Observation Quarantine - worth it or not?

BRS

Please choose any that apply to you

  • 1. I do not use quarantine at all.

    Votes: 17 40.5%
  • 2. I use observation quarantine with prophylactic treatmetn

    Votes: 16 38.1%
  • 3. If a fish develops a disease during Observation I do NOT treat it

    Votes: 1 2.4%
  • 4. If a fish develops a disease, I treat it alone

    Votes: 7 16.7%
  • 5. If a fish develops a disease, I treat all the fish in that group

    Votes: 10 23.8%
  • 6. It is ethical to try to let a fish 'heal' from a disease like CI without treatment

    Votes: 1 2.4%
  • 7. It is unethical to not treat a disease if its apparent during Quarantine

    Votes: 9 21.4%
  • 8. I don't like polls with this many questions!

    Votes: 3 7.1%

  • Total voters
    42

MnFish1

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So lots of discussion about "QT" lately. For this poll, QT = Observation in a separate tank from the display - with no prophylactic treatment. Note there is a choice to pick "I don't use Observation only QT', and also 'I use QT with prophylactic treatment". This will give an idea as to what people are doing. It does not include putting fish in a refugium or an acclimation box connected to your display. Appreciate it if in the comments, you would answer 1). The percent of fish that died. 2). The percent of fish the developed disease and recovered without treatment, 3). The percent of fish that developed disease and were treated and 4). The percent that died :
 

chipmunkofdoom2

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I use observational QT for everything (fish, coral, inverts, rock, etc) and medicate if necessary in a different tank. I've only ever needed to medicate one fish, a captive-bred clowfish from Petco about 16 years ago.

For context, every fish I have ever bought has been captive bred except for two, one six line about 7 years ago and a neon goby about 11 years ago.

1) 0%
2) 0%
3) 0%
4) 0%
 

ca1ore

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I have used observational QT for years. I try not to QT too many fish at once, because if one does develop symptoms all must be treated. Even with the purportedly 'contaminated' state of the fish supply chain, I only end up having to treat about 20%.
 

cryptodendrum

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Been Quarantining since 2005, when I adopted a reef tank (not my first tank, that was in 1991) in 2003 that was riddled with Ich, HLLE, flatworms and more. My tanks from the 90's never had problems with disease or parasites or mysterious deaths that I know of. Did I just get lucky? I think so. But the tank I adopted in 2003 showed me another reality I'd been lucky to escape & I after researching on Reef Central, I finally broke down and planned my QT attack and did a full Hyposalinity of all fish as my very first (and very successful) Ich eradication QT effort.

Have been running Hyposalinity for all new fish since, and all fish and corals get a minimum of 8 weeks in QT. My QT tank processes are 100% automated, so it's not troublesome or laborious at all.

So these questions below speak of that adopted tank I acquired in 2003. The q's 1 & 4 seemed a little vague, so I clarified how I was reading them to ensure the answers given are what was being asked.

1). The percent of fish that died (assuming you mean without QT).
25%

2). The percent of fish the developed disease and recovered without treatment,
0%

3). The percent of fish that developed disease and were treated and
100%

4). The percent that died (as a result of or there-after QT):
0%
 

Smirkish

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Zero quarantine. I use acclimation observation only.

I see everything I buy in person first, and dip coral if I find it questionable. I wouldn’t buy a fish I suspected of illness, and wouldn’t purchase from a store that had obvious disease in ANY of their tanks. I have not had any sign of illness or disease in either of my saltwater tanks (granted I am new to this), or any of my freshwater systems which have been running for 10+ years, apart from nutritional issues with my gold severum at one point. My freshwater fish breed readily. Death has occurred only through escape (pleco leaping), old age and predation. I’ve never had ich break out in any of my systems -knocks on wood-, so that is why I am curious about how people handle it. I have wondered if I should set up a quarantine for my salt tanks since I started them, so the benefits interest me.

I have not had any fish/inverts/coral die that I have added apart from feather dusters and they were tormented repeatedly by my watchman. The dendronepthya has tried (the tangs picked at the frag quite a bit, even ripping it off the plug at one point. It’s actually two pieces now, but still it prevails.) I don’t think I’ve done anything out of the ordinary, apart from being careful about what I add to the tank. I wouldn’t recommend people new to fish keeping do what I do, though. You should do what makes you most comfortable, IMO.

I’ll wait for the onslaught now...
 

The_Skrimp

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I honestly don’t QT. The further I get into this hobby the more I consider it but I have five fish total and maybe room for just one more so I’ve taken my chances. I only ever buy locally so i can check out the fish before buying and to reduce the stress of shipping. I’d likely start QT if I upgrade to a bigger tank and stand to lose a lot more. I always dip coral though. I know my tank has ich in it. I’ll see a few spots on a fin here and there every once in a while but I try to manage it by keeping my fish fat and healthy and running UV at night.
 
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MnFish1

MnFish1

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Zero quarantine. I use acclimation observation only.

I see everything I buy in person first, and dip coral if I find it questionable. I wouldn’t buy a fish I suspected of illness, and wouldn’t purchase from a store that had obvious disease in ANY of their tanks. I have not had any sign of illness or disease in either of my saltwater tanks (granted I am new to this), or any of my freshwater systems which have been running for 10+ years, apart from nutritional issues with my gold severum at one point. My freshwater fish breed readily. Death has occurred only through escape (pleco leaping), old age and predation. I’ve never had ich break out in any of my systems -knocks on wood-, so that is why I am curious about how people handle it. I have wondered if I should set up a quarantine for my salt tanks since I started them, so the benefits interest me.

I have not had any fish/inverts/coral die that I have added apart from feather dusters and they were tormented repeatedly by my watchman. The dendronepthya has tried (the tangs picked at the frag quite a bit, even ripping it off the plug at one point. It’s actually two pieces now, but still it prevails.) I don’t think I’ve done anything out of the ordinary, apart from being careful about what I add to the tank. I wouldn’t recommend people new to fish keeping do what I do, though. You should do what makes you most comfortable, IMO.

I’ll wait for the onslaught now...
I think this is key - buying from a trusted source. Not necessarily the cheapest.
 
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MnFish1

MnFish1

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I honestly don’t QT. The further I get into this hobby the more I consider it but I have five fish total and maybe room for just one more so I’ve taken my chances. I only ever buy locally so i can check out the fish before buying and to reduce the stress of shipping. I’d likely start QT if I upgrade to a bigger tank and stand to lose a lot more. I always dip coral though. I know my tank has ich in it. I’ll see a few spots on a fin here and there every once in a while but I try to manage it by keeping my fish fat and healthy and running UV at night.
If you think about it - the surface are of the fish involved also is important. The more surface area - the more CI that can be on it. I (think this is what you're saying) - stocking density is important with any kind of disease prevention.
 
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MnFish1

MnFish1

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I have used observational QT for years. I try not to QT too many fish at once, because if one does develop symptoms all must be treated. Even with the purportedly 'contaminated' state of the fish supply chain, I only end up having to treat about 20%.
Thanks - this is what I was trying to get at. Kind of an 'odds' thing. How many people that just observe - need to treat something. My guess is that my experience is similar - though - now I only go to 1 LFS. If I want something - they order it and keep it for a month - using 'their QT' protocol - which is mild compared to most (unless a disease is present). I have not had any problem. This may relate to the fact that they get most of their fish/coral from a single source - its sent directly to them (not through 'the supply chain') afaik, and I can let them watch the fish for as long as I want. They have better eye for disease than I do (I would presume). Thanks for the response.
 

cryptodendrum

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I think this is key - buying from a trusted source. Not necessarily the cheapest.
This is how I went from my "lets see if I can raise clownfish babies" (in 2007) to actually farming them. I figured 1.) Sustainability for our world's oceans; if newbies are determined to make these kind of, and other, mistakes resulting in die off, better to do it with aqua-cultured fish than wild caught and 2.) as pointed out before, I go to long lengths to ensure my own livestock is parasite / disease free; they won't get any bad bugs from my fish.
 

MaxTremors

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I answered ‘yes’ to every question, because every situation is different, and I’ve done all
of these at some point in certain situations. There are too many variables for me to have a one-size-fits all approach to adding new specimens to my tank(s).
 
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MnFish1

MnFish1

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This is how I went from my "lets see if I can raise clownfish babies" (in 2007) to actually farming them. I figured 1.) Sustainability for our world's oceans; if newbies are determined to make these kind of, and other, mistakes resulting in die off, better to do it with aqua-cultured fish than wild caught and 2.) as pointed out before, I go to long lengths to ensure my own livestock is parasite / disease free; they won't get any bad bugs from my fish.
Interesting - I had clowns that routinely spawned, and I did the light trick on the date of free-swimming. I wanted to try to raise them with just micro foods - was not successful.
 

Steph72

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I’m surprised at the number of people who don’t quarantine. That’s not a criticism, to each their own. I used to prefer to do a full copper quarantine but with tangs I’ve had terrible luck with stress induced problems and facial erosion in quarantine. I now leave new fish in observation for two weeks and treat only if necessary.
 
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MnFish1

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I’m surprised at the number of people who don’t quarantine. That’s not a criticism, to each their own. I used to prefer to do a full copper quarantine but with tangs I’ve had terrible luck with stress induced problems and facial erosion in quarantine. I now leave new fish in observation for two weeks and treat only if necessary.
I you look at the many polls here - MOST people do not QT at all.
 

cryptodendrum

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Interesting - I had clowns that routinely spawned, and I did the light trick on the date of free-swimming. I wanted to try to raise them with just micro foods - was not successful.
Processed micro foods or live?

I've had really good success with the light / siphon method, and have just used that for years. I jerry rigged an LED light/siphon tool that I just hook over the rim and just wait for a 20L bucket to fill. Within 30 minutes, I've filled two of those buckets and caught better than 95% of all the strong swimmers; this filters out the weak swimmers & counts as my initial cull.

Then using an artemia filter cup over the suction hose, I remove most of the water of the two buckets down to just about 2-3 liters of water left in each bucket, densifying the fry culture - and very gently pour these contents into a 10L Fry Tank (also the same make I use for my QT tanks). I add a bubbler, heater, doser tubes for water changes, and a Seneye unit (cause NH3 is a real threat, and this is where the Seneye shines best.)

I culture all my own food, Phyto, Rotifers, Amhipods, Copepods, and more. Artemia as well, but that is my least used food source for the clowns, I often don't find they're worth the trouble.

I culture all this in recycled I/O salt buckets, just watch out for cross contamination.

The first couple of weeks, it's just pure Phyto gutloaded Rotifers and Amphipods; their mouths are too small for anything else, even too small for freshly hatched Artemia or decapsulated cysts. Rotifers and really tiny Amphipods is it. After that, you can start to scale up the size of the food.
 
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MnFish1

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I fed with processed - which they seemed to eat - but did not do well long-term
 

cryptodendrum

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If you want to try again, first try your hand at growing Phytoplankton, and then rotifers (and optionally, really small amiphipods) Once you get the hang of it, it's pretty low maintenance. Once you have that food supply going, catch some fry & try feeding that. The difference in success rate with a change from processed to live foods will be like night and day. When I did this, my survival rate of my fry harvests was better than 90% with just a tiny amount of culls required (because before, they didn't have the energy / strength to fully complete metamorphosis, resulting in more deformeties.)

Growing phyto is pretty easy; I actually grow it outside under mostly indirect sunlight & grow it year round in the Dutch climate (very short winter days). And I've had better success & less overheads growing it outside, than when I used to grow it indoors. Just made a post reply about this yesterday.

 
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MnFish1

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If you want to try again, first try your hand at growing Phytoplankton, and then rotifers (and optionally, really small amiphipods) Once you get the hang of it, it's pretty low maintenance. Once you have that food supply going, catch some fry & try feeding that. The difference in success rate with a change from processed to live foods will be like night and day. When I did this, my survival rate of my fry harvests was better than 90% with just a tiny amount of culls required (because before, they didn't have the energy / strength to fully complete metamorphosis, resulting in more deformeties.)

Growing phyto is pretty easy; I actually grow it outside under mostly indirect sunlight & grow it year round in the Dutch climate (very short winter days). And I've had better success & less overheads growing it outside, than when I used to grow it indoors. Just made a post reply about this yesterday.

Thanks!!
 
BRS

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