Reef2Reef Calculators

[UncommonSense]

A calculator for power consumption and cost for entire system.

This one might give the average reefer a bit of sticker shock! — It’s a good thing to highlight; encourage companies to make their products more power efficient, though!

 

[Tangdora]

That is calculable, yes. I agree it is interesting. I have done it for some articles. But it has limitations in that both temperature and salinity impact it as well, and it is beyond our capability to incorporate those. So it would need to be be for something like 35 ppt at 25 deg C.

Would be all for it at a fixed temp and salinity calc . Although if possible maybe calculating at 78 degrees which better falls into a temp range I think more people keep their tanks (according to polling) as opposed to 77. But 77 works to id change my range from 78-79 to 77-78 so that the stars align at one point to compare apples to apple

 

[VLJ]

Is there a way to create a map/calculator that can translate how much PAR or which ever unit best represents how much light is going to a certain depth of a tank.
- insert light make/model
-insert tank dims
-insert substrate
-slider to represent colour spectrum intensity

From there, you can to touch a part of the tank image and it tells you what the PAR reader would tell you. Essentially a virtual PAR reader. I think for the most part, it’s a mathematical equation unless there are variables I’m not aware of.

Perhaps BA can chime in on this one, as I recall he is quite educated with lighting.

For most of us, buying a PAR reader isn’t viable for the couple times we may use it. Most LFS don’t have one to rent. Not to mention the data we get from them, only gives a portion of the information needed to properly assess how much light intensity it at that spot.

Apologies if this exists already, but if it does, let’s get it in that same area as the others.

Thoughts?

I’m actually building something that tackles exactly this problem to some degree.

Right now the engine runs on the manufacturer PAR maps I’ve gathered, blended with an attenuation model for depth. It can’t account for every nuance (glass refraction, rock shadowing, surface agitation, etc.), but it’s surprisingly close for ball-parking how many lights you’ll need and where to hang them.

Im short on real world PAR readings to keep refining the model, so if anyone has data I’d love to incorporate it.

Let me know what breaks or what features you’d like next:

PAR Distribution Calculator

Cheers

 

[Ziggy17]

I’m actually building something that tackles exactly this problem to some degree.

Right now the engine runs on the manufacturer PAR maps I’ve gathered, blended with an attenuation model for depth. It can’t account for every nuance (glass refraction, rock shadowing, surface agitation, etc.), but it’s surprisingly close for ball-parking how many lights you’ll need and where to hang them.

Im short on real world PAR readings to keep refining the model, so if anyone has data I’d love to incorporate it.

Let me know what breaks or what features you’d like next:

PAR Distribution Calculator

Cheers

Very cool, and in-line with what the hobby should have.

What data sets would you be looking for to develop a more robust calculator? And what format would be easiest to import for you?

@BeanAnimal is this something we can all help build out?

 

[VLJ]

Very cool, and in-line with what the hobby should have.

What data sets would you be looking for to develop a more robust calculator? And what format would be easiest to import for you?

@BeanAnimal is this something we can all help build out?

Thanks for the kind words! Figuring out how many fixtures to buy and how high to hang them is the puzzle we all share!

What I’m looking for:

Mounting height
Distance from the bottom of the fixture to the PAR sensor.
Two or three heights (e.g 40 cm / 60 cm / 80 cm) lets the tool interpolate better.

Grid spacing
Any consistent step (5 cm, 10 cm, 15 cm, etc)

PAR matrix
A simple comma-separated block of numbers, starting at the back-left corner and moving row-by-row toward the front glass. Auto-correction applied (1.32 fac)

183,186,227,251,241,221,198,175
177,221,245,298,291,248,210,182
172,201,233,293,287,239,202,180
186,200,242,285,281,232,203,182
194,224,263,317,308,260,218,188
187,203,230,270,262,242,206,187

Row 1 = back of the tank. last row = front
Repeat the same grid for each mounting height you measure.

Fixture output details
Intensity (%) and, if possible, the preset/spectrum you used (AB+, Coral Grow, etc.). I can implement calculation so the tool shows 70 % instead of 100%.

As you can see, there are a lot of data points to capture at each mounting height. It’s a tedious job and not many people have the time (or a PAR meter) to do it. This is just the beginning of the project, so Im open to any ideas on how to streamline the process more efficiently. Suggestions very welcome!

Cheers

 

[fushi]

Rev has indicated we are going to put together some calculators of our own.

What calculators specifically would you like to see?

DIY recipes, there are a lot, but I think a lot of people really love the DIY information provided on R2R.

Alk (sodium hydroxide, sodium carbonate, sodium bicarbonate)
Calcium (anhydrous)
Magnesium

Nitrate (sodium nitrate)
Ammonia (ammonium bicarbonate)
Phosphate (TSP)

DIY Trace Elements
- Fluoride
- Boron
- Bromine
- Barium
- Molybdenum
- Nickel
- Vanadium
- Zinc
- Potassium
- Strontium
- Manganese
- Iron
- Cobalt
- Chromium
- Selenium
- Iodine
- Copper

I’m sure the sponsors don’t appreciate the DIY elements of R2R, but I believe the more organized and user-friendly DIY information, such as this, is beneficial for the hobby. Consequently, the major companies will be less inclined to continue promoting “black box” style chemicals in bottles and instead provide simple, transparent easy to use products for our tanks, making the hobby more accessible and increasing the success rates for new aquarists. Which will benefit them in the long run.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I agree the trace elements would be a useful calculator. My concern is how many different chemical forms there are for even a single one, and that folks may get confused about how to use it. I suppose if each one was accompanied by a set of written directions telling that it only applies to the exact form written and not similar sounding names, that could be ok. :)

 

[WhatCouldGoWrong71]

Rev has indicated we are going to put together some calculators of our own.

What calculators specifically would you like to see?

This is what I suggested initially:

I think calculators for alk, calcium and magnesium are a good plan for some commercial and diy materials.

I think trace elements are too specialized, but I think some nitrate and phosphate dosing calculators could be useful. James planted tank calculator gets a lot of use for this.

A salinity change calculator based on various scenarios such as replacing evaporated water with salt water or removing salt water and replacing with ro/di.

A water change calculator that was generic, but could apply to nitrate reduction would be useful. Could also be written to determine alk/calcium or whatever when doing a water change with different parameters than the tank.

Rev also mentioned a volume calculator (I assume this means tank volume from internal dimensions).

What else would you like to see?

What specific alk and calcium products would you most want to see?

I guess this is probably more my lack of organization. But, for example. Today I need to mix up ammonia, fluoride, sod bicarbonate & Hydroxide, and I need to look up No3 and Po4 as I am going to need that on tap for my new system soon. Is there a way to incorporate all the mixing formulas into this calculator? I’ve often thought about compiling them into a table. But, let’s revert back to my comment on organization. Is that possible? I love reading the entire thread the first time. But I’m always searching and what I have found is occasionally there is a recipe change. And sometimes the old formula could be in an old thread. Just a thought.

 

[fushi]

I agree the trace elements would be a useful calculator. My concern is how many different chemical forms there are for even a single one, and that folks may get confused about how to use it. I suppose if each one was accompanied by a set of written directions telling that it only applies to the exact form written and not similar sounding names, that could be ok. :)

Some people will get confused, but you can’t let that stop you from doing great things.

You have done a great job explaining your 2-part recipes on reefkeeping.com, so I’m sure your trace element directions will be clear enough for everyone to understand, and a “warning experimental” label at the top of the directions is more than fair to warn those who like to play loose with directions.

 

[Poboy Corals]

Rev has indicated we are going to put together some calculators of our own.

What calculators specifically would you like to see?

This is what I suggested initially:

I think calculators for alk, calcium and magnesium are a good plan for some commercial and diy materials.

I think trace elements are too specialized, but I think some nitrate and phosphate dosing calculators could be useful. James planted tank calculator gets a lot of use for this.

A salinity change calculator based on various scenarios such as replacing evaporated water with salt water or removing salt water and replacing with ro/di.

A water change calculator that was generic, but could apply to nitrate reduction would be useful. Could also be written to determine alk/calcium or whatever when doing a water change with different parameters than the tank.

Rev also mentioned a volume calculator (I assume this means tank volume from internal dimensions).

What else would you like to see?

What specific alk and calcium products would you most want to see?

Feeding specific per types of coral

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Feeding specific per types of coral

Sorry, I’m not sure what that means. Feeding what?

 

[Chuck_e]

Rev has indicated we are going to put together some calculators of our own.

What calculators specifically would you like to see?

This is what I suggested initially:

I think calculators for alk, calcium and magnesium are a good plan for some commercial and diy materials.

I think trace elements are too specialized, but I think some nitrate and phosphate dosing calculators could be useful. James planted tank calculator gets a lot of use for this.

A salinity change calculator based on various scenarios such as replacing evaporated water with salt water or removing salt water and replacing with ro/di.

A water change calculator that was generic, but could apply to nitrate reduction would be useful. Could also be written to determine alk/calcium or whatever when doing a water change with different parameters than the tank.

Rev also mentioned a volume calculator (I assume this means tank volume from internal dimensions).

What else would you like to see?

What specific alk and calcium products would you most want to see?

A bit late to the party - Brightwell A & B powders have instructions for mixing up a base solution that can be used for daily dosing, but I can't find the equivalent for their MagnesIon powder. All they have is their basic formula for mixing up one-time or daily doses based on a desired ppm increase of Mg. I'm guessing that I could mix up a saturated solution and then adjust the dosing amount accordingly, but some guidance on what that concentration should be would be helpful...

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

A bit late to the party - Brightwell A & B powders have instructions for mixing up a base solution that can be used for daily dosing, but I can't find the equivalent for their MagnesIon powder. All they have is their basic formula for mixing up one-time or daily doses based on a desired ppm increase of Mg. I'm guessing that I could mix up a saturated solution and then adjust the dosing amount accordingly, but some guidance on what that concentration should be would be helpful...

Well, I’m happy to try to give guidance as a chem question (saturation won’t work well and will be super concentrated) but if manufacturers don’t give data for products, we likely will not include it in a calculator unless the composition is clear (like kalkwasser powder).


That said, Brightwell gives guidance here, and if that is not helping you, I’d need to get more clarity on what you are asking.

Magnesion P

Concentrated powdered magnesium supplement for all marine fish & reef aquaria. Magnesium helps regulate the balance between calcium and carbonates. Provides aragonite, helping form skeletal material in corals. Made in the USA.

brightwelldirect.com

For example: If you determine that you need to raise the magnesium level in your 50 gallon aquarium by 10 mg/L or 10 ppm, you would add 10 x 50 / 64 or 7.8 grams or about 2.5 teaspoons of powder in as much water as it takes to fully dissolve (about 16 oz. per 2.5 grams or about 48 oz.) of water and mix until clear and cool. Then add that amount to your aquarium.

 

[Chuck_e]

Well, I’m happy to try to give guidance as a chem question (saturation won’t work well and will be super concentrated) but if manufacturers don’t give data for products, we likely will not include it in a calculator unless the composition is clear (like kalkwasser powder).


That said, Brightwell gives guidance here, and if that is not helping you, I’d need to get more clarity on what you are asking.

Magnesion P

Concentrated powdered magnesium supplement for all marine fish & reef aquaria. Magnesium helps regulate the balance between calcium and carbonates. Provides aragonite, helping form skeletal material in corals. Made in the USA.

brightwelldirect.com

For example: If you determine that you need to raise the magnesium level in your 50 gallon aquarium by 10 mg/L or 10 ppm, you would add 10 x 50 / 64 or 7.8 grams or about 2.5 teaspoons of powder in as much water as it takes to fully dissolve (about 16 oz. per 2.5 grams or about 48 oz.) of water and mix until clear and cool. Then add that amount to your aquarium.

Thanks for the response!

The volumes required by the MagnesIon-P recipes aren’t really manageable, and what I’m hoping to be able to do is to mix up a solution similar to the Magnesion liquid that I can then use for regular dosing. I’ve only ever looked at the MagnesIon-P technical page, and never thought to look at the liquid product so I hadn’t seen that technical sheet.

My system is, conveniently, 100 USG total volume, including the sump. Assuming that I’ve been able to adjust the Mg levels to where I want them, I get the following:
From the MagnesIon page, 1 ml will compensate for 26 ppm consumption.
From the MagnesIon-P page, I would need 40 g of powder in solution to compensate for the same 26 ppm consumption.
From your response above, it appears that I would need about 7.6 litres of water. But I know from experience that I can dissolve 120 g of powder in 800 ml of RODI water. Gotta go slow, and it definitely gets hot, but it all dissolves and eventually cools down. So, something doesn’t add up.

What am I missing???

 

[Isaac Alves]

Was this phosphate remover dosing calculator mentioned earlier? I’m sorry if it was but it’s been invaluable to me. Be nice to have a secondary version that maintains it for many years. :)

http://larryl.emailplus.org.user.fm/fish/dosing-instructions-phosphate-removers.html

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thanks for the response!

The volumes required by the MagnesIon-P recipes aren’t really manageable, and what I’m hoping to be able to do is to mix up a solution similar to the Magnesion liquid that I can then use for regular dosing. I’ve only ever looked at the MagnesIon-P technical page, and never thought to look at the liquid product so I hadn’t seen that technical sheet.

My system is, conveniently, 100 USG total volume, including the sump. Assuming that I’ve been able to adjust the Mg levels to where I want them, I get the following:
From the MagnesIon page, 1 ml will compensate for 26 ppm consumption.
From the MagnesIon-P page, I would need 40 g of powder in solution to compensate for the same 26 ppm consumption.
From your response above, it appears that I would need about 7.6 litres of water. But I know from experience that I can dissolve 120 g of powder in 800 ml of RODI water. Gotta go slow, and it definitely gets hot, but it all dissolves and eventually cools down. So, something doesn’t add up.

What am I missing???

You can make magnesium dosing solutions pretty concentrated, I’d just avoid saturation as that may have complications since it is not a single chemical in magnesium solutions.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Was this phosphate remover dosing calculator mentioned earlier? I’m sorry if it was but it’s been invaluable to me. Be nice to have a secondary version that maintains it for many years. :)

http://larryl.emailplus.org.user.fm/fish/dosing-instructions-phosphate-removers.html

I’m wary of using adding a calculation like that. It’s more of an estimate of the max possible drop, not an indication of the drop to expect (IMO).