Seachem Reef Builder - Mix a stock solution

[Parsec]

I recently got a dosing pump (finally), but I'm having a hard time finding out how much Reef Builder powder can be added to a mix stock solution. I'm going to be using a 2000ml container, but how much powder can I add to the container? Seachem website is not helpful at all (I don't care about how much I need to add of the solution to the tank, just how much powder I can add to my 2000ml container).

If someone has a ratio ml/gm or gallons/gm I can figure out the rest.

Thank You!

PS: RedSea makes this easy (but I have tons of Reef Builder I need to use):
KH/ALKALINITY
1 kg will make 10L of stock solution.

 

[P-Dub]

Check out their support forum...specifically...
http://www.seachem.com/support/foru.../2816-reef-builder-solution-for-a-dosing-pump

 

[Parsec]

Check out their support forum...specifically...
http://www.seachem.com/support/foru.../2816-reef-builder-solution-for-a-dosing-pump

I've been all over that forum, none of that is helpful, they keep referring to the same calculations on "your tank calcium usage" its also on the bucket of reef builder, but that has nothing to do with how much reef builder I can add to the stock solution.

 

[P-Dub]

Use 3 g (1/2 level teaspoon) per 150 L (40 gallons) twice a week. Dissolve in at least 250 mL (1 cup) of freshwater. Check alkalinity every 2 weeks and adjust amount or frequency accordingly. For precise dosing, use the Seachem Digital Spoon Scale.
Seems relatively straightforward to me. Use this as a starting point. Mix enough up so that the quantity listed above is used within that week. The doser that you use will be the thing that you are going the need to calculate how often and when to dose and how much to dose to use that amount over the week period. You will then adjust the concentrations based on your consumption - levels and calcium consumption - levels. There is no magic bullet calculations that will work for everyone. Your tank consumption will determine the ratios/concentrations you will need. The above is a good starting point. You can essentially mix up any concentration level you want to and then adjust the doser output based on your personal system consumption. For example, you can double the concentration that is listed above but then you will need to cut in half the doser schedule. All this is mute as you really will want to dose based on your consumption. It doesn't really matter what concentration you mix up in your 2 L doser so long as you dose based on consumption and calcium levels. This will be different for everyone. I think that there will come a point that the RO/DI will become saturated and no more product will be dissolved into solution, but other than that it should be relatively straightforward. Based on the information they provide you will be dissolving no more than the specified amount of product in the specified amount of RO/DI water. So, if I have 120 gal of system water, I will need 9 g of product, dosed twice a week, dissolved in no less than 1500 ml of RO/DI. I then adjust my doser to deliver this quantity over the week period and adjust based on tested Alk and Cal levels for subsequent doses.

 

[P-Dub]

So the simple answer is 0.15 g of product per gallon of system water or 15 g of product per 2000 ml dosing container... Simple, no?

 

[Parsec]

So the simple answer is 0.15 g of product per gallon of system water or 15 g of product per 2000 ml dosing container... Simple, no?

Thanks, yeah that's simple, 15 gm of product for 2000 ml dosing container, however that seems to little concentration no? As an example currently I'm using this product direct into the sump and I'm using 20g daily! (300 gallon system) So to dose even for a week I'd need something like 7 gallon dosing container just for alk. So I'd need much higher concentration.

Yes what I'm looking for is the maximum ratio of product to RO/DI water (something that will dissolve and will keep), as an example from the above link I found that for RedSea Alk that seems to be 1000gm per 10,000 ml (10L)

 

[P-Dub]

Thanks, yeah that's simple, 15 gm of product for 2000 ml dosing container, however that seems to little concentration no? As an example currently I'm using this product direct into the sump and I'm using 20g daily! (300 gallon system) So to dose even for a week I'd need something like 7 gallon dosing container just for alk. So I'd need much higher concentration.

Yes what I'm looking for is the maximum ratio of product to RO/DI water (something that will dissolve and will keep), as an example from the above link I found that for RedSea Alk that seems to be 1000gm per 10,000 ml (10L)

That is going to take some experimentation. Reading the instructions, "...dissolve in at least 250 ml of water" one would have to assume that that is the saturation point of the product. Send Seachem an email. Hopefully, they will answer. If they do let us all know.

 

[Parsec]

That is going to take some experimentation. Reading the instructions, "...dissolve in at least 250 ml of water" one would have to assume that that is the saturation point of the product. Send Seachem an email. Hopefully, they will answer. If they do let us all know.

yeah, I just don't understand why that number is not put out by Seachem and if it is 250 ml per 3gm product its basically unusable

 

[P-Dub]

yeah, I just don't understand why that number is not put out by Seachem and if it is 250 ml per 3gm product its basically unusable

Again, shoot them an email and find out. It could be something as simple as it being a solution that they believe you may be dosing all at once it is advised to dilute as such. This is all speculation unless you get it from the horses mouth.

 

[Parsec]

Again, shoot them an email and find out. It could be something as simple as it being a solution that they believe you may be dosing all at once it is advised to dilute as such. This is all speculation unless you get it from the horses mouth.

Got answer from them:

"Thank you for your email. The trouble you'll be running into here is that Reef Builder contains both a carbonate source and some calcium. This is perfectly fine when dissolved into the tank or briefly into water, but if dissolved into a stock solution and left to sit, the carbonate will react with the calcium and precipitate out of solution. That makes Reef Builder unsuited for most stock solution setups. As a substitution, we'd recommend Reef Buffer instead. You can dissolve about 30g in 1L of water, and 20 mL of this solution will raise the alkalinity of 40L by about 0.25 meq/L. We've had many reports of people able to dissolve much more Reef Buffer than this, but the likelihood of precipitation goes up with added buffer."

Sucks that they never mentioned this on the product! And calcium? wow that's not on the product at all! You'd think one should know what they are trying to put in the tank (adding calcium when you dont know about it is not good). In addition even Reef Buffer does not seem all that concentrated 30g per 1L? wow that's not good at all, I'd need a 30L ALK holding tank to last me any good time at all. The short answer is if you are looking for ALK for dosing solution for your dosing pump look else where. At this point I think I will go with RedSea ALK its 100g per 1L.

PS: I do appreciate Seachem's quick and in depth response!

 

[P-Dub]

Got answer from them:

"Thank you for your email. The trouble you'll be running into here is that Reef Builder contains both a carbonate source and some calcium. This is perfectly fine when dissolved into the tank or briefly into water, but if dissolved into a stock solution and left to sit, the carbonate will react with the calcium and precipitate out of solution. That makes Reef Builder unsuited for most stock solution setups. As a substitution, we'd recommend Reef Buffer instead. You can dissolve about 30g in 1L of water, and 20 mL of this solution will raise the alkalinity of 40L by about 0.25 meq/L. We've had many reports of people able to dissolve much more Reef Buffer than this, but the likelihood of precipitation goes up with added buffer."

Sucks that they never mentioned this on the product! And calcium? wow that's not on the product at all! You'd think one should know what they are trying to put in the tank (adding calcium when you dont know about it is not good). In addition even Reef Buffer does not seem all that concentrated 30g per 1L? wow that's not good at all, I'd need a 30L ALK holding tank to last me any good time at all. The short answer is if you are looking for ALK for dosing solution for your dosing pump look else where. At this point I think I will go with RedSea ALK its 100g per 1L.

PS: I do appreciate Seachem's quick and in depth response!

Well, we have our answer though not want we want to hear. I agree there should be complete disclosure of the product contents and the fact it is not suitable for longer-term storage and dosing solutions. Thank you for sharing their response, it is most helpful for everyone considering what supplements/additives and brands to use to suit their system needs.

 

[vongregor]

Holy crap. I've been using this stuff in my auto top off and wondering why it never fully dissolves. There shouldn't be any calcium in it based on what the package says. I'm going to stop using it except for manual adjustments.

 

[NormanB]

I realize this is an older thread, however this is exactly what I needed to know about Reef Builder and dosing.

Calcium is listed on the contents and have used it in my topoff water and it works for me.

I've asked Seachem about using Reef Carbonate in my dosing plan and waiting for a response. I'll try to remember to post it here just in case anyone else could use the information.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I realize this is an older thread, however this is exactly what I needed to know about Reef Builder and dosing.

Calcium is listed on the contents and have used it in my topoff water and it works for me.

I've asked Seachem about using Reef Carbonate in my dosing plan and waiting for a response. I'll try to remember to post it here just in case anyone else could use the information.

What do you want to know about Reef Carbonate? You can use it just as you would use any sodium bicarbonate or carbonate solution.

 

[NormanB]

Randy, I'm looking at reef carbonate as possibly the alk side of my stock dosing solution. I use Reef advantage calcium every other day and plan on using it as the ca side of automatic dosing.

Initially I had planned on using reef builder but seachem said it was not designed for the task of auto dosing. Above is the reply from seachem stating reef buffer is the product to use for stock solutions.

Than I came across reef carbonate and wondered if that might be a better product to use instead of Reef buffer.

Thanks

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I personally see no reason to use any Seachem buffers since I see no reason to think them better than baking soda or washing soda (sodium carbonate).

The Reef Carbonate is just a higher pH alk additive compared to Reef Buffer, meaning it has more carbonate and less bicarbonate. Most folks benefit from higher pH and for those people, I’d use the carbonate if you want to use a Seachem product.

 

[NormanB]

Thanks for your comments Randy.

 

[rapstarD]

I'm a brand new member, but have been reading many of the forums here. I have a 45 gallon mixed reef. I have had Calcium and Alk out of balance with Alk 8.6 - 9.0 and Calcium about 490 - 500. To keep Alk at 9 I have an automatic doser with a baking soda mixture that doses 8 times per day.
I currently do not dose any calcium due to testing calcium at 480 today. Mg tested at 1380 and salinity 1.025 -1.026

I'm hoping the guru Randy or other experienced members can help me understand the dosing process. Is it as simple as continuing my baking soda dosing and, when Calcium gets down to my target (425 or so) then I begin daily dosing both CA and Alk to maintain those levels? I keep reading different instructions that say to dose CA and Alk if only trying to correct Alk. That just doesn't make sense to me

Any help is greatly appreciated!!!!

 

[Neoalchemist]

Got answer from them:

"Thank you for your email. The trouble you'll be running into here is that Reef Builder contains both a carbonate source and some calcium. This is perfectly fine when dissolved into the tank or briefly into water, but if dissolved into a stock solution and left to sit, the carbonate will react with the calcium and precipitate out of solution. That makes Reef Builder unsuited for most stock solution setups. As a substitution, we'd recommend Reef Buffer instead. You can dissolve about 30g in 1L of water, and 20 mL of this solution will raise the alkalinity of 40L by about 0.25 meq/L. We've had many reports of people able to dissolve much more Reef Buffer than this, but the likelihood of precipitation goes up with added buffer."

Sucks that they never mentioned this on the product! And calcium? wow that's not on the product at all! You'd think one should know what they are trying to put in the tank (adding calcium when you dont know about it is not good). In addition even Reef Buffer does not seem all that concentrated 30g per 1L? wow that's not good at all, I'd need a 30L ALK holding tank to last me any good time at all. The short answer is if you are looking for ALK for dosing solution for your dosing pump look else where. At this point I think I will go with RedSea ALK its 100g per 1L.

PS: I do appreciate Seachem's quick and in depth response!

I know this is an old post. But wanted to thank you for doing the leg work here. Very helpful post!