Tropic Marin Pro Trouble Mixing

[CheifReeferNB]

I recently mixed a batch of tropic Marin pro reef salt at a SG of 1.026. The alkalinity was shockingly low at 5.9 and in addition the calcium and magnesium were pretty high at 477 and 1660 respectively (all Hanna checkers). What may I have done wrong while mixing to get numbers like this or do I actually have a bad batch? I’ve never encountered something like this but this is my first time using TM Pro.

 

[painter1982]

Are you testing multiple samples?

 

[CheifReeferNB]

What are you using to do the tests?

Hanna checkers for the alkalinity, calcium and magnesium. Milwaukee digital refractometer for the salinity. The salinity was also verified with a standard refractometer.

 

[CheifReeferNB]

Are you testing multiple samples?

For alkalinity yes. Ranges from 5.4 to 6.6. Have not done repeat tests for the magnesium or calcium yet. Didn’t understand why’d they be so relatively high.

 

[EnterName]

It's not impossible to have a bad batch, but here are the first potential sources of error that come to my mind:

If the HannaChecker alkalinity reagent has been opened for a while it expires faster than its actual expiry date might suggest. This results in very low readings.

How long did you let everything dissolve until you performed the measurements, and is the mix already at least at room temperature (20°C/68°F)?

Do you have a different test kit available (e.g. Salifert, Tropic Marin, etc.) to double check?

 

[painter1982]

I use the same salt. I only check alkalinity so can say what calcium or magnesium might be. Alkalinity is normally 6.8 to 7 in all the boxes I’ve used.

 

[CheifReeferNB]

It's not impossible to have a bad batch, but here are the first potential sources of error that come to my mind:

If the HannaChecker alkalinity reagent has been opened for a while it expires faster than its actual expiry date might suggest. This results in very low readings.

How long did you let everything dissolve until you performed the measurements, and is the mix already at least at room temperature (20°C/68°F)?

Do you have a different test kit available (e.g. Salifert, Tropic Marin, etc.) to double check?

I had two different lots of Hanna reagent for alkalinity. One unopened one used. No difference in results. I mixed the salt in a 32 gallon brute at 76F and agitated with a spare mp40 for 20hrs before testing. Unfortunately I do not have any other tests in date to use but I will grab those when I get a chance.

 

[SocalReefer760]

this is why I stopped using tropic Marin and went back to Aquaforest. I hated having to test alk to see what it mixed to every time I changed water.

 

[reefrun]

Mine was 6.5 tonight.. starting to question if moving from RC was a good idea

 

[Euphyllia098]

I've probably been thru 50 boxes and have never had an issue.

I have seen high mg occasionally, but that has never seemed to hurt anything.

I'm willing to bet if you mixed up your bag it'll come out perfect. As much as they try to keep all of the compounds eveny mixed in the bag they can settle out from transport etc. I'd recommend rolling your bag around, turning it upside down etc to mix everything up good then make another batch.

As an aside settling is unavoidable in a dry mix, that's why people who are overly concerned about it only so mix the entire batch at once, aka of if they've got a 200 gallon box, they mix 200 gallons at once consuming the entire box. This ensures the consistency of the mix.

2 little fishes Accuracy comes in 50 gallon individual sacks. So if you buy a 200 gallon box it has 4, 50 gallon bags inside it with the intention that you'd make 50 gallons at a time.

The only other way to ensure consistency is to get liquid salt, but that requires the user to measure and mix more than one solution as all of the required elements in the saltwater cannot be stored in a liquid concentrated form together, so they need to be combined when mixed. You can get this type of salt from B ionic and I believe Captiv8 will also make it for you as well.

 

[rtparty]

Testing error on multiple fronts. Hanna Calcium and Magnesium are notoriously inaccurate and unreliable. The alkalinity reagent can be problematic as well

Salinity could be off. How are you calibrating the refractometer? Hopefully not with refractometer juice

 

[JonasRoman]

I recently mixed a batch of tropic Marin pro reef salt at a SG of 1.026. The alkalinity was shockingly low at 5.9 and in addition the calcium and magnesium were pretty high at 477 and 1660 respectively (all Hanna checkers). What may I have done wrong while mixing to get numbers like this or do I actually have a bad batch? I’ve never encountered something like this but this is my first time using TM Pro.

If this is an salt issue (probably as its very hard to do wrong when mixing salt), this is not first time issues with TM salts. I would reclamation the salt and ask for a refund. After maybe a tripple check with some manual titration tests which normaly are accurate enough to spot an issue like this.

 

[Euphyllia098]

If this is an salt issue (probably as its very hard to do wrong when mixing salt), this is not first time issues with TM salts. I would reclamation the salt and ask for a refund. After maybe a tripple check with some manual titration tests which normaly are accurate enough to spot an issue like this.

Why not mix up the bag? I've seen multiple times from others complaining of the same kind of things get good results from mixing the bag up and making a new batch?

 

[JonasRoman]

Why not mix up the bag? I've seen multiple times from others complaining of the same kind of things get good results from mixing the bag up and making a new batch?

Concerning mg,ca and kh, have you really seen that? Maybe from manufactures that not doing good mixing then? I do not think the 3 big ones can be settled so much. How? A salt mixture is quite rigid. In that case it's maybe not good mixing from main batch when they fill up the bucket, meaning it's not certain a post mixing will solve it. What i mean is that such findings indicates maybe bad handling from factory and hence not for sure you are that lucky so its restored just because you mix your own personal bucket that just is a fingerprint of a larger mixing bucket.

 

[Euphyllia098]

Concerning mg,ca and kh, have you really seen that? Maybe from manufactures that not doing good mixing then? I do not think the 3 big ones can be settled so much. How? A salt mixture is quite rigid. In that case it's maybe not good mixing from main batch when they fill up the bucket, meaning it's not certain a post mixing will solve it. What i mean is that such findings indicates maybe bad handling from factory and hence not for sure you are that lucky so its restored just because you mix your own personal bucket that just is a fingerprint of a larger mixing bucket.

Is this proof enough? Just happened last week. The op had really low dkh in their tank and traced it back to their salt mix. Mixed up the bag and it raised the KH by a full point.

Post in thread 'Alkalinity at 5.5 dKH ... should I care?' https://humble.fish/community/threads/alkalinity-at-5-5-dkh-should-i-care.24887/post-524873

 

[JonasRoman]

Why not mix up the bag? I've seen multiple times from others complaining of the same kind of things get good results from mixing the bag up and making a new batch?

Concerning mg,ca and kh, have you really seen that? Maybe from manufactures that not doing good mixing then? I do not think the 3 big ones can be settled so much. How? A salt mixture is quite rigid. In that case ura not good mixing from main batch when they fill up the bucket, meaning it's not certain a post mixing will solve it. What i mean is that such findings indicates maybe bad handling from factory and hence not for sure yiu are that lucky so its restored just because you mix your own personal bucket that just is a fingerprint of a larger mixing bucket.

Is this proof enough? Just happened last week. The op had really low dkh in their tank and traced it back to their salt mix. Mixed up the bag and it raised the KH by a full point.

Post in thread 'Alkalinity at 5.5 dKH ... should I care?' https://humble.fish/community/threads/alkalinity-at-5-5-dkh-should-i-care.24887/post-524873

What I mean is that 3 scenarios are possible 1) correct mixed batch but settled uneven in bucket. Shake will help 2) correct mixed batch but uneven when refill meaning shake bottle will never help
3) wrong mixed batch. Shaking will never help.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

How large of a fraction of a bag or bucket did you use to make the salt water?

 

[CheifReeferNB]

How large of a fraction of a bag or bucket did you use to make the salt water?

I have the 160-200 gallon bucket and I made a 25 gallon mix. First scoops from the bag.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I have the 160-200 gallon bucket and I made a 25 gallon mix. First scoops from the bag.

So then one significant possibility is settling of the salt mix ingredients in the bucket so it is no longer homogeneous.

 

[CheifReeferNB]

I have the 160-200 gallon bucket and I made a 25 gallon mix. First scoops from the bag.

So then one significant possibility is settling of the salt mix ingredients in the bucket so it is no longer homogeneous.

That seems to be the only thing I can change. Take the bag out and shake it then repour back into the bucket and retest. I’ll try that tonight.