Perry's 90 Gallon SCA Acro Upgrade

[Perry]

Little update on chasing P04/N03/PH...
So in a 24 hour period, after dosing 10ml of Phosphorus, I finally got out of the dumps, lol. 0.04ppm P04 today. That said, I added another 7.5ml to the tank and will report back in another 24 hours. Thing is, I believe that the corals are not directly consuming, that bacteria, sand, and rock are. So, I am going to continue adding micro amounts of bacteria, micro bacter, and AF Pro Bio S. Again, not daily, not with a schedule, but sporadic additions based on tank, visably.
As of now, I have held alk stable at 7.92dkh for a few days dosing 20ml 2 part ESV, and 500 ml fully saturated kalk. Growth is booming! Color good. Learning is cool

 

[drawman]

Little update on chasing P04/N03/PH...
So in a 24 hour period, after dosing 10ml of Phosphorus, I finally got out of the dumps, lol. 0.04ppm P04 today. That said, I added another 7.5ml to the tank and will report back in another 24 hours. Thing is, I believe that the corals are not directly consuming, that bacteria, sand, and rock are. So, I am going to continue adding micro amounts of bacteria, micro bacter, and AF Pro Bio S. Again, not daily, not with a schedule, but sporadic additions based on tank, visably.
As of now, I have held alk stable at 7.92dkh for a few days dosing 20ml 2 part ESV, and 500 ml fully saturated kalk. Growth is booming! Color good. Learning is cool

It can be crazy. Someday you will wonder why you bought those bottles lol.

 

[Perry]

@drawman
Tim, as cool as heck as the little ora filefish is, I have been watching the little guy picking at acros, and a stylo. I have been wondering why my millis have been retracted during daylight hours, but full just before lights on. Little guy is in the sump, may donate, or put him in my lagoon. Always something, lol

 

[drawman]

@drawman
Tim, as cool as heck as the little ora filefish is, I have been watching the little guy picking at acros, and a stylo. I have been wondering why my millis have been retracted during daylight hours, but full just before lights on. Little guy is in the sump, may donate, or put him in my lagoon. Always something, lol

Shoot I was hoping you would have better luck than me! They're such a cool fish I just lived with it and the lack of a lot of coral. Now since I moved I reset the tank (with the same rock) I can see a couple aiptasia popping up and back to square one lol.

 

[Perry]

Little update:
FTS for June, added a couple montis, moved a ricordea/yuma rock to the right side to balance the bommie. Still dealing with some uglies, but think things are moving in the right direction.

 

[Perry]

Shoot I was hoping you would have better luck than me! They're such a cool fish I just lived with it and the lack of a lot of coral. Now since I moved I reset the tank (with the same rock) I can see a couple aiptasia popping up and back to square one lol.

Hi Tim,
Little guy in the lagoon, there WAS aptasia in there too, but lack of rock, and corals, already clearing aptasia out, if only on the bommie, it makes no sense, and my CBB is just a swimming spaz, doesn't seem to be picking or eating frozen, hmmm.....always something Don't feel bad, 10 peppermints, a CBB, and file fish, and it looks like aptasia x, is going to be the last resort. Kinda over it, lol
All the best

 

[drawman]

Hi Tim,
Little guy in the lagoon, there WAS aptasia in there too, but lack of rock, and corals, already clearing aptasia out, if only on the bommie, it makes no sense, and my CBB is just a swimming spaz, doesn't seem to be picking or eating frozen, hmmm.....always something Don't feel bad, 10 peppermints, a CBB, and file fish, and it looks like aptasia x, is going to be the last resort. Kinda over it, lol
All the best

I myself have a bottle of sodium hydroxide just waiting to fill up syringes with. I've never used it before so I'm stalling at the moment for safety's sake.

 

[Perry]

Update time
First off, I feel it's time to share some changes in running the system. In my 60 gallon, which is entirely in my 90 gallon system now, I didn't obsess on testing, but simply used observation, while running AF Probiotic System. Despite no P04, rocks were clean, corals colorful, and little algae. I just got out of the Dino situation, but did it different. I simply started the Probiotic program, and have patiently watched the dinos die. This has been a couple weeks, but went back to that video with Lou from TM, the one Scott passed along. I now believe all this P04 dosing was just fueling dinos, just my hunch. So, what's my P04 and N03? I don't know and don't care, unless I see something amiss, I don’t, coral growth and color are superb, especially given a white lit spectrum.
Next, I am seeing aptasia fading, I am seeing CBB finally picking, and peppermints as well. Still have plenty, lol. This week I scored 23 frags of zoa/paly's, all high end stuff, but for $150 bucks, from a local guy breaking down a tank. I have the names, but don't really care, just designed a garden on lower part of the bommie. Got the all glued down today, so hopefully soon I will get some pics up. That's about all for now

 

[GoVols]

Hey, Perry
The new build looks great.

Just caught your SPS forum thread.

Question:
If your running higher nutrients like 25ppm in nitrates would a Hamilton 6500k bulb be more likely to cause algae or cyano issues?

 

[Perry]

Hey, Perry
The new build looks great.

Just caught your SPS forum thread.

Question:
If your running higher nutrients like 25ppm in nitrates would a Hamilton 6500k bulb be more likely to cause algae or cyano issues?

Hi Freddie,
How are you, thank you for looking over the journal! So quite a bit to unpack here, so forgive my long-winded answer
My system, since settling in, is actually P04 and N03 limited. I have to get to the root cause, and have been dosing both P04 and N03 to yield a test result, Hanna and Salifert kits. Crazy as it seems, a sps reefers paradise, not... I believe my rock and sand have binded these nutrients, specifically P04, and as a result, nasties. All the while test kits showing nutrient poor conditions. Now, one would look to bacteria, and that's something likely amiss. I have discontinued carbon source for now, and am using micro bacter 7. Fortunately, despite ugliness, acros are flourishing, some zoas and cloves not so much.
When I began experiencing the nasties, I went back to 50/50 C+/ B+ t5 bulbs. Yes, the nasties do appreciate full spectrum. However, so do acros, and underneath all of this, PH is not close to where I prefer. I am drawing outside air to skimmer, dripping 600ml of fully saturated kalk, plus 20ml per day ESV 2-part. I recently decided to run fuge in middle sump, reverse photo period. I see a major response in sps for my efforts, but nasties still present. That said, I decided to purchase a uv setup, and soon will run this as a maintenance setup, but not full time.
Hopefully, this will kill the root cause/imbalance that looms. I don't want to freak out, or over react, so I decided to stop dosing anything but micro bacter 7, minerals, and natural foods. I believe my skimmer is a bit oversized, so perhaps later, I run it on an opposite schedule, that or create an air manifold and possibly drawing fresh air through an air pump, using air stone in sump...hmmm, lol
Again I don't want to freak out, so I turkey baste, toothbrush pumps and overflow, and still blast my acros with light, they are growing and coloring at a great pace. When I receive uv sterilizer, I will plan a 48 hour blackout, go live with uv, then introduce blue spectrum only, then over a couple days, ramp to full settings. Immediately after blackout, a 20% water change. My doser will be disabled, any corrections hand dosed with tight testing and monitoring.
As bad as it seems, which is really not that bad, I am pleased with my acros, it's just hard to relax and enjoy, when seeing some funk. There's been a lot going on, my indecisiveness with husbandry, and as a result, looming funk. So, post all of this, I will be using a fuge, and fish food, skimming, passive gac only. Again, I believe that PH is really the main objective here, and that I will chase. Skimming may become optional or not needed at all. Time will tell...
Cheers my friend!

 

[ScottB]

Morning Perry!

Do you have an ID on the "funk" and nasties? Are you dealing with dinos or something else?

 

[Perry]

Morning Perry!

Do you have an ID on the "funk" and nasties? Are you dealing with dinos or something else?

Scott,
Looming dinos, sprouting cyano, and some hair forming in sandbed. Again, not plague proportions, or I would run another Boyd's treatment, and blackout, but my acros are thriving, so I am letting things run their course, full spectrum, full feeds, and just routine maintenance. Been there done that, come to far to over react I stopped with N03 and P04 dosing, my eyes don't fool me, and what I see is like putting fertilizer on weeds, lol. Again, despite now at close to zero, the nasties are no worse, maybe a tad better without daily monitoring and dosing. It really is unpleasant to the eyes from a full view perspective, close up acro shots tell an entirely different story. Again, no reason to panic. I believe that my acros will ultimately win the nutrient battle, as I believe my sand and rock are releasing nutrients, despite test results. That said, my acros are not even close to starving, so it's a daily monitoring of each acro, looking for mesenterial filaments as a precursor of starving corals, not feeding response ones. PE, through the roof and mineral consumption increasing every few days, with adjustment to kalk dripping until I reach my dosing channel capacity of 999ml per day. Then I will increase ESV dosing. I am chalking this up to newness of the system, and believe the kinks will ultimately work themselves out. I will post good, bad, and obviously ugly here
All the best my friend, and that darn acro you named is getting big
Cheers Scott!

 

[Perry]

Oh, how about this for an update, @Anirban I may have just aquired a nearly long lost smoothie... ORA Dustins deepwater acro. I have now, in my possession a 1.5" single stalk, green base, purple surahonsi that is a dead ringer. Saw mother colony in person, and growth pattern near identical. 14 years and counting in search of, now, I need to find the German Blue Polyp Acro, lol.
How about a chalice pic to brighten up the mood here
CB Rainbow Showstopper Chalice

 

[ScottB]

I am chalking this up to newness of the system, and believe the kinks will ultimately work themselves out.

I hear you on that. My display has been super noisy for months after redoing the rock scape and pulling out all the overgrown monti, stylo, green slimer. I thought I could just thrown out some old vermetid covered rock and replace it with dead. It has been a series of nuisance cyano, dino, chryso and GHA since. In that order. Like you, nothing drastic and my acros have been cruising just fine. Just kind of meh to look at sometimes.

 

[Perry]

I hear you on that. My display has been super noisy for months after redoing the rock scape and pulling out all the overgrown monti, stylo, green slimer. I thought I could just thrown out some old vermetid covered rock and replace it with dead. It has been a series of nuisance cyano, dino, chryso and GHA since. In that order. Like you, nothing drastic and my acros have been cruising just fine. Just kind of meh to look at sometimes.

Yes sir, on the spot description
Mine is a "live sand" un-rinsed to begin this tank. Rock was already binding P04 before upgrading tank, so pretty much consistent. Having bubble algae, before all this, still tells me bound nutrients. They have to release, at what rate, not sure, but the water column, and test revealed means really nothing in my case, just leads me to make knee-jerk reactions. Now, if there was no bubble, dinos, cyano, or hair, and my sand was white, with no uglies, and P04 and N03 still zero, I might be concerned over acros starving. So, I look at this as a nutrient battle, and feel that once binded nutrients release, bacteria consumes before uglies, then giving acros full access, and hopefully starving all algaes. Putting the fuge online is probably my best bet, really pulling down nutrients, but in a way to focus algae nuisance there, as opposed to the DT. PH boosting is also crucial here, I believe it's the real sauce, so again, nutrients or tested levels mean little with algaes present

 

[ScottB]

Yes sir, on the spot description
Mine is a "live sand" un-rinsed to begin this tank. Rock was already binding P04 before upgrading tank, so pretty much consistent. Having bubble algae, before all this, still tells me bound nutrients. They have to release, at what rate, not sure, but the water column, and test revealed means really nothing in my case, just leads me to make knee-jerk reactions. Now, if there was no bubble, dinos, cyano, or hair, and my sand was white, with no uglies, and P04 and N03 still zero, I might be concerned over acros starving. So, I look at this as a nutrient battle, and feel that once binded nutrients release, bacteria consumes before uglies, then giving acros full access, and hopefully starving all algaes. Putting the fuge online is probably my best bet, really pulling down nutrients, but in a way to focus algae nuisance there, as opposed to the DT. PH boosting is also crucial here, I believe it's the real sauce, so again, nutrients or tested levels mean little with algaes present

Agree all points.

pH:
For my basement frag system the summer months (windows shut) I suffer from higher CO2 levels and end up dumping in 2400ml of kalkwasser from 8pm to 8am. I was still struggling to keep pH. At least I thought so. After explaining all my countermeasures to @SBB Corals (Shane), he was like "dude. recalibrate your probe. something is wrong."

So I dropped it in some 7.0 solution last Thursday and it read 6.75. Now that it is calibrated, I sleep better.

 

[drawman]

Scott,
Looming dinos, sprouting cyano, and some hair forming in sandbed. Again, not plague proportions, or I would run another Boyd's treatment, and blackout, but my acros are thriving, so I am letting things run their course, full spectrum, full feeds, and just routine maintenance. Been there done that, come to far to over react I stopped with N03 and P04 dosing, my eyes don't fool me, and what I see is like putting fertilizer on weeds, lol. Again, despite now at close to zero, the nasties are no worse, maybe a tad better without daily monitoring and dosing. It really is unpleasant to the eyes from a full view perspective, close up acro shots tell an entirely different story. Again, no reason to panic. I believe that my acros will ultimately win the nutrient battle, as I believe my sand and rock are releasing nutrients, despite test results. That said, my acros are not even close to starving, so it's a daily monitoring of each acro, looking for mesenterial filaments as a precursor of starving corals, not feeding response ones. PE, through the roof and mineral consumption increasing every few days, with adjustment to kalk dripping until I reach my dosing channel capacity of 999ml per day. Then I will increase ESV dosing. I am chalking this up to newness of the system, and believe the kinks will ultimately work themselves out. I will post good, bad, and obviously ugly here
All the best my friend, and that darn acro you named is getting big
Cheers Scott!

I hear you on that. My display has been super noisy for months after redoing the rock scape and pulling out all the overgrown monti, stylo, green slimer. I thought I could just thrown out some old vermetid covered rock and replace it with dead. It has been a series of nuisance cyano, dino, chryso and GHA since. In that order. Like you, nothing drastic and my acros have been cruising just fine. Just kind of meh to look at sometimes.

Real wisdom spoken here with you guys. It is so easy to overreact in these moments and send things into a tailspin.

My thought has been if I ever add new rock to the system I will throw it in the sump for 6-12 months to accumulate sponges, bacteria, etc. I'm sure it will still suck up PO4 so maybe I would throw it in a storage container with PO4 additions before adding it to the tank. To think I remember curing pukani rock with lanthanum chloride now I would do the opposite.

Perry where is you pH range at the moment? I've been waiting for a cheaper continuous dosing pump to come available so I can get my kalk going. Curious what are you using?

 

[Perry]

Real wisdom spoken here with you guys. It is so easy to overreact in these moments and send things into a tailspin.

My thought has been if I ever add new rock to the system I will throw it in the sump for 6-12 months to accumulate sponges, bacteria, etc. I'm sure it will still suck up PO4 so maybe I would throw it in a storage container with PO4 additions before adding it to the tank. To think I remember curing pukani rock with lanthanum chloride now I would do the opposite.

Perry where is you pH range at the moment? I've been waiting for a cheaper continuous dosing pump to come available so I can get my kalk going. Curious what are you using?

Tim,
Haven't calibrated probe, but have interesting findings with ph, that said, I am 7.7 @ low point, and 8.1 @ high point. Kalkwasser is on channel 1 of my bubble magus bmt-01 doser, @ 600ml per day, about 20% of total evaporation daily. Channel 2 ESV alk @20ml per day. Channel 3, @20ml per day as well. I will push kalk to 999ml per day, as that’s my dosers max daily, in terms of ml.
2 nights ago, I disabled skimmer, which draws fresh air, my low point shifted to 7.5, which is .2 when skimmer runs 24/7. I watch the ph monitor several times per day, making mental notes. Now, since reverse lit fuge went online, it is accounting for a .1 shift low point, from 7.6 to 7.7, and not much to grow in there, a few pieces of Caluerpa Mexicana, which are growing, and a couple pounds of rubble. I will be adding chaeto, and hopefully see an increase in my low point, which ultimately will raise my max point, really neat watching this. And for this experiment alone, not interested in blacking out tank, and losing momentum.

 

[Perry]

@drawman
I am also considering a continous peralstatic pump tied into a new ato system. This way I can drip at a slower rate, and utilize to full evaporation, this will likely be the answer to 8.3...

 

[Perry]

Here is a side shot of my fully recovered Fox Flame, if things were wompy for corals, you wouldn't see this

Edit: This coral goes downhill fast if you even look at it wrong