Trident - Hands on

[ShinerMaginer]

Thanks!
BTW, 150DT & Eshopps 300 sump w/ refugium. I've been slowly converting my mixed reef system to SPS dominant. 4 XL Colonies, 10 med colonies and 20 Acro frags. Along with several 100 (possibly 1000's of LPS heads.) Fully stock system

I was always under the impression that you should only dose CA at night and ALK during the day, but it seems like you guys have been doing it 24 hours a day. I just set up my Trident so I'm letting it run for a few days before doing the calibration. When you set up 2 part dosing with the above 24hr schedule, does it automatically know to not dose them at the same time?

 

[SuncrestReef]

I was always under the impression that you should only dose CA at night and ALK during the day, but it seems like you guys have been doing it 24 hours a day. I just set up my Trident so I'm letting it run for a few days before doing the calibration. When you set up 2 part dosing with the above 24hr schedule, does it automatically know to not dose them at the same time?

The DOS automatically decides how much and when to dose, but it does not make any effort to avoid dosing at the same time. To avoid precipitation, I simply use a small powerhead in the sump directly below my dosing tubes to create an area of high flow to disperse the liquids before they have a chance to precipitate. It works great.

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[MnFish1]

Actually, you do get swings throughout the day even without water changes or something 'bad' happening. It's due to higher consumption by corals when the lights are on vs off, in particular when the lighting is at peak levels. If you go back to the beginning of this thread, you can see my Trident readings when I was just dosing a standard amount throughout the day. The Trident shows up and down swings that correlate with the lighting schedule. After turning on Trident Controlled Dosing and adjusting my dosing schedule to increase the amount during the day, the swings reduced substantially. Here's one of those graphs:

Im curious - why was the alkalinity so low on May 15. If I look at May 17-18 - for example - it looks almost exactly the same as May 19-20. In any case - I would suggest (humbly) - that the 'swings' you're talking about are insignificant even from the 15th to the 18th. And - I'm not sure why you wouldn't use a 'stable' period for your 'control' - because clearly - the 3 days before the trident dosing seem to have a slowly climbing alk - which continues to a high on May 20th.

 

[MnFish1]

The DOS automatically decides how much and when to dose, but it does not make any effort to avoid dosing at the same time. To avoid precipitation, I simply use a small powerhead in the sump directly below my dosing tubes to create an area of high flow to disperse the liquids before they have a chance to precipitate. It works great.

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Small, high performance pump great for creating water movement in small aquariums and turtle tanks. Patented magnet-suction cup support makes position easy. The sphere joint and the flow control allow to direct water as necessary. PICO Evo-Mag 180 GPH, 4 Watts Small, high performance pump...

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couldn't you just separate the dosing tubes?

 

[ShinerMaginer]

couldn't you just separate the dosing tubes?

They are (on both mine and SuncrestReef’s from the pics), but my understanding was that 2 part shouldn’t be dosed within a couple mins of each other. I currently dose 12 hours of ALK, and 12 hours of CA, but I see that with Trident controlled dosing, it does both across 24 hours. I can’t find a thread with a failsafe, to make sure they don’t get dosed at the same time, which is why I asked the question.

 

[Radman73]

They are (on both mine and SuncrestReef’s from the pics), but my understanding was that 2 part shouldn’t be dosed within a couple mins of each other. I currently dose 12 hours of ALK, and 12 hours of CA, but I see that with Trident controlled dosing, it does both across 24 hours. I can’t find a thread with a failsafe, to make sure they don’t get dosed at the same time, which is why I asked the question.

If I remember correctly, the reason I set the run time of my alk and calf dosing 5 minutes off was because that caused it to always be be off from each other. My DOS is in the garage but I’ve been out there plenty of times when it’s dosed, and I’ve never seen both go at the same time, or near to the same time.

 

[MnFish1]

They are (on both mine and SuncrestReef’s from the pics), but my understanding was that 2 part shouldn’t be dosed within a couple mins of each other. I currently dose 12 hours of ALK, and 12 hours of CA, but I see that with Trident controlled dosing, it does both across 24 hours. I can’t find a thread with a failsafe, to make sure they don’t get dosed at the same time, which is why I asked the question.

My inpreaaion is that if they are spread apart. For example my soda ash is bear my filter socks and my cacl Is near the return pump in high flow areas it makes no differencw

 

[ca1ore]

I’m actually toying with getting a second DOS to dose alk/ca based on trident - something I swore I wouldn’t do. Even though my primary source of minerals is a CaRx I have to dose two part to offset the affects of a sulfur denitrator. Lately things have veered a bit out of balance. Alk is around 7.4 (8.4 on hanna) which is ok, if a tad low. Calcium has snuck up to 500 over the holidays (also 500 on hanna) which is too high.

 

[Radman73]

I’m actually toying with getting a second DOS to dose alk/ca based on trident - something I swore I wouldn’t do. Even though my primary source of minerals is a CaRx I have to dose two part to offset the affects of a sulfur denitrator. Lately things have veered a bit out of balance. Alk is around 7.4 (8.4 on hanna) which is ok, if a tad low. Calcium has snuck up to 500 over the holidays (also 500 on hanna) which is too high.

1st world tank problems lol!

I'd be more leery of letting the DOS adjust based off Trident results if I didn't work from home. Plus, it seems to have worked out fairly well for those who have tried it so far.

 

[SuncrestReef]

1st world tank problems lol!

I'd be more leery of letting the DOS adjust based off Trident results if I didn't work from home. Plus, it seems to have worked out fairly well for those who have tried it so far.

This seems to be a common misconception. The Trident will only increase or decrease the DOS amounts by the percentage you specify. It's not going to suddenly dump a gallon of 2-part if the Trident reading is low. My base amount is 100ml per day, and I allow the Trident to adjust that up or down by only 30%, so the most it would do in one day is 130ml and the least it would do is 70ml. If the Trident test results fall outside the bounds I specify, it simply reverts back to my base amount of 100ml and sends me an alert.

 

[Radman73]

This seems to be a common misconception. The Trident will only increase or decrease the DOS amounts by the percentage you specify. It's not going to suddenly dump a gallon of 2-part if the Trident reading is low. My base amount is 100ml per day, and I allow the Trident to adjust that up or down by only 30%, so the most it would do in one day is 130ml and the least it would do is 70ml. If the Trident test results fall outside the bounds I specify, it simply reverts back to my base amount of 100ml and sends me an alert.

Sorry, didn't mean to imply that it would. I'd read that there were limits that could be put in place, but I also remember much of the debate pre-release about how terrible of an idea it was to allow the Apex to automagically adjust the dosing amount.

 

[ShinerMaginer]

Sorry, didn't mean to imply that it would. I'd read that there were limits that could be put in place, but I also remember much of the debate pre-release about how terrible of an idea it was to allow the Apex to automagically adjust the dosing amount.

I’m wondering about the rule that 2 part should always be dosed in equal amounts. Does Trident keep track of that when it’s adjusting? Or is it chasing ALK and CA numbers separately?

 

[HMpops]

I’m wondering about the rule that 2 part should always be dosed in equal amounts. Does Trident keep track of that when it’s adjusting? Or is it chasing ALK and CA numbers separately?

The 'rule' of dosing equally is more of a guideline, and/or rule of thumb. Example, I use BRS 2-part (Soda Ash and Calcium Chloride). I mix the dry components with RO/DI myself. Thus, there is room for error on my part. Example, 2-1/2 cups per 1 gallon of RO/DI water. One time I might put in 2-3/8 cup...next time 2-5/8 cup. I eyeball using a measuring cup. Thus, my Alk and Calc dosing may need to be adjusted after I replenish my reservoirs.

And, as you put it 'is it chasing ALK and CA numbers separately?', yes it is.

Hope that made sense...

 

[HMpops]

 

[MnFish1]

The thing is there is rarely a reason to dose part 2 more that part 1. Is there a rule - no - no one will spank you. But - if you just consistently dose part 1 and part 2 equally - you will have no problem - and my guess is that - if you do - it will equalize in the end anyway. @Randy Holmes-Farley

 

[HMpops]

The thing is there is rarely a reason to dose part 2 more that part 1. Is there a rule - no - no one will spank you. But - if you just consistently dose part 1 and part 2 equally - you will have no problem - and my guess is that - if you do - it will equalize in the end anyway. @Randy Holmes-Farley

Although I agree with you, all things being equal, this thread is regarding the Trident. I was trying to explain 'why' it allows controlled dosing separately. I'm using the Trident to control dose and its doing a great job. I enter my desired 'dose amounts' equally, the Trident adjust to maintain my desired goals. As I stated in my earlier post, if you're mixing your own solution, and you're not perfect in your ratios, your Alk & Ca solutions may not be perfect...in fact they usally aren't. Hence causing the need to dos unequal liguids to get equal amounts of Alk & Ca (Soda Ash and Calcium Chloride)

 

[MnFish1]

Although I agree with you, all things being equal, this thread is regarding the Trident. I was trying to explain 'why' it allows controlled dosing separately. I'm using the Trident to control dose and its doing a great job. I enter my desired 'dose amounts' equally, the Trident adjust to maintain my desired goals. As I stated in my earlier post, if you're mixing your own solution, and you're not perfect in your ratios, your Alk & Ca solutions may not be perfect...in fact they usally aren't. Hence causing the need to dos unequal liguids to get equal amounts of Alk & Ca (Soda Ash and Calcium Chloride)

Sorry part of what I was asking 'with my reply' was 'why' you would want to do that

 

[HMpops]

Sorry part of what I was asking 'with my reply' was 'why' you would want to do that

 

[HMpops]

Trident Controlled Dosing

 

[pmiggy]

Hi All,
this is a great discussion! thanks to suncrestreef for starting it... i have a few questions
1) how tell the when the trident control dosing (TCD) kick in, rather than the normal dosing amount?
2) how soon after testing does the TCD start?
3) does anyone know the actual rules TCD uses?
4) has anyone seen case of an actual +30% or -30% ?
4) if i am out of reagent does the TCD stop and revert to normal dosing?'

thanks that it for now.