Need to increase ONLY Ph/Alk

[jayfrindt]

Hello!

I have perfect parameters other than low PH/Alk.

Everything is healthy. Water is clear. I know I should likely leave well enough alone, but I think I can make things a bit more comfortable for my Nano.

I never use my Coralife Nano Reef A/B. My salt and alternating Fuel/ChaetoGro keep all levels right in the higher side of perfect. I have a mixed reef + Variety of Macro's (Brushes, Pencil Caps, Turtle Weed, Chaetomorpha Refugium with alternate light schedule, 3 Halimeda Varieties, Blue Chaeto, Red lettuce, Ref fern..etc.)

I don't like to waste things, so I thought it might be useful to increase my Alk/PH with Part B dosing only. I am not interested in adding the items in Part A as Fuel and ChaetoGro already provide me everything else I find useful.

Looking for some thoughts and opinions. I know I can easily use bicarb, but I don't want to waste the stuff...and I am pretty sure it does the same thing?

 

[Kingsley_Reef]

Kalkwasser would be a great option to raise alk/ph and you wouldn’t need alot

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I think perhaps there's a misunderstanding of the chemistry of a two part, but one could add just the alk part if truly that is all you need.

What are your alk and calcium values right now?

 

[jayfrindt]

I think perhaps there's a misunderstanding of the chemistry of a two part, but one could add just the alk part if truly that is all you need.

What are your alk and calcium values right now?

I understand the chemistry. I just would rather use up part B rather than pitch it and buy something else that can achieve the same thing.

I don’t need to buffer B against dosing A. I already add all the same things A offers by using Fuel and ChaetoGrow and all the measurable elements are perfect for those items.

About a week after water change Calcium is 450 and Alk drops to 6.6-7.1.

 

[jayfrindt]

I understand the chemistry. I just would rather use up part B rather than pitch it and buy something else that can achieve the same thing.

I don’t need to buffer B against dosing A. I already add all the same things A offers by using Fuel and ChaetoGrow and all the measurable elements are perfect for those items.

About a week after water change Calcium is 450 and Alk drops to 6.6-7.1.

I use Red Sea Coral Pro salt which is already high in Alk (12.something if I recall correctly). But after a week it’s low and consumed.

Since all other things remain perfect, my goal is every other week changes. This would require a bump in Alk every 3-4 days.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I understand the chemistry. I just would rather use up part B rather than pitch it and buy something else that can achieve the same thing.

I don’t need to buffer B against dosing A. I already add all the same things A offers by using Fuel and ChaetoGrow and all the measurable elements are perfect for those items.

About a week after water change Calcium is 450 and Alk drops to 6.6-7.1.

That's not what I meant. Fuel and Chaeto grow DO NOT add the primary purpose of Part A, and not using it will contribute to an ion imbalance that you already own the answer to: using both parts.

I'd personally use both at equal rates to maintain alkalinity. That will keep calcium basically where it is. It moves very slowly when dosing or depleting, but it is likely still doing do. It will also keep other things in balance (such as magnesium, sulfate, and many other ions), which your other products will not balance out.

That said, using a small amount of any alk supplement is mostly OK.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I use Red Sea Coral Pro salt which is already high in Alk (12.something if I recall correctly). But after a week it’s low and consumed.

Since all other things remain perfect, my goal is every other week changes. This would require a bump in Alk every 3-4 days.

If you are still unclear on why one wants to use both, I suggest reading this article on how those products are designed to work:

https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/how-a...-calcium-system-works-and-why-it-matters.958/

 

[jayfrindt]

If you are still unclear on why one wants to use both, I suggest reading this article on how those products are designed to work:

https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/how-a...-calcium-system-works-and-why-it-matters.958/

Great article. I have read this once before when I first started trying to make a proper mix of items for both the corals and macros. It seemed that A/B dosing always missed a few desirable items and many had substantial overlaps. So, I opted to move away from the 2 part dosing and everything has been great. The final touch will be getting the Alk just right based on tank consumption without adding too much of any of the others that are perfectly balanced based on current load of the tank. The eventual move to a proper way to dose Alk, but maybe use up some of the stuff I already have to achieve the same result. IE: Part B only.

So the way I understand what each dose adds is as follows -

Part A:
Calcium
Nickel
Magnesium
Cobalt
Strontium
Iodide
Zinc
Manganese
Potassium
Rubidium

Fuel:
Boron
Iodine
Iron
Copper
Zinc
Manganese
Bromide
Cobalt
Molybdenum
Vanadium
Nickel
Tim
Rubidium

ChaetoGro:
Potassium
Boron
Carbon
Calcium
Chlorine
Iron
Magnesium
Manganese
Molybdenum
Nickel
Sulfur
Zinc

Red Sea Coral Pro Salt:
Calcium
Magnesium
Potassium
70 different trace elements+- (Probably all overlapping the above) I do wait a few days before dosing anything after a water change.
12.3-12.7 Alk for the portion of the change.

I am dosing a more rounded solution than what I would normally get from Part A/B. However, I am not 'balancing' with a Part B or Alk solution?

The more I type the more crazy I feel about all this. But, my results on the dosing have been fantastic. I just see the Alk not holding up and I don't think a weekly water change is a necessary step in correcting. My theory is I could start to dose a small amount of Alk to balance and move to every other week.

Is this logic flawed somewhere...?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

If you are more comfortable just dosing alk, just do it and don’t agonize over the decision.

But two parts are complicated and just because it says it contains, say, boron, does not at all mean it boosts boron. The use of a two part that contains boron might actually deplete boron, depending on how much is present. That was the reason to direct you to the article.

 

[Mels_Reef]

A very simple, inexpensive way to boost ph and Alk is the BRS Soda Ash (sodium carbonate). You can buy the mix in 1g recipe (dry mix) and mix it with a gallon of RODI. Its very potent so you don’t need to dose much.

https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/1-ga...D=7109&indexName=brs_prod_m2_default_products

 

[jayfrindt]

I understand that dosing specific products will achieve this. Thanks everyone for the input.

For my question of using only the Part B I have already on the shelf - It sounds like I can summarize the answer with this:

Just using part B without knowing exactly how it balances Part A may achieve undesirable results. There is also no real explanation (on the bottle) as to how any one manufacturer builds their part A/B to balance the ions. There are 3 ways defined in the article - CoralLife’s is unknown to me at least.

I’m going to go with Seachem or Kalkwasser and continue using the alternating ChartoGro/Fuel as my ‘Part A’.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I understand that dosing specific products will achieve this. Thanks everyone for the input.

For my question of using only the Part B I have already on the shelf - It sounds like I can summarize the answer with this:

Just using part B without knowing exactly how it balances Part A may achieve undesirable results. There is also no real explanation (on the bottle) as to how any one manufacturer builds their part A/B to balance the ions. There are 3 ways defined in the article - CoralLife’s is unknown to me at least.

I’m going to go with Seachem or Kalkwasser and continue using the alternating ChartoGro/Fuel as my ‘Part A’.

Well, the Seachem product (any of them) won't be better ionically balanced than half a two part, and is almost certainly less so. It isn't likely appreciably different than using baking soda.

Kalk is fine, but adds both alk and calcium, just like adding both parts of the two part would.

 

[jayfrindt]

Well, the Seachem product (any of them) won't be better ionically balanced than half a two part, and is almost certainly less so. It isn't likely appreciably different than using baking soda.

Kalk is fine, but adds both alk and calcium, just like adding both parts of the two part would.

Any way to do the math to help with this balance? Does it really even matter for all intent and purpose? I would really prefer the more rounded elements provided by the 2 I currently alternate.

I was reading up on the options and should avoid the kalkwasser since I am already in the high side of perfect for Calcium. I don’t want that to slowly creep past my desired range.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Any way to do the math to help with this balance? Does it really even matter for all intent and purpose? I would really prefer the more rounded elements provided by the 2 I currently alternate.

I was reading up on the options and should avoid the kalkwasser since I am already in the high side of perfect for Calcium. I don’t want that to slowly creep past my desired range.

For one bottle spread out over time with normal water changes during that period, the concerns are minimal.

But for routine use for the entire life of your tank, I'd use a balanced method.