pH toooooo low!

Discussion in 'Reef Chemistry by Randy Holmes-Farley' started by d2mini, Feb 5, 2018.

  1. Want2BS8ed

    Want2BS8ed Active Member R2R Supporter

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    Shouldn't complain, we just hit our high for the day at 53 degrees... and I'm with you Dennis. Just got our gas bill in the mail yesterday and it's been a colder than normal winter here in Virginia.

    M
     
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  2. Brew12

    Brew12 Electrical Gru R2R Supporter Reef Squad Leader R2R Excellence Award Reef Tank 365 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor North Alabama Reef Club Partner Member 2018

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    I like doing that as a quick check.

    Of course, I'm still confused. The fact you are getting the right voltage spread tells me the probe itself likely isn't bad. I want to believe that the odds of both pH solutions being low is very unlikely. This leads me to believe that I have no idea what I should believe. ;Blackeye
     
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  3. FunkEngine

    FunkEngine Member

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    I have similar issues to OP, I get down to about 7.5 at night and top out anywhere from 7.7 to 7.9 during the day. At the time I was using kalk as my only supplement so I didn't even have the disadvantage of a calcium reactor pulling it lower. I know its a CO2 issue with my apartment as its sealed so tight that in 650sqft I have two (2) 50 pint dehumidifiers rated for almost 1000sqft each running on their lowest humidity setting, just to keep condensation off of the windows.

    I did the cup test as well and hit similar numbers for outside air, my probe was the one included with the 2016 apex and was about 11 months old at the time. I calibrated it a few times during these tests, and got within margin of error for each test. Opening windows in the warmer months helps, but it barely pushed it over 8 after days with the windows open, and that's not really an option when its in the single digits outside.

    I'm adding a small fuge, but I'm not holding my breath. Following along to see if OP is able to solve his problem.
     
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  4. GoVols

    GoVols "VFL" R2R Supporter Reef Squad R2R Excellence Award MTRCMember Reef Tank 365 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor Partner Member 2018

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    @FunkEngine

    FWIW???

    There's one reefer, on one of Randy's forums, that runs his cal reactor only at night, to help ph during lights out.
    He's got the reactor's solenoid and ph probe / timed out / and controlled by his Apex.
     
  5. d2mini

    d2mini Moderator Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Photo of the Month Award Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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  6. Randy Holmes-Farley

    Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Article Contributor Expert Contributor

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  7. GoVols

    GoVols "VFL" R2R Supporter Reef Squad R2R Excellence Award MTRCMember Reef Tank 365 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor Partner Member 2018

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    Last edited: Feb 9, 2018
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  8. Potatohead

    Potatohead Well-Known Member

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    Randy is it possible different brands of salt mix could have different pH levels if the salinity/alkalinity were equal? Basically I am asking if the salt d2 is using could largely be responsible for this problem.
     
  9. Brew12

    Brew12 Electrical Gru R2R Supporter Reef Squad Leader R2R Excellence Award Reef Tank 365 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor North Alabama Reef Club Partner Member 2018

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    Unfortunately, no. If you know the alkalinity you can calculate the CO2 content off of that. It won't change from salt mix to salt mix, other than that they mix to different alkalinity.
     
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  10. Randy Holmes-Farley

    Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Article Contributor Expert Contributor

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    As soon is the salt is mixed in air, it is the alk and the home air CO2 level that determines the pH, not the initial pH of the mix.
     
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  11. d2mini

    d2mini Moderator Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Photo of the Month Award Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    Old probe: 7.68
    New probe installed and calibrated 5 mins ago: 7.74
     
  12. GoVols

    GoVols "VFL" R2R Supporter Reef Squad R2R Excellence Award MTRCMember Reef Tank 365 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor Partner Member 2018

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    Different media's brands in cal reactors, melt at different ph melting points.

    Those man made media's for the Dastaco cal reactors has a real low ph melting point.

    Gotta give @2una a "thank you" for a heads up :rolleyes: on that one :)
     
  13. Scorpius

    Scorpius Valuable Member

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    The plot thickens.... Maybe?
     
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  14. Brew12

    Brew12 Electrical Gru R2R Supporter Reef Squad Leader R2R Excellence Award Reef Tank 365 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor North Alabama Reef Club Partner Member 2018

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    Unfortunately, I'm not surprised. The fact you had a 200mV spread on your calibration made me think replacing the probe wouldn't fix it. But, I also don't think your pH is actually that low. I've been reading through Profilux forums trying to see if I can find a similar issue. That outside water should have read 8.4ish.
    I just wish I could put my finger on what the problem actually is. :(

    Can you post your new calibration numbers?
     
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  15. rushbattle

    rushbattle Active Member R2R Supporter

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    I’m sure Randy will help (refute?) with this, but I think that you might have a grounding issue. Some sort of ground loop is interfering with accurate readings. It wouldn’t refute the theory, but you could try to ground the liquid that the probe gets moved to, to the tank water. Like a titanium wire between both bodies of water.

    Any thoughts?
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2018
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  16. GoVols

    GoVols "VFL" R2R Supporter Reef Squad R2R Excellence Award MTRCMember Reef Tank 365 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor Partner Member 2018

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    I don't know but @Brew12 is the wire grounding guru.

    Hopefully it's not a GHL software glitch.
     
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  17. 2una

    2una Active Member

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    Maybe the devils in the detail - Dennis vigorously circulating or just spinning? think the theory is its supposed to be aerated
     
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  18. d2mini

    d2mini Moderator Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Photo of the Month Award Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    Yeah, i was wondering about that too.

    This morning my ph is 7.69.
    So it is an improvement.
     
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  19. Brew12

    Brew12 Electrical Gru R2R Supporter Reef Squad Leader R2R Excellence Award Reef Tank 365 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor North Alabama Reef Club Partner Member 2018

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    I thought about that but I doubt it is the problem. That would explain why it could calibrate ok but still not read correctly. Where this falls apart is that it should have read the sample from outside correctly. The fact it does not correctly read a sample in a different container rules out any problem within the tank itself.
    Good point. But over 4 hours I would think that even with just a little circulating it would have come up more than it did. With an air pump you can do the test in 15 minutes.
    When you calibrated the new probe, did you retest it in the calibration fluids when you were done to verify they were correct?

    Anc can you post the calibration numbers for the new probe?
     
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  20. Shadowspop

    Shadowspop Active Member

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    I wish it was. I originally started with API, then bought a Salifert...same thing. Had a friend come over with his higher end test kit and got a slightly higher reading, but that was later in the day than my testing.
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2018
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