amonia, nitrite, and nitrate. both tanks can be lit with a single PC light over both.......side-by-side.

once the cycle has been completed in both tanks (the cycle should take the same time in both tanks if they have exactly the same amount of sand/rock, light, salinity etc.).........graph all 3 variables (amonia, nitrite, and nitrate vs. time in days). you should end up with a single graph, with 3 lines on it......

here is some info on tank cycling:
http://www.reefcentral.com/modules.php?s=&name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=1&page=7

this is an example of what your cycling graphs for each tank should look like:

then once your cycle is over, add more fish, inverts etc. in one tank and don't add anything in the other tank, just leave it empty.....aside form the live rock and sand (this tank is called your "control" variable).

then once you see the nitrate levels go up in your tank with fish/inverts........add the macro algae to BOTH tanks. (be sure to take digital pictures of the macro growth in both tanks to compare them over time......also will look good with all the graphs on a poster).

what should happen, is the macro will grow much faster in the tank that has fish/inverts and higher nitrates. and it may in fact die in the other tank that has a very low nitrate supply.

both tanks are under the same conditions, except one has a nitrate rich source for the photosynthesis taking place in the macro algae.......helping it to grow.

 

[surfn]

btw........if you decide to publish this experiment, i get second author rights......lol ;)


j/k...... ;)

 

[Sooner Reefer]

btw........if you decide to publish this experiment, i get second author rights......lol ;)


j/k...... ;)

Haha ok. I can credit you, that'd give me a "source" for my report by asking an expert. I guess you can just say you already have your PHD so it'll look better on my report.LOL

 

[surfn]

Haha ok. I can credit you, that'd give me a "source" for my report by asking an expert. I guess you can just say you already have your PHD so it'll look better on my report.LOL

HAHAHA i've been called allot of things, but an *expert* is not one of them... :hammer:

 

[tommyb]

I like surfn's idea. I am used to teaching Jr High Science at an Alternative School so it is pretty basic.