Sugar Dosing

[FlipperFin]

What are your thoughts on this?

I have done this several times on a few different tanks with amazing results in nitrate and phosphate reduction.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I'm not a fan of sugar as opposed to other organic carbon sources, such as vinegar or vodka. I've just heard of more problems with it. In my case, it browned corals, although that was just a one time experiment. I prefer vinegar dosing in my aquarium.

 

[FlipperFin]

I had the same issue when i dosed to much at a time. It basically burns the corals. This would happen with any carbon source introduced in the wrong volumes.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Probably true, but with vinegar I had to dose far more carbon equivalent before I encountered any browning.

FWIW, I personally wouldn't use the term "burns" corals, but it certainly does spur the grow of the zoox, which is golden brown.

Have you tried any carbon source other than sugar? I don't recall hearing from anyone who found it, by itself, better than vodka and/or vinegar.

 

[FlipperFin]

I have tried both vodka and vinegar. Vodka is a SLOW process that took several months to level out nitrates and phosphates. Sugar dropped my nitrates to absolute zero in 3 days. Now keep in mind you dont generally want to sugar dose a tank over 2 years old. And yes carbon dosed my test tank and "Burned" my corals. I dont use that word lightly but that is what happend to them.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I have tried both vodka and vinegar. Vodka is a SLOW process that took several months to level out nitrates and phosphates. Sugar dropped my nitrates to absolute zero in 3 days. Now keep in mind you dont generally want to sugar dose a tank over 2 years old. And yes carbon dosed my test tank and "Burned" my corals. I dont use that word lightly but that is what happend to them.

Why do you think sugar isn't a good idea for a tank over 2 years old?

Can you describe what you mean by burned?

People relate "burnt tips" to something that happens when alkalinity is high and nutrients are very low, where the tips of SPS corals have issues. Perhaps you experienced something similar?

How much vodka were you dosing for those months and how much sugar took only 3 days?

FWIW, I think people often ramp the dosing of vodka unnecessarily slowly, but in general I'd expect that similar amounts of organic carbon to have very roughly similar effects in driving bacterial growth (which means very roughly similar amounts of nutrients removed).

VSV (vodka, sugar, vinegar) is a very common protocol for organic carbon dosing, but sugar alone is much less commonly used.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

FWIW, these are some of the experiences that sugar users have had (aside from my own) that make me shy away from sugar dosing relative to other forms. That is not to say that there are not people with problems from other organic carbon sources too, just seemingly more from sugar relative to the number of people who use it.

"Sugar was a problem for my lps, vodka and vinegar work well for me. "

"Anecdotally, sugar even in small amounts occasioned recission and darkening in a number of my lps , all three times I tried it. "

"Having dosed Sugar, Vodka, vinegar and combinations of the three I have found Vinegar the best source of carbon. Sugar created issues, not sure why. "

"Sugar dosing, in my experience with it, works amazingly well. However, it is not believed to be one of the better ways of carbon dosing. People, including myself, find that it may have some side effects such as cyano growth and a decrease in polyp extension with soft corals."

"I've been sugar dosing a 250g mixed reef, solely ramping up from a safe start at 0.5tsp sugar /day. I finally reached what I consider the optimal dose of 2tsp /day (just enough to cloud the water slightly at the end of the day). Unfortunately my RBTA and SPS really seem to dislike it, retracting their tentacles/polyps."

"my tank is 2 months old with medium load, I started sugar dosing 2 weeks ago, the tank is 80 gallons and I dose 1 tea spoon at night, I started seeing brown algae at the sand and live rock and I cannot tell the reason, "

"I found corals to be sensitive to sugar. When i tried with sugar, I found most of my corals and even clam started expelling their zoox within a week. I've been using Vodka for a while now without issue. I just started adding vinegar to the mix and it seems good so far but it's only been about 2 weeks"

"I have dosed sugar to control nitrate in my tank in the past. It did work to reduce nitrate, but the amount you use is very touchy and can be easily overdosed. I switched back to vinegar and see better coral growth results IMHO using vinegar. Vinegar also has a much more tolerant dosing level, where I was able to dose vinegar at quite high levels without any noticable problems in coral."

 

[FlipperFin]

So here is the deal. I looked back at my notes and I miss spoke about burning my corals from "Carbon" dosing. What happened is I did not properly acclimate a few corals to new lights and they died off. The only set back that i noticed from sugar to vodka was the time it took to drop nitrates and phosphates. I was dosing sugar 1/8th tsp per gallon. 3 days after the first dose my algae was literally GONE. very impressive.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So here is the deal. I looked back at my notes and I miss spoke about burning my corals from "Carbon" dosing. What happened is I did not properly acclimate a few corals to new lights and they died off. The only set back that i noticed from sugar to vodka was the time it took to drop nitrates and phosphates. I was dosing sugar 1/8th tsp per gallon. 3 days after the first dose my algae was literally GONE. very impressive.

FWIW, 1/8 teaspoon sugar per gallon is a very high dose and is probably why you saw the results so fast. That's equivalent to about 63 grams of sugar per 100 gallons, which very roughly translated to vodka would be about 156 mL per 100 gallons or 1.3 liters of vinegar per 100 gallons, which is really way above any dose I've heard of people using.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

FWIW, one BIG drawback of such a big dose is the potential to reduce O2.

The dose you gave has the potential to use up all of the O2 present in your tank many times over as bacteria use it to metabolize the sugar, so if you do this again, be sure to keep aeration as high as you can.

 

[FlipperFin]

I agree with that. If anyone doses anytime of carbon they need to make sure there protein skimmer is strong enough to handle the demand. I personally add an air stone in the sump while im dosing.

 

[jt17]

FWIW, @glennf uses a mixture of vinegar and sugar. I've never asked what blend or why both, but his results speak for themselves.

 

[Samandar]

Hi, I started recently using three part diy methods for tuning alkalinity and calcium in my 150 gallon tank. The question, is there any conflict between the mentioned method and veniger dosing?

 

[sanjay7]

Hey everyone I have 18g tank. I use natural seawater. I have heard about sugar dosing.i did Like quarter spoon.
I noticed foams in running more in skimmer.

I have hermit crab and dead rocks which is turning live. I have my fish to my cousin (not because of this)

Any advice? Please let me know

I gave

 

[Ashley Kekua]

I would like to hear GlennF talk to us about the method?

 

[Scrubber_steve]

I would like to hear GlennF talk to us about the method?

You hoo, @glennf

he uses a mixture of sugar & vinegar

 

[glennf]

IMO any carbon source is suitable and has it's (dis)advantages.
I found out that sugar/vinegar is working fine for me.

It's the concentrate, amounth, mixture and also the environmental circumstances which determine how effective you carbon source is.
To much my cause big problems like bacteria bloom , which use up all oxygen. Causing fish to die. Eventually killing your corals also.

To little is non effective.
The wrong mixture may cause side effects like brown/white slime, browning or even clogup plumbing

Most manufuctures have their own succesfull mixtures, some proven diy recipes do fine also. But always look at the tank of those why supply you with the recipes...

 

[Ashley Kekua]

IMO any carbon source is suitable and has it's (dis)advantages.
I found out that sugar/vinegar is working fine for me.

It's the concentrate, amounth, mixture and also the environmental circumstances which determine how effective you carbon source is.
To much my cause big problems like bacteria bloom , which use up all oxygen. Causing fish to die. Eventually killing your corals also.

To little is non effective.
The wrong mixture may cause side effects like brown/white slime, browning or even clogup plumbing

Most manufuctures have their own succesfull mixtures, some proven diy recipes do fine also. But always look at the tank of those why supply you with the recipes...

I like this!

 

[ramona]

IMO any carbon source is suitable and has it's (dis)advantages.
I found out that sugar/vinegar is working fine for me.

It's the concentrate, amounth, mixture and also the environmental circumstances which determine how effective you carbon source is.
To much my cause big problems like bacteria bloom , which use up all oxygen. Causing fish to die. Eventually killing your corals also.

To little is non effective.
The wrong mixture may cause side effects like brown/white slime, browning or even clogup plumbing

Most manufuctures have their own succesfull mixtures, some proven diy recipes do fine also. But always look at the tank of those why supply you with the recipes...

What is your recipe and how do you use it, If I may ask please?

 

[Ashley Kekua]

yes please to which i might educate myself glennf