Trying to not give up!

[racsoh]

Send out an ICP and confirm your parameters before tweaking.

I'm planning on it. Thanks

 

[racsoh]

Send out an ICP and confirm your parameters before tweaking.

I'm planning on it as my last line resource. Thanks!

 

[vetteguy53081]

I'm planning on it as my last line resource. Thanks!

Also, stretch out water changes to Bi-weekly If tank is stable and see if test results change. I also dont have confidence in trident readings as i do Hanna but comparisons are good
Are you using any Tap water at all for top off, mixing, etc or strictly RO water?

 

[racsoh]

I'm planning on it as my last line resource. Thanks!

Also, stretch out water changes to Bi-weekly If tank is stable and see if test results change. I also dont have confidence in trident readings as i do Hanna but comparisons are good
Are you using any Tap water at all for top off, mixing, etc or strictly RO water?

RODI for top off and mixing (never used tap water) and the Tropic Marin
High Precision Hydrometer to test the salinity salinity level and a calibrated Hydrometer. Thanks.

So far my Hannah and Trident results are pretty close, tho. I bought brand new Hanna reagents recently also.

 

[Maderan]

Yes its frustrating at times. I think that the secret is just to take it slow. I do think that you might be changing too much water too fast. I have a 60 gallon of LPS that I change water 10-15 gallons of water in per month. Its been running for year at this point though. You mention that you had a few issues and beat them. Did you use chemical treatments? I find that when I tried that early on I was fighting the tank instead of cultivating it. You want the bacteria biome and systems to do the heavy lifting on nutrient breakdown.

Without knowing your stocking or systems, I would say feed less and only frozen (as long as you don't have anthias or other high energy fish). Pellets are evil when it comes to high phosphates and I had to abandon them completely. You can feed every other day for a month or two and your fish will live just fine. Also, maybe set up a refugium or algae reactor. Both of those two changes helped me stabilize my tanks tremendously.

 

[tymo92]

I agree with the “take it slow” advice here but doubt 10% weekly water changes, or high phosphates, are main contributors to your torches and hammers dying,

You could have a bacterial issue going on especially if you are seeing recurring BJD on these corals. Did you start the tank with dry rock/sand by any chance?

 

[Maderan]

You are correct tymo. I was skimming and thought it said 100% water change.

 

[PPBlimpy]

Let it run. Do small water changes weekly or bi weekly if things are stable.

My 210g tank is currently sitting at .9 phos and 75 nitrate most the time. I have seen it as high as 1.26 phos. Corals still looked good but growth was slow. I got tired of chasing numbers and burning $$$ on chemicals.

Beefed up my nutrient export by redoing my refugium (more like chaeto tank), payed more attention to my skimmer and added a algea turf scrubber.
I started feeding a lot less and I run my lights for 13 hrs a day. This is for 2 reasons.

I have 6 tangs and a foxface that do nothing but graze all day. I let the tank grow as much algea as it wants because the it feeds the fish and uses up the nutrients. Also feeding less makes the fish graze more. so far its a win/win and my tangs are still fat.

I am not talking GHA or cyano etc. but just the regular algea that covers the glass and rocks. I also have a non existent clean up crew thanks to my porcupine puffer.

These couple changes have helped slowly bring down the phos. and the ATS is still new, only been online 2 weeks. So I don't think it has been doing much.

My tank crashed a 3 months ago, lost 90% of my corals and I have just left it alone Till adding the ATS recently.
I almost sold everything and moved on but my wife talked me down from that ledge. I did 10% water changes every 2 weeks, scrubbed the glass and cleaned the socks every other day for the past 3 months. things are trending down... just let it run.

Tank is looking much better and I am back to enjoying sitting in front of it. The break was a nice reset. Time to start adding corals back.

 

[Maderan]

You might also want to add a UV if it is a bacterial issue. Could help quite a bit.

 

[Staghorn]

More info on the tank would be good. As mentioned above the p04 levels are high. It would be good to find out what the source of the phosphate is, especially since your doing weekly water changes. Also, what mechanism are you currently employing to lower the prostate? Ideally cutting back the input and slowly lowering your existing level levels would be a good practice

 

[arcwaveaquatics]

Hi everyone,

I've been in the hobby for about a year and a few months, and I'm at a point that I feel like giving up a just throw the towel.

I've followed every single advice. Test my water every week to be sure that everything is in order. I've been doing my 10% water changes every single week and the system seems to be fine for a while just to crash again after a few weeks. At this point I've been through several crashes already and lost a ton of nice pieces.

The last crash was a cascade of events that I can't seem to put an end to it.

I had/have a phosphate spike that no matter what I do, PhosGuard, GFO, Phosphate-E, I can't seem to get under control, and the phosphate is measuring 0.58 ppm as I'm writing this post.

In addition about two weeks ago, I had a freaky accident with a power head that fell on my sandbend in the part of the tank where detritus accumulate the most and it is difficult to siphon out (the powerhead was on), so everything got blasted across the tank. Since then I lost A LOT, and I have a high nutrients imbalance that's also contributing to my Phosphate issue.

I'm honestly tired, and I'm no longer know what to do. I see all this beautiful systems and people talking about how beautiful and how many heads their hammers and torches have grown in a year, among other stuff and all I see in my system is death and decay.

I'm in love with my hammer corals and torches and I hate to keep losing them.

I'm I the only one facing this king of situations? Any advice is more than welcome.

The only thing I think I have left a full system reboot, but in all honesty, I don't even know what to do.

Here are values at the moment in case that help, both of my Tridents are calibrated and the values compared to my Hanna Checkers as well.

Thanks in advance

You’re definitely not the only one, and what you’re describing is something a lot of people hit around the 1–2 year mark. That’s usually when tanks get complex enough that chasing fixes starts doing more harm than good.

From what you wrote, the biggest issue isn’t phosphate at 0.58 by itself, it’s the repeated rapid corrections. PhosGuard, GFO, and liquid removers all work, but stacking them or adjusting aggressively can shock LPS, especially Euphyllia. Hammers and torches hate instability more than they hate elevated nutrients. A sudden drop in phosphate after a spike is often worse than leaving it elevated and letting it come down slowly.

The powerhead incident absolutely could have kicked off a cascade. Blasting old detritus releases organics and phosphate all at once, and then the system tries to rebalance. After that, every intervention compounds the swing. At that point, it’s very easy to get stuck in a loop of “fixing” things faster than the biology can respond.

A few important reframes that may help:
– Weekly testing and water changes aren’t a guarantee against crashes if the system is constantly being adjusted.
– Euphyllia losses are very often tied to chemistry swings, not neglect or poor husbandry.
– Comparing your tank to highlight reels online will drive you insane; you’re seeing results without seeing the setbacks.

If it were my tank, I would stop all phosphate removers temporarily, pick one export method only (light GFO or refugium, not both), and let phosphate drift down slowly over weeks, not days. Focus on consistency over numbers. As long as phosphate is trending down and not climbing, leave it alone. Also avoid any more sandbed disturbance for now.

A full reboot usually isn’t necessary unless there’s contamination or structural failure. Most tanks that “crash repeatedly” are actually suffering from instability, not bad fundamentals.

You’re not failing, and you’re not alone in this. Many very successful reefers have been exactly where you are and almost quit before things finally stabilized. If you want, posting your full parameters and equipment list would help people give more targeted advice, but even without that, nothing you’ve described is unrecoverable.

 

[Dom]

It is easy to become discouraged when your results don't reflect your effort.

That being said, I too was at a crossroad in the hobby, and I'm at it close to 20 years. My tanks were surviving but not thriving and was considering pulling the plug.

And here it is, 10 months later and I am still in the hobby.

I was fortunate enough to have a member here offer to mentor me. Things have improved. Currently, I am planning a new build.

 

[racsoh]

Hi everyone,

I've been in the hobby for about a year and a few months, and I'm at a point that I feel like giving up a just throw the towel.

I've followed every single advice. Test my water every week to be sure that everything is in order. I've been doing my 10% water changes every single week and the system seems to be fine for a while just to crash again after a few weeks. At this point I've been through several crashes already and lost a ton of nice pieces.

The last crash was a cascade of events that I can't seem to put an end to it.

I had/have a phosphate spike that no matter what I do, PhosGuard, GFO, Phosphate-E, I can't seem to get under control, and the phosphate is measuring 0.58 ppm as I'm writing this post.

In addition about two weeks ago, I had a freaky accident with a power head that fell on my sandbend in the part of the tank where detritus accumulate the most and it is difficult to siphon out (the powerhead was on), so everything got blasted across the tank. Since then I lost A LOT, and I have a high nutrients imbalance that's also contributing to my Phosphate issue.

I'm honestly tired, and I'm no longer know what to do. I see all this beautiful systems and people talking about how beautiful and how many heads their hammers and torches have grown in a year, among other stuff and all I see in my system is death and decay.

I'm in love with my hammer corals and torches and I hate to keep losing them.

I'm I the only one facing this king of situations? Any advice is more than welcome.

The only thing I think I have left a full system reboot, but in all honesty, I don't even know what to do.

Here are values at the moment in case that help, both of my Tridents are calibrated and the values compared to my Hanna Checkers as well.

Thanks in advance

You’re definitely not the only one, and what you’re describing is something a lot of people hit around the 1–2 year mark. That’s usually when tanks get complex enough that chasing fixes starts doing more harm than good.

From what you wrote, the biggest issue isn’t phosphate at 0.58 by itself, it’s the repeated rapid corrections. PhosGuard, GFO, and liquid removers all work, but stacking them or adjusting aggressively can shock LPS, especially Euphyllia. Hammers and torches hate instability more than they hate elevated nutrients. A sudden drop in phosphate after a spike is often worse than leaving it elevated and letting it come down slowly.

The powerhead incident absolutely could have kicked off a cascade. Blasting old detritus releases organics and phosphate all at once, and then the system tries to rebalance. After that, every intervention compounds the swing. At that point, it’s very easy to get stuck in a loop of “fixing” things faster than the biology can respond.

A few important reframes that may help:
– Weekly testing and water changes aren’t a guarantee against crashes if the system is constantly being adjusted.
– Euphyllia losses are very often tied to chemistry swings, not neglect or poor husbandry.
– Comparing your tank to highlight reels online will drive you insane; you’re seeing results without seeing the setbacks.

If it were my tank, I would stop all phosphate removers temporarily, pick one export method only (light GFO or refugium, not both), and let phosphate drift down slowly over weeks, not days. Focus on consistency over numbers. As long as phosphate is trending down and not climbing, leave it alone. Also avoid any more sandbed disturbance for now.

A full reboot usually isn’t necessary unless there’s contamination or structural failure. Most tanks that “crash repeatedly” are actually suffering from instability, not bad fundamentals.

You’re not failing, and you’re not alone in this. Many very successful reefers have been exactly where you are and almost quit before things finally stabilized. If you want, posting your full parameters and equipment list would help people give more targeted advice, but even without that, nothing you’ve described is unrecoverable.

Thanks a lot for your advice. I really appreciate it. I'll stick with one method of export and let it come down slowly.

 

[markushio40b]

Just like everyone’s said. Maybe just try and leave it be and let the tank work itself out. I too kept chasing numbers and every time I noticed pest algae or brown sand, I would be so quick to run to my lfs and buy everything they told me too. Rarely worked, and the only thing that really fixed it, was less water changes and just letting it run its course.

Right now my parameters are less than ideal in the eyes of most reefers. My nitrates sit around 70-80 and my phosphates are around 1.0-1.5 all other parameters are in line as far as PH, Alk, Mag, and Cal.

Have a mixed system and all leathers have grown double if not triple their size, all torches and hammers have grown 2-3 heads in 6 months, and even my sps have almost doubled in size. Even with just a single budget Amazon light that’s getting replaced next month.

Patience is not in my vocabulary, but with this hobby, it’s the only thing that works.

This is my third attempt at this hobby after velvet wiped out my first tank and brook killed all my fish in my new system and made me keep a fallow system for 4 months with just corals. It’s all about learning and being patient.

DONT GIVE UP!!!

 

[racsoh]

It is easy to become discouraged when your results don't reflect your effort.

That being said, I too was at a crossroad in the hobby, and I'm at it close to 20 years. My tanks were surviving but not thriving and was considering pulling the plug.

And here it is, 10 months later and I am still in the hobby.

I was fortunate enough to have a member here offer to mentor me. Things have improved. Currently, I am planning a new build.

Thanks for the encouraging words!

 

[racsoh]

Just like everyone’s said. Maybe just try and leave it be and let the tank work itself out. I too kept chasing numbers and every time I noticed pest algae or brown sand, I would be so quick to run to my lfs and buy everything they told me too. Rarely worked, and the only thing that really fixed it, was less water changes and just letting it run its course.

Right now my parameters are less than ideal in the eyes of most reefers. My nitrates sit around 70-80 and my phosphates are around 1.0-1.5 all other parameters are in line as far as PH, Alk, Mag, and Cal.

Have a mixed system and all leathers have grown double if not triple their size, all torches and hammers have grown 2-3 heads in 6 months, and even my sps have almost doubled in size. Even with just a single budget Amazon light that’s getting replaced next month.

Patience is not in my vocabulary, but with this hobby, it’s the only thing that works.

This is my third attempt at this hobby after velvet wiped out my first tank and brook killed all my fish in my new system and made me keep a fallow system for 4 months with just corals. It’s all about learning and being patient.

DONT GIVE UP!!!

Thanks a lot!

 

[Paleozoic_reefer]

I’ve been reefing for 11yrs (still a noob compared to some OGs on this forum) and I periodically get the “I think I’m done” attitude because of a minor/major set back. But that’s part of this hobby, unlike other hobbies that you build around what pleases YOU, reefing is almost is like finding pleasure in what pleases your tank and its biome. We all see amazing reefs on Insta, FB, YouTube and say “that’s what I want!” not realizing these tanks don’t look like this in the long term (I would love to see a pristine bare bottom tank filled with high end mixed corals that is healthy that is more than 5 years old) or that we don’t have the time/money to invest in achieving a tank of that caliber (like hedgedrew66’s). Reefing is like a rollercoaster; there will ups and downs, boring parts, stressful parts, and fun parts and the most frustrating part is that we often can’t control where those stages are in our journey! The key is to do your part, follow instructions, pay attention, and have a great time!

 

[BangingBaking]

Your params look fine , this might be a compatibility thing, or some “chemical warfare” in the tank that’s triggering a big BJD event.

With Euphyllia, even if they’re sold under the same name (hammer/torch/frogspawn), they can still be incompatible, a lot of it seems to come down to origin and subtle differences between colonies. I’d also consider a trace element issue, so sending an ICP test could help confirm if anything is drifting out of range.

I checked your thread from April (and your original build thread in October), and honestly, 80+ hammer frags in 6months in a 40g with dry rock start is pushing the system waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too fast.
That’s a massive coral load for a young tank, and once stress builds up (stability swings, trace imbalance, allelopathy), things can cascade quickly.

I started the same way , trying to “fill the gaps” with frags because waiting for growth felt too slow and wanted more instant gratification. It looked amazing for a short time, then I lost most of them to stinging/warfare (and I was mixing corals without really thinking through spacing/compatibility).

Went on a hiatus and just got back recently, and when I restart my reef, I’m setting one rule for myself:
Don’t fill gaps with frags, fill them with growth.

 

[The_Bro]

I had past experience with high Phosphates like yourself. Tried Everything GFO etc., Big water chances, and NO3 POX.
Nothing seemed to keep it at bay. So as mentioned I started looking for the source of the problem. Turned out the advice I got was vacuum my sand bed, blow off my rocks, and feed less.
Started with doing a daily turkey baster blow off, you would be amazed how much gunk accumulates in rock crevices.
My sandbed was disgusting below the surface when I actually vacuumed it.
Woohoo over time this solved my issue! So this has become my routine and never had the problem again.
Not sure if its something you currently do. Just wanted to share my experience.
Happy Reefing

 

[racsoh]

Yes its frustrating at times. I think that the secret is just to take it slow. I do think that you might be changing too much water too fast. I have a 60 gallon of LPS that I change water 10-15 gallons of water in per month. Its been running for year at this point though. You mention that you had a few issues and beat them. Did you use chemical treatments? I find that when I tried that early on I was fighting the tank instead of cultivating it. You want the bacteria biome and systems to do the heavy lifting on nutrient breakdown.

Without knowing your stocking or systems, I would say feed less and only frozen (as long as you don't have anthias or other high energy fish). Pellets are evil when it comes to high phosphates and I had to abandon them completely. You can feed every other day for a month or two and your fish will live just fine. Also, maybe set up a refugium or algae reactor. Both of those two changes helped me stabilize my tanks tremendously.

In the past I use only inverts and fish to help get rid off pests never chemicals except for now while fighting Phosphates.