Trident FAQ

[kkiel02]

I've yet to see confirmation that Trident will be able to automatically control 2, 3 or 4 part dosing. Can anyone confirm this? My understanding is that Trident / DOS will control a single alk solution only but could be wrong (I hope I am)...

I’m sure it could, same as alk. If the value drops below the specified number then the dos head for that would turn on until it’s within range.

 

[vhuang168]

I've yet to see confirmation that Trident will be able to automatically control 2, 3 or 4 part dosing. Can anyone confirm this? My understanding is that Trident / DOS will control a single alk solution only but could be wrong (I hope I am)...

Here is your confirmation.

The Apex will be able to use data from Trident to control dosing on the DOS.

 

[CMO]

Here is your confirmation.

The Apex will be able to use data from Trident to control dosing on the DOS.

In order for this to be usable for the average person IMO there will need to be built in dose spacing for multi-part dosing to prevent simultaneous dosing or dosing of solutions with insufficient rest between them. Many seem to think that a simple start time stagger is sufficient to prevent this but by my calculations it is not which is also confirmed by the very complicated code used by Tim Triton to ensure dose spacing. Here's a snippet. Really hope this get's built in to Trident / DOS wizards now or in the future so that the user can input a rest time between dosing solutions and have the schedule determined automatically.

 

[Act1n1c_L1fe]

In order for this to be usable for the average person IMO there will need to be built in dose spacing for multi-part dosing to prevent simultaneous dosing or dosing of solutions with insufficient rest between them. Many seem to think that a simple start time stagger is sufficient to prevent this but by my calculations it is not which is also confirmed by the very complicated code used by Tim Triton to ensure dose spacing. Here's a snippet. Really hope this get's built in to Trident / DOS wizards now or in the future so that the user can input a rest time between dosing solutions and have the schedule determined automatically.

What are you talking about? The dos already has a dosing Schedule with staggering and all that. You’d just need to connect the trident to the apex to communicate with each other. Calculations for how much dosing will be up to the user

 

[justingraham]

What are you talking about? The dos already has a dosing Schedule with staggering and all that. You’d just need to connect the trident to the apex to communicate with each other. Calculations for how much dosing will be up to the user

No it doesn’t

 

[justingraham]

What are you talking about? The dos already has a dosing Schedule with staggering and all that. You’d just need to connect the trident to the apex to communicate with each other. Calculations for how much dosing will be up to the user

I dose triton and I figured if I staggered the times by 15 mins that they wouldn’t overlap as u don’t want 1-2-3a or 3b dosing at the same time the only ones that can be dosed at the same time are the 3’s

I have an alk monitor already on the market and have my times for dosing set up to match my alk uptake that’s why I don’t dose at night

Any who doing it this way would most certainly make sure they wouldn’t dose at the same time but that’s false and there is no easy way to get around it

Between 8 and 8:06 all four fluids have been dosed two of them within a second

 

[CMO]

What are you talking about? The dos already has a dosing Schedule with staggering and all that. You’d just need to connect the trident to the apex to communicate with each other. Calculations for how much dosing will be up to the user

As @justingraham already mentioned it does not. You think Tim Triton is going through all this effort with custom code for fun when DOS already does it?

And while a start time stagger may work for a given dose, as you change the dose the required stagger to prevent simultaneous dosing also changes (which is not practical to calculate and update every time you change a dose). There is currently no easy way to do this with DOS aside from manual interval spacing that I know of (and I've followed and posted numerous threads on this exact topic with no easy solution identified).

 

[Joe Rice]

And while a start time stagger may work for a given dose, as you change the dose the required stagger to prevent simultaneous dosing also changes (which is not practical to calculate and update every time you change a dose).

I'm confused. I dose alkalinity on the even hours and and calcium on the odd hours. An hour in between seems like more than sufficient time to prevent overlap. What am I missing?

 

[ca1ore]

Directly controlling additives just seems like a really bad idea to me. Fraught with peril. It will be interesting to see how many people screw up their tanks.

 

[WillH]

If system has guards again quick adjustments or lets you set a min / max window per day of ml and 'learns' tank needs overtime to detect anomalies in dosing requests, it could be pretty safe...IMO.

 

[Terence]

Directly controlling additives just seems like a really bad idea to me. Fraught with peril. It will be interesting to see how many people screw up their tanks.

Autodosing is fraught with peril as it is. Especially with the many ways it is done outside of the apex.

Traveling across the sea and off the ends of the earth was fraught with peril.

If the Apex never lets you dose more than x% above or below what you already do now, and now+x% <> peril then all should be OK, right? And if you get to determine x?

We are leaning heavily on the side of safety with this.

 

[NeveSSL]

Everything is fraught with peril until it's figured out. I'm confident this is why they're taking their time to put it through its paces now with two rounds of NSI testing.

 

[NeveSSL]

...

Traveling across the sea and off the ends of the earth was fraught with peril.

....

Oh no! Terence is a flat earther! I'm out. ;Woot o_O

 

[CMO]

I'm confused. I dose alkalinity on the even hours and and calcium on the odd hours. An hour in between seems like more than sufficient time to prevent overlap. What am I missing?

So how do you update your intervals when dosing levels change? I do something similar with manual gaps but that requires 8 intervals (in my case) to be updated each time I change doses. The idea is that you would just set a single interval for each solution over the entire 24 hour period and via a wizard you could set the delay between solutions that DOS would then schedule accordingly to prevent overlapping doses.

With Tim's code you can update a single dosing data point (instead of 8 in my case or 24 in yours if I follow) and have it update all doses while preventing overlapping. It's just too complicated for most to feel comfortable using so I'm asking / recommending it be built into the wizards for DOS / Trident

 

[Terence]

I would just put my tubes in different areas of the sump if I saw any precipitation being an issue rather than over-complicate my life.

 

[Act1n1c_L1fe]

I would just put my tubes in different areas of the sump if I saw any precipitation being an issue rather than over-complicate my life.

+1

 

[Act1n1c_L1fe]

If you want to stagger, add intervals or add another dosing schedule ex. 1ml from 8-9 alk, 1ml 10-11 calcium, 1ml 12-1 alkalinity. It isn’t complicated...

 

[Act1n1c_L1fe]

Precipitation won’t be an issue if you have dosing lines in the right areas. I have mine dump right over my return pumps which goes straight into the tank. I also have calcium and alk dose 2 hours apart

 

[Act1n1c_L1fe]

I dose triton and I figured if I staggered the times by 15 mins that they wouldn’t overlap as u don’t want 1-2-3a or 3b dosing at the same time the only ones that can be dosed at the same time are the 3’s

I have an alk monitor already on the market and have my times for dosing set up to match my alk uptake that’s why I don’t dose at night

Any who doing it this way would most certainly make sure they wouldn’t dose at the same time but that’s false and there is no easy way to get around it

Between 8 and 8:06 all four fluids have been dosed two of them within a second

Choose different times for dosing. One from 1-2 one from 2:30-3:30, one from 4-5, one from 5:30-6:30...the length of dosing can be a tad longer too. .2 ml more per minute isn’t going to shock the tank tbh. When manual dosing, I would put all the alk in the tank at once.

 

[CMO]

If you want to stagger, add intervals or add another dosing schedule ex. 1ml from 8-9 alk, 1ml 10-11 calcium, 1ml 12-1 alkalinity. It isn’t complicated...

lol. why didn't we think of that :rolleyes:. You are pretty clearly missing the issues here.

Again. One of the key people with Triton are using custom complex code as posted above to solve this issue so it is real despite your trivializing. Adding intervals = more intervals to update which makes updating a real pain.