New brown stringy algae in sand

[reeferfoxx]

I've got a bottle of Dr Tim's one and only that arrived this past weekend that I'll get going shortly. Today, Nitrates are much higher. Parameters as of this evening:

Alkalinity: 7.4 (I'll manually dose some Soda Ash tonight to increase this and my PH)
Calcium: 431
Phosphate: 0.024 ppm
Nitrate: 5ppm
pH: 8.05
Temp: 78.3
Salinity: 34.4

With Nitrates at 5, should I consider a small 5 or 10 gallon water change to get them back down to 3ppm? To be honest, I didn't test my Nitrates last night yet I still dosed 40mL. I **could** have been solid at 3ppm. GRR!!!!

I was a disappointed I didn't get my plumbing redone this weekend, but too much kid stuff going on. On a positive note, I still haven't decided on a design yet because now I'm thinking of incorporating UV as a permanent fixture. I really do hate how big these things are though -- it's so hard to design plumbing to fit under my Reefer 525 XL.

No, I think your nutrients could be higher. When I battled dinos my parameters we're ...
Ca - 420
Alk - 6-7dkh
Mg - 1400
N - 10
P - 0.10ppm

Once hair algae grew, I stopped dosing(including alk and ca) and doing water changes for a month. Eventually, the hair algae died, nutrients reduced, and dinos were gone. It was a different approach but worked for me. I think you need to still do water changes not to reduce nutrients, only to reduce organics and replenish trace elements.

 

[rsumner]

I'm fairly confident that I'm not going to permanently plumb the UV into my system -- I just don't have the room. I've been redrawing my manifold all weekend and just don't feel I'll be able to maintain reasonable head pressure with everything running at once. I will, however plumb an accessory port that I can use for water changes and plugging into the UV if/when I need it.

I've done something similar temporarily by cutting a section of 1.25" return plumbing as close to my pump as possible and putting in a 1.25" to 0.5" tee where I have a ball valve and 3/4" barb attached to it. Now, I can close my cabinet and and have the HOB adapter attached to the UV dumping directly into the display. I think I'll get most consistent contact time now since I'm not recirculating the water back into the return section. I also love not having to run the extra pump any longer. I didn't connect a flow meter to this outlet, but I did a bucket test and I'm pushing nearly 300GHP through it similar to what I was doing with the Sicce pump. A pic:



I also cleaned the sand a bit today as it was starting to get a little hairy again. I also blew off the rocks again with my turkey baster and gave them a light brushing with a tooth brush. I'll test water parameters later after I get all this plumbing stuff cleaned up.

 

[rsumner]

Nitrates were 5 ppm and Phosphates doubled from last night to 0.058 ppm.

 

[rsumner]

I got home from a work dinner fairly late tonight and a visual inspection show crystal clear water and only a few very small patches of dark brown hair on the sand. Much of my LPS have tentacles extended tonight and there’s much less hairy algae caught in the branches of my birds nest and other SPS. Visually, things are looking good tonight, albeit there are no lights on tonight allowing me to get a similar visual comparison. I’m happy with my investment in time to reconfigure the UV pluming allowing me to guarantee at least 50% over the display turnover is cycling though the UV. My last attempt at pluming the UV provided no such ratios considering how it was pulling and dumping back into the return section of my sump.

I’m a little too tired to run through my normal water parameter tests.

 

[rsumner]

There's very little dark brown stringy algae on the coral today, however the stringy algae that's in the sand is definitely red and is grouped in more of a carpeting layout. In addition, I've been noticing some odd clear mucus within areas of my sump. A closer inspection of them reminds me of clearish-white boogers. Some images:









I'm not sure if these are related to the algae in the display or if this is some sort of precipitation. I took my heaters out, cleaned them, and got as much of this stuff removed with the powered cleaner as I could find/reach. I gave the rocks a quick dusting with the turkey baster. I also took this as an opportunity to swap out my activated carbon, so I've got 2 fresh cups of it running in my reactor now.

Phosphates and Nitrates dropped since my last check. Water parameters for tonight are:

Phosphate: 0.028 ppm
Nitrate: 3 ppm
Alk: 8.7
Calcium: 423 ppm
pH: 8.01
Temp: 78.1
Salinity: 34.2

 

[reeferfoxx]

There's very little dark brown stringy algae on the coral today, however the stringy algae that's in the sand is definitely red and is grouped in more of a carpeting layout. In addition, I've been noticing some odd clear mucus within areas of my sump. A closer inspection of them reminds me of clearish-white boogers. Some images:









I'm not sure if these are related to the algae in the display or if this is some sort of precipitation. I took my heaters out, cleaned them, and got as much of this stuff removed with the powered cleaner as I could find/reach. I gave the rocks a quick dusting with the turkey baster. I also took this as an opportunity to swap out my activated carbon, so I've got 2 fresh cups of it running in my reactor now.

Phosphates and Nitrates dropped since my last check. Water parameters for tonight are:

Phosphate: 0.028 ppm
Nitrate: 3 ppm
Alk: 8.7
Calcium: 423 ppm
pH: 8.01
Temp: 78.1
Salinity: 34.2

I'm going to say sponge growth!

Don't let nutrients bottom out. 0.02 in P is cutting close as well as the nitrate number.

 

[rsumner]

I'm going to say sponge growth! Don't let nutrients bottom out. 0.02 in P is cutting close as well as the nitrate number.

Whew. I've had pineapple sponges before and these have much less structure to them, so I was a little worried there was relation. I'm keeping an eye on the nutrients and don't plan on letting them fall below 3ppm Nitrate and 0.02 Phosphate. I also ordered the whole suite of Dr Tim's products: Re-Fresh, Waste-Away, and One and Only. I was very interested in his articles on cyano and dino removal. Now, I'm a realist and realize that much of this is also product marketing, however the brand is fairly well supported, so I'm starting to wonder if I need to cut the UV out and start on a bacterial treatment along with keeping my nutrients in check. Thoughts?

 

[reeferfoxx]

Whew. I've had pineapple sponges before and these have much less structure to them, so I was a little worried there was relation. I'm keeping an eye on the nutrients and don't plan on letting them fall below 3ppm Nitrate and 0.02 Phosphate. I also ordered the whole suite of Dr Tim's products: Re-Fresh, Waste-Away, and One and Only. I was very interested in his articles on cyano and dino removal. Now, I'm a realist and realize that much of this is also product marketing, however the brand is fairly well supported, so I'm starting to wonder if I need to cut the UV out and start on a bacterial treatment along with keeping my nutrients in check. Thoughts?

I've tried it. I have the complete line here. Did nothing for cyano or dinos. It's the wrong approach in my opinion. Limiting nutrients is all those do. Creates a sterile environment. If you try it, say good bye to sponges, pods, etc.

I do recommend the One and Only and Eco Balance if you bought that.

 

[rsumner]

I've tried it. I have the complete line here. Did nothing for cyano or dinos. It's the wrong approach in my opinion. Limiting nutrients is all those do. Creates a sterile environment. If you try it, say good bye to sponges, pods, etc. I do recommend the One and Only and Eco Balance if you bought that.

I didn't get the Eco Balance, but do have the One and Only that I'm going to use to get my Biopellets back up and running as soon as I get off my butt and build my manifold. I am worried about the Re-Fresh products as it specifically suggests that it **could** harm coral and inverts. Right now, besides a little tissue loss, everything in my tank is fairly happy due to my daily cleaning regiment and I would be really disappointed if I started to see livestock loss.

 

[rsumner]

Any thoughts on when I should cut back on using the UV?

 

[reeferfoxx]

Bio-pellets, gfo reactors, chaeto reactors, bio-balls, bio-blocks, seachems matrix, are all forms of nutrient reduction. I'm not sure how I can convey the picture i'm trying to paint for you here lol.

So, here was my tank at the beginning of dinos.



The started because of a phosphate limitation.
Identified as Coolia spp. Below is my video ID.


I dosed nutrients up and found that dinos grew more than I had expected. However, this quickly shifted to going away after a couple of weeks. Then green hair algae started popping up. Come to find out, Coolia likes hair algae and so my tank turned into this.



At that point, I literally gave up on the tank. I left it alone. I didn't dose Ca, Alk, Mg, no3, or po4. I didn't perform any water changes for a month. I didn't test parameters. Only fed fish to keep them alive. At the same time, All those nutrients I had dosed up stayed in the system. My alk naturally fell and my corals stayed alive. 2 weeks into doing nothing, the dinos were disappearing. At 30 days exactly my fish started to show water quality issues. So, i went to do a 15% water change. Hours later, that hair algae started falling off the rocks and floating in the water column. I decided to clean the tank.



UV remained in the tank, skimmer running, and bi-weekly water changes maintained.

Fast forward 3 months later(I think). Dinos still not showing back up. Nutrients still having to be dosed to maintain availability.


Fast forward a year.



You have to understand that when dinos pop up, they take out a lot of foundation that was built from the start. It's just like starting a new tank. Time and patience and that same foundation from the start of the tank has to be rebuilt.

Moral of the story is, your tank isn't ready for bio-pellets, gfo, nutrient reductions, chaeto reactors or anything. The K.I.S.S method has to be utilized until nutrients naturally build up themselves. I'll say, I don't run a UV anymore but understanding the interactions biologically will keep your tank dino free for the rest of the tanks life.

 

[rsumner]

So the question that comes to mind to me is that do you feel that the UV ever had a negative impact on the speed at which your beneficial bacteria were winning over the algae? That’s my concern at this point, hence the question about suppressing the UV so I can start to prime the system with some One and Only. Now that I have a good handle on maintaining my nutrient levels, I feel like it’s a great opportunity to build up bacteria. That’s why I got all the different DR Tims products also.

 

[reeferfoxx]

So the question that comes to mind to me is that do you feel that the UV ever had a negative impact on the speed at which your beneficial bacteria were winning over the algae? That’s my concern at this point, hence the question about suppressing the UV so I can start to prime the system with some One and Only. Now that I have a good handle on maintaining my nutrient levels, I feel like it’s a great opportunity to build up bacteria. That’s why I got all the different DR Tims products also.

No. UV only effects the water column. Bacteria resides on the surface of rock, sand, glass, and equipment. Stirring dino strands and mats in the column is helping a lot more with UV then it ever would without it. Now, if you are dosing bacteria, it best to turn off the UV for 24 hours. Also, the nutrients you are adding are already helping bacteria multiply.

 

[rsumner]

Thanks again for the motivation to stay on-track, @reeferfoxx. I'm in much better spirits today, so my moral to keep marching this path is much higher. I had a great idea tonight to get high amounts of suction, cover a large surface area, and not have to do water changes. I used my large Python and put the hose directly into a filter sock in my sump. I was able to clean the surface of the sand with ease while also filtering the water much better than the automatic gravel cleaner could ever do.

My rock was in pretty good shape this evening, but still gave it a quick blow with the turkey baster and brushed my powerheads with a tooth brush. I also have fresh socks in tonight and slowed the flow of water going through the UV a little. I may revisit the idea of trying to plumb my UV permanently or just buy a more compact version.

Water parameters this evening:

Phosphate: 0.037 ppm
Nitrate: 4 ppm
Alk: 8.8
Calcium: 403 ppm
pH: 7.98
Temp: 77.9
Salinity: 34.4

I also tested Magnesium tonight and, as always, it's just under 1600 according to my shiny new Red Sea test kit. <shrug>

It's fairly important to note that I have not been dosing Nitrogen or Phosphorus ever since I got them to the recommended levels shared by many. I hear your recommendations to keep going up, @reeferfoxx, but I'm just too scared to trade one problem with another. I would also never have the patience you had to let things sit for a month

I'm glad I have some new Hanna reagents coming in from BRS, because I've only got one Phosphorus ULR left ;Nailbiting

 

[rsumner]

Well, I didn't have much time for my tank since last week due to work, so I left things on auto-pilot. The only thing that I did accomplish this past weekend was tuning my skimmer to be at the proper height. I bought an automatic neck cleaner a while back for my skimmer requiring that I lower it in the sump so the extra 4+" would git. As a result, I had to increase the water level on the skimmer beyond the recommended water height by the manufacturer. I removed the neck cleaner this past weekend, and built a much higher skimmer stand out of egg crate. The skimmer is working **much** better now and I'm dumping 3/4 cup of dark skimmaid daily.

Water Parameters tonight:

Phosphate: 0.021 ppm
Nitrate: 1 ppm
Alk: 7.5
Calcium: 376 ppm
pH: 8.02
Temp: 78.2
Salinity: 34.1

I'll dose Nitrogen to get it back up to 3ppm, Alk to 8.5ish, and Calcum to 420ish.

As far as the algae: the remaining hairy-stuff in the sand has turned a dark brown color and almost seems as if it's dying off. There's zero growth on my rocks or the coral and my filter socks seem to be begging to get changed more often with all sorts of nasty brown gunk in them. I've been running the UV non-stop and actually purchased a new Aqua UV that I can actually fit under my tank. I haven't rebuilt the manifold yet, but I think I've nearly got all of the plumbing for it.

I'm ramping up for a water change soon. I cleaned my fresh water reservoir this past weekend with some bleached and wiped it down three or four times with RODI water to make sure it was nice and squeaky.

 

[rsumner]

Doh, I just dumped 8oz of **FRESHWATER** Dr Tims One and Only in my tank. I turned the skimmer off, pulled my socks, and turned off my carbon reactor in prep for the dose of the saltwater version of One and Only, but dumped the wrong one. Should I go ahead and turn on everything to get this out of my system and wait 48 hours before dosing the other? Gosh, I'm kicking myself right now!!!

 

[reeferfoxx]

Doh, I just dumped 8oz of **FRESHWATER** Dr Tims One and Only in my tank. I turned the skimmer off, pulled my socks, and turned off my carbon reactor in prep for the dose of the saltwater version of One and Only, but dumped the wrong one. Should I go ahead and turn on everything to get this out of my system and wait 48 hours before dosing the other? Gosh, I'm kicking myself right now!!!

It'll be fine. Won't work the same way but harmless.

 

[rsumner]

As always, thanks for the input, @reeferfoxx. I went ahead and turned on my skimmer and carbon reactor again last night. I'll wait until Thur and then dose the salt water version this time. . As far as the dino/cyano problem I've been battling: my rocks and coral are fairly spotless now, but I'm still cleaning the sand surface about once every two days of brown patches. I also finally did a 11% water change this past weekend and had to remove my UV as it was just creating too much of an eye sore mounted on the side of my tank. I'll have the new UV plumbed inline this week once I get a few more plumbing fittings that I've been waiting for.

 

[rsumner]

Interesting thing I discovered tonight when I did my water tests: after dosing the Freshwater One and Only, my phosphate dropped to 0.006 ppm. Nitrates were at 1ppm. I does Nitrogen and Phosphorus tonight to get me back to 0.02 and 3ppm respectfully.

 

[reeferfoxx]

Interesting thing I discovered tonight when I did my water tests: after dosing the Freshwater One and Only, my phosphate dropped to 0.006 ppm. Nitrates were at 1ppm. I does Nitrogen and Phosphorus tonight to get me back to 0.02 and 3ppm respectfully.

I would dose higher. Target 0.10 for P and 10ppm for N.