Need some help with plumbing, please

[MrsBugmaster]

I want to redo my qt system to reduce the number of QT tanks I have to maintain. (Seams like I always got 4 or 5 different qt's running at once.) I got these tanks from a lfs that was redoing their whole system. I need help with the best way to plumb them. I would like to plumb two separate tanks to one sump with one return pump if possible. I would like to be able to run just one or both tanks as needed. I don't want to plumb the two tank together if possible, but more like two separate tanks with one sump. What is the best way to do this. The tanks will be stacked one of top of the other also. The tanks are pretty much identical except one have 2 compartment and the other has 3. The compartments have flow-thru dividers. To help reduce cost a little, I was planning on using the hard plumbed parts that are already attached if possible. (See photos) The return lines are 1/2" and the drains are 1". The return pump is a mag drive 12, which has a 1/2" outlet.

Here is a picture of the 3 compartment when in the store. Top and bottom drains in each compartment with one return in each compartment.


A closer view of inside on one compartment.


back side of tanks.



Sump that I got used.


I realize there will be more than one way to plumb these so looking for options on best way to do this. Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[Forsaken77]

They should probably be kept separate because if you medicate, then you'll be putting medications into another tank that might not need it and you would also be using a lot more medications. You might also be transferring disease to another tank of healthy fish. Even if you put a valve on each return to shut off a tank, then you'll have stagnant water just sitting in an unused tank.

If you want to plumb them together, just go about it how you would if a tank had a dual overflow. Each tank has it's own drain to the sump, then split the returns off a pump. Just make sure you put valves to shut off return to either tank. You may be better off using 2 powerful return pumps in a common sump because each of those tanks also has their own split returns section. That may be too many splits for a single pump, unless it's a pressure rated external pump, like Panworld or Iwaki.

The key to QT is isolation. The only reason you would need both of these plumbed to a common sump is if your display tank had an outbreak and you need to remove all of the fish and treat them all at the same time. Otherwise you'd be mixing everything together, both good and bad.

Would you need both tanks setup simultaneously? Meaning, you have that many new fish to QT on a regular basis?

 

[Erica-Renee]

The only way to do this so you can run both or either or is create a Manifold on the output of your Return pump. On the manifold you will need two valves . One to go to each tank . There is NO Way for them to NOT Share plumbing unless you are willing to hook up and unhook some type of connection such as a Union fittings (this will give you either or tank) . The Drain from both tanks will flow back into the same sump..

Hope this helps.. But i believe you should have two sumps two pumps two heaters two everything and keep them separated or there is no use in sharing a pump with separate plumbing other then fact you can have one down not in use and the other working..

Good Luck

 

[MrsBugmaster]

They should probably be kept separate because if you medicate, then you'll be putting medications into another tank that might not need it and you would also be using a lot more medications. You might also be transferring disease to another tank of healthy fish. Even if you put a valve on each return to shut off a tank, then you'll have stagnant water just sitting in an unused tank.

If you want to plumb them together, just go about it how you would if a tank had a dual overflow. Each tank has it's own drain to the sump, then split the returns off a pump. Just make sure you put valves to shut off return to either tank. You may be better off using 2 powerful return pumps in a common sump because each of those tanks also has their own split returns section. That may be too many splits for a single pump, unless it's a pressure rated external pump, like Panworld or Iwaki.

The key to QT is isolation. The only reason you would need both of these plumbed to a common sump is if your display tank had an outbreak and you need to remove all of the fish and treat them all at the same time. Otherwise you'd be mixing everything together, both good and bad.

Would you need both tanks setup simultaneously? Meaning, you have that many new fish to QT on a regular basis?

Yes, I am aware of this, and one fish at a time is usually what I've been doing over the years. I always proactively treat all fish with the same meds so that is why I want to plumb them to one sump. I want to treat both tank at once. I have been trying to restock my 180 and after 8 months of one fish at a time, I now got 4 fish in my tank. I want to do more fish at once and I know the risks involved. I'm not concerned about that part.

I am not very familiar with plumbing tanks so don't know how to plumb a normal tank with dual overflow. That's what I need help on. What size pipes, what do I connect to what, do I use T's, how and what kind and size of plumbing do I use to connect all the drains together, and the returns, how many and where to install true union valves, one or two return pumps. Is it best to remove all existing plumbing and maybe plug the bottom holes and just use the top holes for drains, or use as is, do I use, soft plumbing or hard? Since the sup has two drains do I plumb each tank into a different drain or make a drain manifold and have them both drain together? These are the kinds of questions I need help with.

I want both tanks set up simultaneously, but with the option of possible shutting one down and only running one at a time for a while.I will be adding several fish to two different tanks . Some of the smaller fish will be added in groups so I want this kind of QT set up. I am also trying to create a "pair themed tank" so after qt some fish will remain in this system for a while until they grow out and have formed paired. But that is a different thread. I just want to know the best way to plumb these two tank in the manner which I am talking of.
Thanks

 

[MrsBugmaster]

The only way to do this so you can run both or either or is create a Manifold on the output of your Return pump. On the manifold you will need two valves . One to go to each tank . There is NO Way for them to NOT Share plumbing unless you are willing to hook up and unhook some type of connection such as a Union fittings (this will give you either or tank) . The Drain from both tanks will flow back into the same sump..

Hope this helps.. But i believe you should have two sumps two pumps two heaters two everything and keep them separated or there is no use in sharing a pump with separate plumbing other then fact you can have one down not in use and the other working..

Good Luck

So maybe it is best to leave the two tanks hooked together then. In that case since the sump has two drain pipes should I run each tank to a different sump drain or make a drain manifold and have them both draining together and then into the sump? I hope that makes sense.

 

[Erica-Renee]

So maybe it is best to leave the two tanks hooked together then. In that case since the sump has two drain pipes should I run each tank to a different sump drain or make a drain manifold and have them both draining together and then into the sump? I hope that makes sense.

With the Drains you have to be sure you NEVER Restrict them and they can handle more then your return pump. Connecting them together can work just fine with the above in mind. If You do dump both drains into one then go to the sump i would upside the drain manifold to handle the extra flow. This is how i have had my Main display tanks overflow Weir for many years ..

Example But you do not need ball Valves on them and i Recommend you do not put them adjusting them wrong can cause a backup and over flow of the tanks .
https://www.reef2reef.com/attachments/new-tank-plumbing-to-basement-jpg.874146/

 

[MrsBugmaster]

I forgot to mention the sump will be on the floor at the side of the tanks with tanks raised above the sump level.

 

[MrsBugmaster]

. There is NO Way for them to NOT Share plumbing

I'm not worried about them sharing plumbing when both are running,but so if I have only a couple of fish in qt then I can run only one tank at a time instead of the whole system. That way I don't have to medicate the whole system to treat a few fish. The one not being used can be drained and left empty until needed. How would I plumb for this type of set up?

 

[mr9iron]

Could you put a ball valve on both tanks returns to restrict the flow into the tanks? That way you could have either one or both tanks running at the same time. I would consider a dc pump that you can throttle up or down depending on the flow needs.

 

[Erica-Renee]

I'm not worried about them sharing plumbing when both are running,but so if I have only a couple of fish in qt then I can run only one tank at a time instead of the whole system. That way I don't have to medicate the whole system to treat a few fish. The one not being used can be drained and left empty until needed. How would I plumb for this type of set up?

Yes then if it were me
Build a Manifold for the Return pump . If your hard plumbing you need fitting to fit your pump ( I recommend a soft tube out of the pump to hard pvc)
for the manifold you need 1 T fitting .. 1 Elbow fitting . Sanitary fittings are best to use . (you can see they have a curve to help reduce friction) PUT THE Elbow on the end The T fitting nest to it each with a ball valve and then plumb to each of the two tanks. You will have to adjust the water on the ball valves to equal it out or turn one tank on or off. You should also either use a dc controllabe pump or add a 3rd ball valve before the manifold to slow pump output when your only using 1 of the tanks.. You can also use two t fittings and 3 ball valves turning one of them back into the sump ..

Hope this does not sound complicated .. its really not

Here is a Example . This is the Manifold running on my SUMP. Remember this one is running several tanks you only need two or 3 outputs . One for each tank and bypassed into the sump..

The 3 ball vales you see inside the sump are each in a different chamber , They are there to keep debris from settling in those areas .My pump is just under that piece of insulation board (not sure what that is on the pump) You can see i have a ball valve between the pump and the manifold to slow water in it . The pipe going straight up from the pump goes into another y pipe pushing some water to the Pond , some to the display tank. The ball valve in the back ground goes out to the House drain for water changes .IF you look at the Far top left of the image you can see my drain from the Display tank.
Its setup a bit differently now But the same Concept applies..

Hope this helps you

Erica Renee

 

[MrsBugmaster]

The only way to do this so you can run both or either or is create a Manifold on the output of your Return pump. On the manifold you will need two valves . One to go to each tank .

So if I put 2 ball valves on the return manifold, one for each tank, then would I also need to put any ball valves on the drains? I am thinking of dumping both tanks into a 2" manifold and then into sump. Do I need to be able to shut off both the return and drains from one of the tanks. I think I would probably shut off top tank if I want to run just one.

 

[Erica-Renee]

So if I put 2 ball valves on the return manifold, one for each tank, then would I also need to put any ball valves on the drains? I am thinking of dumping both tanks into a 2" manifold and then into sump. Do I need to be able to shut off both the return and drains from one of the tanks. I think I would probably shut off top tank if I want to run just one.

I recommend no valves on the Drains. if you shut off the water going into the one of the two tanks there will be no output flow on its drain. If they are Stacked on top each other You will need a Ball valve on the Output of the bottom tank . Well may need to prevent water from the top tank going into the lower one Depending on how you plumb them. a Properly positioned manifold would also solve this.

As i said above restricting the drain with a valve can be Risky

 

[MrsBugmaster]

Well may need to prevent water from the top tank going into the lower one Depending on how you plumb them. a Properly positioned manifold would also solve this.

Yeah, this is what I meant by putting valve on top tank drain to prevent it from draining into bottom. Not sure where to position it on the manifold.

 

[MrsBugmaster]

Ok, how is this for the drain manifold? See any problems? I am new to this kind to plumbing so hope I am understanding what everyone is saying and I am doing this right. If this looks good then I can move on to the return. Thanks for the help.


Drawing of plumbing: Edit, the tank came with drains in place with barbed fitting so I am trying to work with what I got. So I will be using hose instead of hard plumbing all of it.



This 2" pipe with 1" inserts will fit over the sumps 1" drain pipes going into the sump.



The end of the drain manifold



the rest of the drain manifold will consist of these, one for each of the other drains

 

[MrsBugmaster]

Could you put a ball valve on both tanks returns to restrict the flow into the tanks? That way you could have either one or both tanks running at the same time. I would consider a dc pump that you can throttle up or down depending on the flow needs.

Not sure on where to place the valves. I already had this pump laying around so want to use it to reduce cost. It is a QT system so don't want to spend too much more.

 

[MrsBugmaster]

I recommend no valves on the Drains. if you shut off the water going into the one of the two tanks there will be no output flow on its drain. If they are Stacked on top each other You will need a Ball valve on the Output of the bottom tank . Well may need to prevent water from the top tank going into the lower one Depending on how you plumb them. a Properly positioned manifold would also solve this.

As i said above restricting the drain with a valve can be Risky

I'm a little confused and don't quite understand this. Yes, the tanks will be stacked. So you are saying I do need a True Union Ball Valve on the drain lines in order to shut one of the tanks off? Or where would I place the manifold to solve this?

Here is another drain option. Not sure which one would be best. Or maybe I'm way off and there is a better way. I'm kinda lost when it come to this plumbing.

I put only one shut off valve(true union ball valve) on the top tank in this drawing because if I am running only one tank it would probably be the bottom one. Or can I put one on both tanks. I'm confused about this cause you said not to restrict the drains, I don't understand how this would be restricting the drain since it would be used only to shut off one tank. And I would use the Cepex valves and they are 1" inside diameter, so no restriction, right or am I completely missing something.
Or where would I put the shut off valves on drawing one?

Or are you saying even if they are stacked if return is shut off to one tank it will not drain? I am over thinking it and it won't be a problem?

Thanks for you help.

 

[MrsBugmaster]

bump for help

 

[Katrina71]

@Erica-Renee I think the op has some additional questions. Think ya can help?

 

[Katrina71]

FYI, she goes in early and works late, but worth the wait. Knows her stuff.

 

[MrsBugmaster]

@Katrina71 thanks for you help!