Do you have a QT tank?

[kratosxxl]

I apologize if this comes off as harsh, but this prompt has a very distinct AI-generated format.

There has been an uptick in 'AI-slop' posts lately. I understand that AI has its purpose, but using it to restart a debate that has already been covered in countless existing threads makes this feel like engagement bait. There is no really no need to beat a dead horse.

I'm happy to eat my words if it turns out that you wrote this all yourself. It's just that this post has all the cliche hallmarks of AI writing.

what's the issue with AI reformatting and fixing typos ? It is great tool for someone who didnt went to school in US

 

[kratosxxl]

I don’t QT but I only purchase from sellers who do. My tank is small at 40 gal and I only have 6 not-too-expensive fish. I use a uv sterilizer and I use an acclimation box with new arrivals. My animals are not stressed and they eat 3-4x a day. When I first started the tank, I lost a couple of fish. One seemed to have lymphocystis on his head which kept him from eating. The other got popeye in both eyes and died. I suspect my tank wasn’t stable at that time. I’ve not seen ich nor velvet yet and no other diseases in many months.
I’m hoping the uv and general stress free environment will help. I don’t plan on any more fish at this time.

do you use Online retailers by any chance ? Can you share plz ? I cant setup QT due to space and lot of other things :) Anyone used Biota?

 

[kratosxxl]

I qt every fish, but I outsource it to more knowledgeable folks on what is needed for what fish. I get my qt fish from Dr Reef.

How long have you been using Dr Reef ? i heard lot of positive feedback about Dr Reef.

 

[exnisstech]

do you use Online retailers by any chance ? Can you share plz ? I cant setup QT due to space and lot of other things :) Anyone used Biota?

I have 3 biota yellow tangs that came in clean. There's no guarantee but I think the risk is lower buying from biota and skipping the fish hitting a middle man's system before yours. I have not used any online QT vendors.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I'm curious where everyone stands on quarantine tanks these days.

How many of you actually run a dedicated QT for every fish?

It seems like quarantine is one of the most debated topics in the hobby. Some hobbyists won't let a fish anywhere near their display without a full QT and prophylactic treatment, while others have had great success simply observing healthy fish, buying from trusted vendors, or accepting that diseases are part of maintaining a marine aquarium.

For those who quarantine:

• Do you medicate every fish prophylactically, or only treat if symptoms appear?
• What diseases are you treating for (ich, velvet, flukes, etc.)?
• Has QT saved your display from an outbreak?

For those who don't quarantine:

• Why not?
• Have you had good luck over the years, or have you dealt with major losses?
• Do you rely on observation, trusted sources, or another approach?

I've experienced both sides of the debate, and after dealing with disease in my own system it's made me rethink my process. I'm interested in hearing everyone's experiences—whether you're firmly pro-QT, against it, or somewhere in the middle.

Let's keep it respectful. There are a lot of successful reefers on both sides of this discussion, and I'm hoping to hear the reasoning behind different approaches rather than turn it into another "QT vs. no QT" argument.

I'll be honest, I haven't personally run a quarantine tank in the past.

I recently dealt with an ich outbreak that started with a dogface puffer. He had been at the shop for close to a month and looked perfectly healthy the entire time. However, on the day I brought him home, he first had to be moved to another system so the original system could be deep cleaned. Later that same day, I took him home and introduced him to my display.

My theory is that the combination of being moved twice in one day, along with some initial aggression from my tangs during the first hour or so after introduction, stressed him enough for ich to become apparent. My understanding is that ich is not something you can really quarantine for as it seems to be a stress related issue where it can develop if a fish is extremely stressed. To my understanding, there is no such thing as an ich free tank unless everything in the system has been through a full copper treatment including any rock, sand, corals, and invertebrates as all of them can carry it but unfortunately this isn't exactly possible.

My mom isn't convinced that's what happened and thinks the outbreak was caused by something else, so I'm curious what everyone else thinks.

Have any of you experienced a fish that appeared completely healthy for weeks, only to show signs of ich immediately after a particularly stressful move? Or do you think I'm connecting dots that aren't necessarily related?

I'm interested in hearing different perspectives because this experience has definitely gotten me into the QT process and the more medical side of the reefing hobby that I have not dwelled in very much.

Do you medicate every fish prophylactically, or only treat if symptoms appear?
All new fish are given a full prophylactic quarantine for common ectoparasites before adding them to any system housing existing fish. If different symptoms appear during that time, specialized treatment may be undertaken.

What diseases are you treating for (ich, velvet, flukes, etc.)?
The quarantine process that I use covers Cryptocaryon, Amyloodinium and flukes, as well as turbellarians. Additionally, the time spent in quarantine weeds out the difficult/impossible to treat issues like Coccidia and viruses.

Has QT saved your display from an outbreak?
Yes - without any doubt. None of my public aquarium systems have had ANY outbreaks of ectoparasites in the past decade.
The updated process I use is here:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/current-quarantine-protocol.825055/

 

[commod0re]

Do you medicate every fish prophylactically, or only treat if symptoms appear?
All new fish are given a full prophylactic quarantine for common ectoparasites before adding them to any system housing existing fish. If different symptoms appear during that time, specialized treatment may be undertaken.

What diseases are you treating for (ich, velvet, flukes, etc.)?
The quarantine process that I use covers Cryptocaryon, Amyloodinium and flukes, as well as turbellarians. Additionally, the time spent in quarantine weeds out the difficult/impossible to treat issues like Coccidia and viruses.

Has QT saved your display from an outbreak?
Yes - without any doubt. None of my public aquarium systems have had ANY outbreaks of ectoparasites in the past decade.
The updated process I use is here:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/current-quarantine-protocol.825055/

would you suggest/recommend using a UV sterilizer in addition to adhering to the quarantine protocol? not on the QT itself but the display tank. hopefully this question won’t start up the UV argument here too I only ask because I respect your expertise and would find your input valuable

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

would you suggest/recommend using a UV sterilizer in addition to adhering to the quarantine protocol? not on the QT itself but the display tank. hopefully this question won’t start up the UV argument here too lol

UV sterilizers are highly overrated for their ability to control active epizootics of protozoan or metazoan diseases. They do reduce free floating algae and bacteria fairly well.

Here is some text that I compiled on this topic:

UV sterilizers

Ultraviolet (UV) sterilizers are also sold as a “cure” for Cryptocaryon. The problem is that most hobbyist-sized UV sterilizers do not have the power to make an effective kill on the relatively large Cryptocaryon parasite. Additionally, UV sterilizers are effective only on the tomite/theront stage, as this is the only point where the parasite is even present in the water column.

For velvet, Amyloodinium, the fallacy here is that tomites/theronts must leave the fish. Actually, some of them may get caught up in the fish’s mucus and stay attached until they become infective trophonts again. For Cryptocaryon, the tomites/theronts do seem to need to leave the fish, but with side stream application of UV (where only a portion of water passes through the unit) DWELL TIME becomes the limiting factor. Only a portion of the theronts are killed before enough of them attach to the fish to continue the infection. This means that UV sterilization will not eliminate active Cryptocaryon infections from a single aquarium. Where it does have benefit is in eliminating tomites as they pass through a filtration system from one discrete tank to another (like in a public aquarium or fisheries lab). Decades ago, diatom filters were touted as cures for ich and velvet. The same issue applies with them; there are adherent forms of these protozoans that can continue to infect the fish without ever having to leave the fish’s body. Even if they do, the same “dwell time” factor means that some theronts will still be present in the water column to infect the fish.

A recent study (Ge-Ling, 2022) indicates that the UV dose required to kill Cryptocaryon theronts/tomites is 185,000 uw/S/cm2. They do go on however, to conclude: “ …both ozone and UV are ineffective in controlling infection within an individual aquarium because of the adhesive nature of C. irritans tomonts (Ma et al., 2017). Therefore, the focus on UV and ozone treatment should prevent live theronts flow into aquaculture ponds. Second, the tomonts are strongly resistant to UV or ozone than theronts, implying that recommended production doses cannot wholly kill tomonts….”

 

[cacas]

For velvet, Amyloodinium, the fallacy here is that tomites/theronts must leave the fish. Actually, some of them may get caught up in the fish’s mucus and stay attached until they become infective trophonts again

Hmmm... this is interesting. Does this mean that methods such as TTM do not work for velvet?

 

[Gregg @ ADP]

My reply is buried in the following thread somewhere.
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/w...at-others-think.1109461/page-37#post-14469276

No disrespect but this discussion is like

From my perspective.

I put more effort into that thread than I put into my job and marriage combined

 

[Bucrob]

I just had some stuff to take care of was all lol, don't really want to go into details but just didn't have the time to write the extent of information needed for an in depth conversation.

 

[Louis Z]

I won’t go into this anymore . Not trying to be rude . Do a search and you will find many threads on this topic already . Some extensive both ways . I am on the Qt, prophylaxis , HT- 2 to 3month observation path .

 

[fish_collector]

Good evening, this is everyone's favorite reefer here sitting safely behind my keyboard

I made a video an hour ago but it's taking a while to upload. It's meant for anyone who wants to watch it, and it might bring closure to some things.

Here you go, I'd appreciate some feedback.

fish_collector

 

[serval]

I don’t QT but I only purchase from sellers who do. My tank is small at 40 gal and I only have 6 not-too-expensive fish. I use a uv sterilizer and I use an acclimation box with new arrivals. My animals are not stressed and they eat 3-4x a day. When I first started the tank, I lost a couple of fish. One seemed to have lymphocystis on his head which kept him from eating. The other got popeye in both eyes and died. I suspect my tank wasn’t stable at that time. I’ve not seen ich nor velvet yet and no other diseases in many months.
I’m hoping the uv and general stress free environment will help. I don’t plan on any more fish at this time.

do you use Online retailers by any chance ? Can you share plz ? I cant setup QT due to space and lot of other things :) Anyone used Biota?

Yes I use online sellers as well as a local shop that I trust. The online ones I’ve used include High Tide Aquatics in Oakland, Marine Collectors, and Dr. Reef. Marine Collectors is more for sensitive, high end stuff like wrasse; they’re quite expensive but you will get a wonderful healthy fish. Dr. Reef has a large selection but not all is in stock at any given time so the wait can be long. High Tide posts the fish that are ready to go on their website each month.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Hmmm... this is interesting. Does this mean that methods such as TTM do not work for velvet?

Correct, TTM does not work for velvet unless you also include peroxide dips as part of the process. You can use 75 to 100 ppm 30 minute dips and move the fish to a sterile tank each time for three dips to help with that.

True velvet is pretty rare though, advanced ich is often mistaken for it.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

what's the issue with AI reformatting and fixing typos ? It is great tool for someone who didnt went to school in US

Nothing.

The concern Reef2Reef has with pure AI posts is that we want to foster person to person communication. Not person to AI communication.

For example, a formatting and typo correction is fine.

What is not fine is retyping a posted reef2reef question to an AI, then posting its answer here, which sometimes the actual poster doesn't even know to be true or not.

 

[kratosxxl]

Nothing.

The concern Reef2Reef has with pure AI posts is that we want to foster person to person communication. Not person to AI communication.

For example, a formatting and typo correction is fine.

What is not fine is retyping a posted reef2reef question to an AI, then posting its answer here, which sometimes the actual poster doesn't even know to be true or not.

that i agree , that crap need to stop. Do they do that to look cool and smart ??? Weird, why would one do that

 

[exnisstech]

Correct, TTM does not work for velvet unless you also include peroxide dips as part of the process. You can use 75 to 100 ppm 30 minute dips and move the fish to a sterile tank each time for three dips to help with that.

True velvet is pretty rare though, advanced ich is often mistaken for it.

I had velvet once (unconfirmed because I don't know how to do so) but within 2 days of adding the fish that brought it in I started having losses. I have no doubt I would have lost everything if I hadn't of moved them all into copper and I still had loses and only saved 3 tangs. As fast as it started killing in my tank I doubt anything would have survived if I had tried a drawn out method like TTM but maybe I'm wrong.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I had velvet once (unconfirmed because I don't know how to do so) but within 2 days of adding the fish that brought it in I started having losses. I have no doubt I would have lost everything if I hadn't of moved them all into copper and I still had loses and only saved 3 tangs. As fast as it started killing in my tank I doubt anything would have survived if I had tried a drawn out method like TTM but maybe I'm wrong.

Sounds like that was velvet. Sometimes even copper doesn’t work fast enough.

True velvet shows mostly as rapid onset of agonal breathing, not eating and sometimes the fish hovering in water flow. Rarely, at the end of an infection, you may see skin cloudiness.

People most often confuse it with end stage ich, where they missed the early symptoms.

 

[exnisstech]

Sounds like that was velvet. Sometimes even copper doesn’t work fast enough.

True velvet shows mostly as rapid onset of agonal breathing, not eating and sometimes the fish hovering in water flow. Rarely, at the end of an infection, you may see skin cloudiness.

People most often confuse it with end stage ich, where they missed the early symptoms.

Ya it happened really fast. All fish had been in for quite a while (years) and were fine until I brought in a emperor angel that I wasn't aware was being housed in 1.015 salinty and within 2 days fish started dropping the angel the first to go. I was going to let everything die and walk away but my Gal and Daughter shamed me into setting up a stock tank and starting treatment. I'm happy to say after 5 years those 3 tangs I managed to save are still under my care and two have now been in for over 9 and 10 years so a somewhat happy ending.

 

[vlangel]

Ya it happened really fast. All fish had been in for quite a while (years) and were fine until I brought in a emperor angel that I wasn't aware was being housed in 1.015 salinty and within 2 days fish started dropping the angel the first to go. I was going to let everything die and walk away but my Gal and Daughter shamed me into setting up a stock tank and starting treatment. I'm happy to say after 5 years those 3 tangs I managed to save are still under my care and two have now been in for over 9 and 10 years so a somewhat happy ending.

A very happy ending I would say.