Quick help needed! Are these dinos?

[JaimeAdams]

 

[Lavey29]

I believe what he refers to is the Redfeild Ratio, which is actually 16 to 1. It's 106 Carbon to 16 NO3 to 1PO4. That is the phytoplankton biomass and nutrient pool found in the oceans in nature.

Folks say that if you run your tank with those ratios that you won't have issues with nuisance algae.

Thanks, I knew I had read it somewhere but could not recall the source. Maybe Randy mentioned something about the ratios on here previously.

 

[JaimeAdams]

Thanks, I knew I had read it somewhere but could not recall the source. Maybe Randy mentioned something about the ratios on here previously.

It's actually very old, 1934 is called the Redfield ratio because it was discovered by Alfred Redfield. Us reefers have speculated for several years that if we keep our little oceans in the same ratios as the big oceans that our little niche environment will be kept in balance. Most of the issues that is modern reefers deal with is lack of balance. Even with the OPs situation with dinoflagellates and people telling him/ he to increase Nitrate. It's not the NO3 doing anything. It is the NO3 feeding competing film algae and bacterium that are competing with the dinoflagellates for resources that is having the effect.

 

[Lavey29]

It's actually very old, 1934 is called the Redfield ratio because it was discovered by Alfred Redfield. Us reefers have speculated for several years that if we keep our little oceans in the same ratios as the big oceans that our little niche environment will be kept in balance. Most of the issues that is modern reefers deal with is lack of balance. Even with the OPs situation with dinoflagellates and people telling him/ he to increase Nitrate. It's not the NO3 doing anything. It is the NO3 feeding competing film algae and bacterium that are competing with the dinoflagellates for resources that is having the effect.

So true, do you dose different bacteria supplement to maintain levels or just let your tank develop and maintain its on biodiversity?

 

[AFHokie]

Start of dinos, yes. There's more than cutting lights to eradicate.

Prepare by starting with a water change and blow this stuff loose with a turkey baster and siphon up loose particles.
Turn lights off (at least white and run blue at 10-15% IF you have light dependant corals) for 5 days and at night dose 1ml of 3% hydrogen peroxide per 10 gallons for all 5 nights. If you dont have light dependent coral- turn all lights off.
During the day dose 1ml of liquid bacteria (such as bacter 7 or XLM) per 10 gallons.
Clean filters daily and DO NOT FEED CORAL FOODS OR ADD NOPOX as it is food for dinos.
Day 5,, you can start with blue lights - ramping up and work your white lights up slowly

Thanks for the plan, I’ll do that when I get home if it’s not magically gone. One question, what are light dependent corals? Aren’t all except for non-photosynthetics like gorgonians?

 

[vetteguy53081]

Start of dinos, yes. There's more than cutting lights to eradicate.

Thanks for the plan, I’ll do that when I get home if it’s not magically gone. One question, what are light dependent corals? Aren’t all except for non-photosynthetics like gorgonians?

Some coral can go a few days without light. Some SPS pout when there is lack of light.

 

[AFHokie]

Some coral can go a few days without light. Some SPS pout when there is lack of light.

Ah okay. Mostly zoas and LPS with just a few SPS frags.

 

[AFHokie]

Ok, now that we’re all set up and the camper is quiet I can give this some attention.
I’ve always seen that dinos come with the dreaded 0-0 so I felt comfortable with detectable nutrient levels. Obviously that wasn’t enough.
What struck me as the most shocking was how fast they appeared and how they seemed to target my coral. Perhaps they were everywhere else too but most obvious clung to a closed up, sad looking coral.

Besides a nutrient imbalance are there other common triggers? Yesterday I did a big siphoning job, filtering water through some socks and a good pump, powerhead, sponge clean (tank water). I realized that I hadn’t noticed my flow from my return was choked down quite a bit. The filter intake was pretty gunked up (it’s down in an AIO chamber so hard to see day to day). I presume the reduced flow could have helped contribute? I also recently added a bunch of frags and didn’t dip them (realize potential terrible mistake now). Could the dinos have come in on them?

Luckily I have a spare bottle of XLM that that Amazon accidentally sent instead of MicroBacter Clean. I am using clean weekly. Is that beneficial? Should I keep dosing or stop if I start this dino battle?

Thanks again to everyone for all the suggestions. R2R really is an awesome community.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Ok, now that we’re all set up and the camper is quiet I can give this some attention.
I’ve always seen that dinos come with the dreaded 0-0 so I felt comfortable with detectable nutrient levels. Obviously that wasn’t enough.
What struck me as the most shocking was how fast they appeared and how they seemed to target my coral. Perhaps they were everywhere else too but most obvious clung to a closed up, sad looking coral.

Besides a nutrient imbalance are there other common triggers? Yesterday I did a big siphoning job, filtering water through some socks and a good pump, powerhead, sponge clean (tank water). I realized that I hadn’t noticed my flow from my return was choked down quite a bit. The filter intake was pretty gunked up (it’s down in an AIO chamber so hard to see day to day). I presume the reduced flow could have helped contribute? I also recently added a bunch of frags and didn’t dip them (realize potential terrible mistake now). Could the dinos have come in on them?

Luckily I have a spare bottle of XLM that that Amazon accidentally sent instead of MicroBacter Clean. I am using clean weekly. Is that beneficial? Should I keep dosing or stop if I start this dino battle?

Thanks again to everyone for all the suggestions. R2R really is an awesome community.

They are photosynthetic and with adequate light will take off

 

[AFHokie]

They are photosynthetic and with adequate light will take off

My acclimation time is getting closer to ending so lights have been ramping up day by day. Coloration in a few corals has been amazing but clearly there’s a down side too. As far as PAR goes I’m hardly anywhere too high, 200-250 at the brightest, but maybe too much white? I’m running AB+.

 

[vetteguy53081]

My acclimation time is getting closer to ending so lights have been ramping up day by day. Coloration in a few corals has been amazing but clearly there’s a down side too. As far as PAR goes I’m hardly anywhere too high, 200-250 at the brightest, but maybe too much white? I’m running AB+.

White will be the enemy as well as any light from nearby windows if tank is at or near a window

 

[Lavey29]

Ok, now that we’re all set up and the camper is quiet I can give this some attention.
I’ve always seen that dinos come with the dreaded 0-0 so I felt comfortable with detectable nutrient levels. Obviously that wasn’t enough.
What struck me as the most shocking was how fast they appeared and how they seemed to target my coral. Perhaps they were everywhere else too but most obvious clung to a closed up, sad looking coral.

Besides a nutrient imbalance are there other common triggers? Yesterday I did a big siphoning job, filtering water through some socks and a good pump, powerhead, sponge clean (tank water). I realized that I hadn’t noticed my flow from my return was choked down quite a bit. The filter intake was pretty gunked up (it’s down in an AIO chamber so hard to see day to day). I presume the reduced flow could have helped contribute? I also recently added a bunch of frags and didn’t dip them (realize potential terrible mistake now). Could the dinos have come in on them?

Luckily I have a spare bottle of XLM that that Amazon accidentally sent instead of MicroBacter Clean. I am using clean weekly. Is that beneficial? Should I keep dosing or stop if I start this dino battle?

Thanks again to everyone for all the suggestions. R2R really is an awesome community.

Products like microbacter 7 and clean actually reduce nitrates and phosphate so you need to monitor or compensate for it because they have benefits to. I dose PNS probio .

 

[KStatefan]

I believe what he refers to is the Redfeild Ratio, which is actually 16 to 1. It's 106 Carbon to 16 NO3 to 1PO4. That is the phytoplankton biomass and nutrient pool found in the oceans in nature.

Folks say that if you run your tank with those ratios that you won't have issues with nuisance algae.

I still do not understand the math
@Lavey29 Talks about 14 Nitrate and 0.14 Phosphate being a 10:1 ratio
The chart you shared does not have those numbers but close 15 Nitrate an 0.15 Phosphate being a 153 ratio

 

[AFHokie]

Just got back home and it’s not a total disaster. Dinos have increased but not nearly as much as I think they would have if I left all the lights on at normal power.
I have some fresh water mixing up to do the change and start the peroxide and darkness treatment. I have start XLM….will that work for my day time bacteria dose?

Couple new pics to make sure it’s not actually something else.

 

[AFHokie]

Also, as for the day/night bac/H2O2 routine, is there a minimum time after ambient light/darkness to dose?

 

[AFHokie]

99% sure it’s Ostreopsis. Good news is that there is so little now that I could barely get a sample. Bad news is for ID purposes I have just this one pic.
On day two of @vetteguy53081’s recommendation back on the first page.
Question becomes what happens when I stop the blackout and H2O2? I see such mixed results on this. Some success some resurge in a week or two.

I didn’t have zero nutrients but it’s a young tank so biodiversity is definitely a concern. I will also stop using AB+ for a while as it probably helped feed the outbreak in the first place. I think I’ve also been slacking on my second feeding of frozen lately which might have pushed nutrients a bit lower.

I also plan on dosing P04 and NH3 if I can’t boost them just by feeding, but as they weren’t that low I wonder if that’s a good idea.

 

[saltyhog]

99% sure it’s Ostreopsis. Good news is that there is so little now that I could barely get a sample. Bad news is for ID purposes I have just this one pic.
On day two of @vetteguy53081’s recommendation back on the first page.
Question becomes what happens when I stop the blackout and H2O2? I see such mixed results on this. Some success some resurge in a week or two.

I didn’t have zero nutrients but it’s a young tank so biodiversity is definitely a concern. I will also stop using AB+ for a while as it probably helped feed the outbreak in the first place. I think I’ve also been slacking on my second feeding of frozen lately which might have pushed nutrients a bit lower.

I also plan on dosing P04 and NH3 if I can’t boost them just by feeding, but as they weren’t that low I wonder if that’s a good idea.

Yes, definitely Ostreopsis.

I'm not a fan of black outs at all. Usually they are just a temporary or cosmetic help and don't help alleviate the problem. They also stress corals that are already stressed by toxic dinos like Ostreopsis. Lastly, I've seen black outs result in encysting of the dinos which is likely why they usually are not a long term solution.

UV (1 watt/3 gallons of display volume, plumbed from and back to the display, flow through the UV 1-3 x the tank volume) is the treatment of choice. It usually results in rapid improvement. Run carbon for the toxicity. Keep NO3, PO4 in the 5-10, 0.06-0.12 range respectively. Anything you can do to promote biodiversity is also a good idea.

 

[Duncan62]

Naturally, right before I’m about to leave for a few days my tank gets a sudden invasion of something that is killing coral. This stuff started showing up a few days ago out of nowhere and I’ve likely lost a Birdsnest and digitata frag from it. No changes in routine and parameters have been stable.
We’re about to leave on a camping trip (within hours) and I fear I’m going to come back to lots of dead stuff. Do I cover the tank and let it black out while we are gone? I’ll be back in about 72 hours.

78F
1.026
KH:9.4
Ca: 415
Mg:1290
NO3: 5-10
PO4: .04

Just starting to come back after lights on so not the best pics but here’s what it looks like. Seems to just want to magnet to all my coral.

Looks like dinos. Just starting.

 

[AFHokie]

I’ve been doing the initial “treatment” recommended when I first posted and left for my trip.

I’ve been running reduced blue only lights, dosing XLM during the day at and H2O2 at night at 1ml/10gal, swapping filter foam, and siphoning any I see through a sock. Fortunately I haven’t seen much of anything to siphon since the second day.

Tonight I pulled one thin greenish string that was coming off of my almost dead Birdsnest. On that string I found a single moving ostreo and several nematodes. I then pulled a thicker, filamentous, green algae piece that was hanging off some rock. Found what appears maybe to be some ostreo that seems buried in the green algae. None of them were moving. The picture shows what I’m talking about. Are these ostreo? Are they alive? Dead? Being outcompeted by the other green algae?

Since starting this I’ve been pretty much reading nothing but dino threads. I understand that what I’ve been doing has very mixed results. I have some NeoPhos coming tomorrow and plan on getting a UV to cover all my bases. Luckily, I think I got it fast enough before it multiplied to crazy levels.

As I continue to think about what caused the bloom to begin with I think I might have stripped too much other life when I did a pretty thorough algae scrub and siphon. If I removed a lot of competition that would definitely give the dinos room to take over. My nutrients never hit zero as far as I know.