Typical or a problem? Titanium heater mini shock

[chazman113]

So I got this new titanium heater, have it hooked up to an inkbird controller. Finnex 700w. Whenever it is on in my 125 gallon sump i get slightly shocked on my fingers, like someone is rubbing lime onto a cut. It does travel to my main tank and does the same thing a bit. I have a GFCI. Granted I am barefoot on a concrete slab so I'm grounding myself a bit. Is that typical or should I be concerned? I had one years ago and it did the same thing. I thought a good brand would possibly fix it.

 

[UncommonSense]

So I got this new titanium heater, have it hooked up to an inkbird controller. Finnex 700w. Whenever it is on in my 125 gallon sump i get slightly shocked on my fingers, like someone is rubbing lime onto a cut. It does travel to my main tank and does the same thing a bit. I have a GFCI. Granted I am barefoot on a concrete slab so I'm grounding myself a bit. Is that typical or should I be concerned? I had one years ago and it did the same thing. I thought a good brand would possibly fix it.

That’s concerning… finnex used to be a pretty solid brand…

— You should not be getting shocked by your tank, ever…

— being grounded while working on a saltwater tank is incredibly dangerous, as it gives high voltage a direct path to ground through your body! (Particularly if the concrete floor is wetted from a saltwater spill… use a submerged titanium grounding probe in-sump instead…)

— this heater should be unplugged and replaced/warrantied immediately…. Any time appreciable electrical current (different from stray voltage) gets in contact with saltwater, the electrical conductors themselves start experiencing rapid electrolytic corrosion, leeching large volumes of copper/etc into the water column…

(As an aside, I recommend testing that GFCI…)

 

[commod0re]

Do you have a grounding probe as well? Get one in there if you don’t - GFCI won’t help much without it

 

[UncommonSense]

GFCI won’t help much without it

Assuming it’s operational, and the current is sufficient… a GFCI should still trip without a grounding probe!

— The major difference being that you become the ground path which makes the GFCI trip…

No ground probe means your saltwater tank can be electrically energized in a major electrical fault, GFCI still supplying power… your energized electrical wiring/etc in contact with saltwater will be rapidly corroding heavy metals into the tank during this time… the GFCI would then only kill power to the tank once you touch the saltwater…



Adding a ground probe means the GFCI trips the moment a major electrical fault occurs, de-energizing that faulty device… (this is where using multiple GFCI protected outlets in parallel can become very helpful; maintaining partial life support even if some equipment malfunctions and one GFCI is tripped!)

 

[commod0re]

Adding a ground probe means the GFCI trips the moment a major electrical fault occurs, de-energizing that faulty device… (this is where using multiple GFCI protected outlets in parallel can become very helpful; maintaining partial life support even if some equipment malfunctions and one GFCI is tripped!)

I should have been more specific with my phrasing I guess, because this is the exact scenario I was referring to when I said that. A GFCI can still trip without a grounding probe, yes, but in that case it is not guaranteed to save you and your livestock from various forms of harm

If things can go wrong due to a fault that is not handled then the GFCI is not doing everything it could, i.e. its usefulness is unnecessarily decreased

 

[KrisReef]

Get a replacement heater.

Replacement reefers are hard to come by.

 

[Privateye]

It's not common with new submersible heaters, but these tiny shocks are a common feature as heaters fail.

If it's new, have it replaced under warranty. Personally I'd replace it either way.

GFCI can also be a double-edged sword depending on how sensitive it is, and how you have your equipment plugged in. If I left for a week and came back to a tiny shock, I'd prefer that to coming back and finding out all of my equipment was shut off for days.

Still, having been shocked by a broken UV sterilizer I would recommend using GFCI. Those ballasts produce really high voltage. All I know is I stuck my hand in the sump, and then I was laying on my back.

 

[chazman113]

So I guess there is induced current (right word?) that might not actually be "leaking" real voltage. I've found the same behavior with other heaters all running at once (when it gets to around 900w combined). The GFCI not tripping is interesting. Oddly, I tried a titanium ground probe previously and it made the problem worse. I never figured that out, I just returned them.

A couple extenuating circumstances for me:

It's in my garage, the floor is bare and I may be without shoes, the floor could be a little salty/wet

I work with my hands a lot and almost always have cuts of some sort.

I have a mini split in the garage but setting it to 76+ makes the.rkom mega hot, so I just need the heater to get those last few degrees and keep it consistent. I have 3 aqueon 300 pros but they do not work well. They stop running a lot even with the thermostat on them turned all the way up and the inkbird keeping them on. I guess the glass architecture makes it so they need to cool down a lot. This new titanium one keeps the temp way more consistent so don't want to abandon the idea.

I'm gonna see what premium aquatics says and hopefully I can RMA it and try again, but for now I'm going to put it on a switch so I can turn it off if I'm working.

 

[chazman113]

So I guess there is induced current (right word?) that might not actually be "leaking" real voltage. I've found the same behavior with other heaters all running at once (when it gets to around 900w combined). The GFCI not tripping is interesting. Oddly, I tried a titanium ground probe previously and it made the problem worse. I never figured that out, I just returned them.

A couple extenuating circumstances for me:

It's in my garage, the floor is bare and I may be without shoes, the floor could be a little salty/wet

I work with my hands a lot and almost always have cuts of some sort.

I have a mini split in the garage but setting it to 76+ makes the.rkom mega hot, so I just need the heater to get those last few degrees and keep it consistent. I have 3 aqueon 300 pros but they do not work well. They stop running a lot even with the thermostat on them turned all the way up and the inkbird keeping them on. I guess the glass architecture makes it so they need to cool down a lot. This new titanium one keeps the temp way more consistent so don't want to abandon the idea.

I'm gonna see what premium aquatics says and hopefully I can RMA it and try again, but for now I'm going to put it on a switch so I can turn it off if I'm working.

Also just to add I just experimented and dry floor, sandals on, no effect. No shoes and a little wet floor, can feel it a bit. Also oddly (I'm not an electrician).... It picks up 20 volts and .02amps when I use a tester and have it attached to a ground, when the heater is on, it reads zero volts and amps.... Maybe it's just the collective micro voltage of everything adding up in the tank.

 

[KStatefan]

It's in my garage, the floor is bare and I may be without shoes, the floor could be a little salty/wet

Don't. Get a pair of flip flops to leave out there

 

[chazman113]

It's in my garage, the floor is bare and I may be without shoes, the floor could be a little salty/wet

Don't. Get a pair of flip flops to leave out there

Yea agreed on that one. I do think I'm going to turn it off if I know things are gonna get wet and wild as well. (This is regardless of whether the company thinks an RMA is justified)

 

[chazman113]

It's not common with new submersible heaters, but these tiny shocks are a common feature as heaters fail.

If it's new, have it replaced under warranty. Personally I'd replace it either way.

GFCI can also be a double-edged sword depending on how sensitive it is, and how you have your equipment plugged in. If I left for a week and came back to a tiny shock, I'd prefer that to coming back and finding out all of my equipment was shut off for days.

Still, having been shocked by a broken UV sterilizer I would recommend using GFCI. Those ballasts produce really high voltage. All I know is I stuck my hand in the sump, and then I was laying on my back.

Have a sort of resolution on this, I was doing some installs and getting in there a lot. Still a little shock was annoying the crap out of me even when I installed a manual switch to turn the heater off when I'm working. I unplugged everything one at a time until the shocking stopped. Its the inkbird controller itsself! I have no idea why, I'm guessing the probes have a cut or hole somewhere. I'm going to buy something else and see if inkbird will send me a replacement.

 

[jabberkaycee]

I apologize for hijacking the thread, but I’m a little confused. I’m installing a new 90 gallon with sump. It’s going to be in my office which is carpeted and there is a basement underneath. I currently have an outlet that only has two other outlets on the same breaker controlling a lamp and a ceiling fan. Should I replace the outlet with a GFCI and/or add a grounding probe? I got a little lost here - lol.

 

[Freenow54]

So I got this new titanium heater, have it hooked up to an inkbird controller. Finnex 700w. Whenever it is on in my 125 gallon sump i get slightly shocked on my fingers, like someone is rubbing lime onto a cut. It does travel to my main tank and does the same thing a bit. I have a GFCI. Granted I am barefoot on a concrete slab so I'm grounding myself a bit. Is that typical or should I be concerned? I had one years ago and it did the same thing. I thought a good brand would possibly fix it.

Not typical at all. There is an issue . The GFI will not protect you as you are not part of its circuit. You are grounding yourself to earth ground and become a short circuit . I always say just turn off power to anything in the display by using a separate power bar so you don't disturb everything keep it simple. There are sometimes no warnings