★I am ALIVE★ (PLEASE READ) ★Tank almost ★Electrocuted★ me★ ( GFCI never Tripped ...MISSING GROUND PROBE) Passing on Lesson to All Reefers

[WallyB]

ANOTHER GFCI FACT: (Since June 2015, GFCI outlets Self Test Themselves)

I heard about this, so looked into it.
OLDER manufacturered GFCI's don't have this feature. Got an old year OLD, test it regularly, or replace it (Still test, but you have higher degree of confidence).

The one in the Video is a New Self Testing Kind.

ARTICLE:
https://kbelectricpa.com/self-test-gfci-receptacle-what-is-it/

What Is A Self-Test GFCI Receptacle?
A self-test GFCI receptacle is a receptacle that regularly tests the ground fault circuit interrupter function by itself, and then cuts off the power to that receptacle when the ground fault circuit interrupter function fails. The UL (Underwriters Laboratories) made it a requirement that all manufacturers of GFCI receptacles make them self-testing after June 28, 2015 in order for them to be UL listed. This is a pretty cool concept because most people don’t test their regular GFCIs often, or even at all. When a regular GFCI receptacle isn’t tested by the end user (you, Aunt Suzy, mom, dad, your daughter, Uncle Fred, etc.) for the ground fault circuit interrupter function, it may not be doing it’s job correctly, and could cause electrical shock. The solution for the people in the world who don’t set reminders on their iPhones to check all of the GFCI receptacles throughout their homes on a monthly basis to ensure proper shock prevention (enter drumroll here): A SELF-TEST GFCI RECEPTACLE!!! Note: it’s still not a bad idea to manually test a self-testing GFCI receptacle. The name brands that manufacture them still recommend it.

 

[WallyB]

Here is the GFCI vs GFCI+Ground Probe TEST VIDEO.

Pardon the Sound quality, the Original Recording Sounds better than the Compress YouTube Video.



I've never done voice narrated video before, so pardon the Rookie "Non-News-Achor" Narration.

 

[finding paulo]

I will say that I won't run my system off of a single GFCI. My return pump and power heads are always off separate GFCI's. My display would be fine for 12hr+ with either of them tripped. If I lost everything it would deteriorate much more quickly.

if I install a Gfci and plug my eb32 power bar from Neptune’s and all my electrical a on the power bar does that mean everything on the power bar if gfci’d?

also if I were do install a gfCI and buy a groud plug do I plug the ground plug in the gfci outlet?

 

[WallyB]

if I install a Gfci and plug my eb32 power bar from Neptune’s and all my electrical a on the power bar does that mean everything on the power bar if gfci’d?

also if I were do install a gfCI and buy a groud plug do I plug the ground plug in the gfci outlet?

YOUR FIRST QUESTION (about Eb32 plugged into GFCI?)

I would like to say yes (you have full protection), since I use the older EB8's and everything on GFCI works.
Last night when I had the failure, the device that failed was on my Neptune Apex Jr. OUtlet (so similar).

Technically a Eb32 is a Power bar. The ground is Ground-IN, Ground-OUT.

-> The Eb32 will cut off power (by breaker) if there is too much current. (That is not the same as GFCI).
-> The EB32 will work to provide (smart switched power) to your Devices off the eb32.

THE GFCI, passes thru Power and provides GROUND as well.
So everything off of it will be protected.

JUST BE CAREFUL. If you have more things to power in your tank setup, that are not powered off Eb32, then they MUSTalso be plugged into the GFCI outlet. Same GFCI, or another GFCI.

Or even a "power bar" pluged into EB32 (I have two heaters thru a splitter that run off one EB-outlet)
But the more you daisy chain the less things become perfectly reliable (should something in the chain not work properly).

ONE THING FOR SURE: You cannot mix and match GFCI power and non-GFCI power to you tank,sump,etc if you want full protection.
If you have a failure, the GFCI stuff will shut down, but the Normal outlet will continue giving power and shock you.

Here is a link where someone asked Neptune Systesms.

Question: GFCI Question

Guys, Does the EB8 provide GFCI protection or do I need to plug in the EB8 into a GFCI protected outlet? The reason I asked is, currently I have it plugged into an GFCI outlet that was tripped by one of the equipments (for the right reason). This, however, cut off power to all outlets on the...

forum.neptunesystems.com

Notice Neptune didn't reply when asked a 2nd time.

I wonder why they didn't answer? (with a FIRM yes).
It should work, but there could be ways that it doesn't and they don't want to be liable.
So I would ask Neptune. Since I can't speak on behalf of them and internals of thh Eb32 design/parts.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

YOUR 2nd QUESTION (about Where to plug in the Ground PROBE)

The GFCI outlet is the best place to get a GROUND, but it doesn't have to be the GFCI outlet since you will have to use up one of the two outlets.
Just pick a spot you won't disconnect that Ground probe (by mistake).
For example Don't use an extension cord, unless it's firmly attached to never be unplugged by mistake (not knowing there is a Ground probe at other end)

Or don't use a power bar you might unplug to borrow. If a power bar, label it (DO NOT UNPLUG) and label your (Ground Probe also (don not unplug)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That's come back to your first question.

If you need more outlets than on the eb32, plugged into the GFCI, and you use up the 2nd Outlet on the GFCI, then where are you going to plug in the other stuff? (they must be on a GFCI protected outlet)

So maybe plug in eb32 into one of the GFCI outlets. The 2nd GFCI outlet is used for powerbar, and then Ground Probe into Powerbar. (Just it better be a good power bar, UL Certified and NOT some Dollar Store cheapo from China).

 

[finding paulo]

YOUR FIRST QUESTION (about Eb32 plugged into GFCI?)

I would like to say yes (you have full protection), since I use the older EB8's and everything on GFCI works.
Last night when I had the failure, the device that failed was on my Neptune Apex Jr. OUtlet (so similar).

Technically a Eb32 is a Power bar. The ground is Ground-IN, Ground-OUT.

-> The Eb32 will cut off power (by breaker) if there is too much current. (That is not the same as GFCI).
-> The EB32 will work to provide (smart switched power) to your Devices off the eb32.

THE GFCI, passes thru Power and provides GROUND as well.
So everything off of it will be protected.

JUST BE CAREFUL. If you have more things to power in your tank setup, that are not powered off Eb32, then they MUSTalso be plugged into the GFCI outlet. Same GFCI, or another GFCI. Or even a power bar off EB32.
But the more you daisy chain the less things become perfectly reliable (should something in the chain not work properly).

ONE THING FOR SURE: You cannot mix and match GFCI power and non-GFCI power to you tank,sump,etc if you want full protection.
If you have a failure, the GFCI stuff will shut down, but the Normal outlet will continue giving power and shock you.

Here is a link where someone asked Neptune Systesms.

Question: GFCI Question

Guys, Does the EB8 provide GFCI protection or do I need to plug in the EB8 into a GFCI protected outlet? The reason I asked is, currently I have it plugged into an GFCI outlet that was tripped by one of the equipments (for the right reason). This, however, cut off power to all outlets on the...

forum.neptunesystems.com

Notice Neptune didn't reply when asked a 2nd time.

I wonder why they didn't answer? (with a FIRM yes).
It should work, but there could be ways that it doesn't and they don't want to be liable.
So I would ask Neptune. Since I can't speak on behalf of them and internals of thh Eb32 design/parts.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

YOUR 2nd QUESTION (about Where to plug in the Ground PROBE)

The GFCI outlet is the best place to get a GROUND, but it doesn't have to be the GFCI outlet since you will have to use up one of the two outlets.
Just pick a spot you won't disconnect that Ground probe (by mistake).
For example Don't use an extension cord, unless it's firmly attached to never be unplugged by mistake (not knowing there is a Ground probe at other end)

Or don't use a power bar you might unplug to borrow. If a power bar, label it (DO NOT UNPLUG) and label your (Ground Probe also (don not unplug)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That's come back to your first question.

If you need more outlets than on the eb32, plugged into the GFCI, and you use up the 2nd Outlet on the GFCI, then where are you going to plug in the other stuff.

So maybe plug in eb32 into one of the GFCI outlets. The 2nd GFCI outlet is used for powerbar, and then Ground Probe into Powerbar. (Just better be a good power bar, UL Certified and NOT some Dollar Store cheapo from China).

Thanks bro.. i think you're a real life hero for posting a thread like this. this is biggg. something i overlooked in my many years in this hobby. luckily i didnt run into a stray voltage problem but now not leaving it to cahnce.

 

[DEWreefing]

I'm truly glad your okay I have been there done that on the shock. But in all honesty when you said you were wearing your(CROC)'S I almost died.

 

[WallyB]

I'm truly glad your okay I have been there done that on the shock. But in all honesty when you said you were wearing your(CROC)'S I almost died.

Actually Crocs are ALL rubber fOAM LIKE material, and great insulators.
I have the kind that cover my feet tops. Sure there are better shoes for Electrical work.
But for fish tank work....I used them all the time.
Better insulators than a pair of All Leather shoes.
Key is sole must be insulator. Leather is not (unless water proofed)

 

[DEWreefing]

Actually Crocs are ALL rubber type material, and great insulators.
Better insulators than a pair of All Leather shoes.
Key is sole must be rubber.

Oh I know my pops use to wear them all the time.

 

[WallyB]

Thanks bro.. i think you're a real life hero for posting a thread like this. this is biggg. something i overlooked in my many years in this hobby. luckily i didnt run into a stray voltage problem but now not leaving it to cahnce.

You and everyone are very welcome.
I quickly forget after an event (like in past) once I fix things.
Sure I tell my local in person reefer friends.
But this time, I'm making the effort to all of you!! (I think the Subject got some people's Attention. That was the goal)

(HOPE the GFCI test Video I made makes every really see things more clearly, and sense of Urgency!!)
I posted it at the START OF THE THREAD, to ensure people see it.

Now if someone could help me figure out SPS in return. I've been killing them for years.
I know LPS and soft corals inside out...since I've been doing Reefing for 20 years+
I just got a whole new batch of SPS frags, so pop by my thread and help (if you know how to keep SPS alive, Colorful and growing)....My 6th batch over last 4 years. Link is below. (NoT A JOKE. I NEED help)

 

[DEWreefing]

You and everyone are very welcome.
I quickly forget after an event (like in past) once I fix things.
Sure I tell my local in person reefer friends.
But this time, I'm making the effort to all of you!!
Now if someone could help me figure out SPS in return. I've been killing them for years.

Stable alk, nitrates 5 to 10ppm and phosphates .03-.010 lots of flow and high par lighting.

 

[italquam]

Great information here , online retailers should also do a video series on this

 

[WallyB]

Stable alk, nitrates 5 to 10ppm and phosphates .03-.010 lots of flow and high par lighting.

ok.

-> I'l have Stable Alk Covered in about a Week, since I'm just finishing up the DIY Alk MOnitor.
-------> It's been my downside (couple of accidents, and I get distracted with Projects)
-> Once the Alk monitor is hooked up, I'll be stable at 7.8dkh. Calcium will be around 450, Mag 1300 since I dose 2 Part ESV ( if Alk is Good the rest follow)

-> Phosphates has been a challenge over the years (too high...Like 0.4ppm), but I got into RhowaPhos after a Guru convinced me. Now I change it like clockwork every 2 weeks. My DIY Auto-minder keeps me on track.
----> Last few months, my P has been around 0.01

----> Nitrates (Tried some things. Bacterial, Media, DIY Algae Scrubber), AND I CAN'T GET BELOW 20-25.

But that's my SPS Challenge. My Thriving LPS 20 year old tank loves, ALK=9, Calc=480. Mag=1300,P>0.3,N=25-30,

But let's use other Threads to discuss, and Keep this Thread about GFCI / Probes and Electrical Tank Safety. Willing to hop onto anyones thread, or join mine.

 

[WallyB]

Great information here , online retailers should also do a video series on this

Agree.

When you think about it.

Shouldn't hooking up you Tank / Water Work Area to AC Power (SAFELY), be STEP #1
Before you buy anything that needs Electricity.( and add Water )

 

[DEWreefing]

ok.

-> I'l have Stable Alk Covered in about a Week, since I'm just finishing up the DIY Alk MOnitor.
-------> It's been my downside (couple of accidents, and I get distracted with Projects)
-> Once the Alk monitor is hooked up, I'll be stable at 7.8dkh. Calcium will be around 450, Mag 1300 since I dose 2 Part ESV ( if Alk is Good the rest follow)

-> Phosphates has been a challenge over the years (too high...Like 0.4ppm), but I got into RhowaPhos after a Guru convinced me. Now I change it like clockwork every 2 weeks. My DIY Auto-minder keeps me on track.
----> Last few months, my P has been around 0.01

----> Nitrates (Tried some things. Bacterial, Media, DIY Algae Scrubber), AND I CAN'T GET BELOW 25.

I have had my phosphates for a year at .80 to 1.0 and my nitrates were at .40

Now that I dropped my nitrates to 5 and phosphates to .010 my vivid rainbow delight is finally not brown.

 

[DEWreefing]

Also you can use sugar or vodka to drop nitrates easy.

 

[Brew12]

Thanks @Brew12

The choice is yours.

So to Close on this Thread FACTS, how about a real Live Experiment

"I MADE A "Electrifying VIDEO" !!!

TESTING GFCI (with and without Ground Probe).

REAL HIGH VOLTAGE TEST!! (Just like what happened in my Tank)

I'm just uploading the Video to YouTube.

IT WILL SHOW

(Why you SHOULD add a GFCI to your Aquarium Setup)

and
(Why you might choose to add a Ground Probe to your Tank, Sump or BOTH)

STAY TUNED!!!

I think it is fantastic that you are filming this. It's something I've meant to do for a long time and haven't gotten around to it. I'll make a point of watching it tonight!

Hey Brew I was just thinking I usually turn off my heater and return via my apex when I do a water change. Lets say I just turn off the heater I'm guessing that would make the ground inactive? Either way may be a good idea to have a grounding probe in the display while doing water changes...

That is not correct, the Apex will not disconnect the ground, only the hot and neutral. Since the ground remains connected it will still act like a ground probe.

 

[mike550]

@WallyB Im glad you’re safe and thanks for sharing all of the information on this topic. As a new reefer I’m always learning new things through this group.

Question for the group. I’m reluctant to switch to a GFCI as we have a number of them in our house and they sometimes trip simply when something completely safe and operable is turned on that draws current quickly like a hair dryer, heater, etc. Heck I’ve watched this happen when I turn off equipment too. So the risk of a GFCI tripping “by mistake” is something that creates its own risk.

I see the value of a grounding probe and will add that. But is there a device or something I can do that can monitor for stray voltage in the tank?

 

[Brew12]

@WallyB Im glad you’re safe and thanks for sharing all of the information on this topic. As a new reefer I’m always learning new things through this group.

Question for the group. I’m reluctant to switch to a GFCI as we have a number of them in our house and they sometimes trip simply when something completely safe and operable is turned on that draws current quickly like a hair dryer, heater, etc. Heck I’ve watched this happen when I turn off equipment too. So the risk of a GFCI tripping “by mistake” is something that creates its own risk.

I see the value of a grounding probe and will add that. But is there a device or something I can do that can monitor for stray voltage in the tank?

It sounds like you have pre 2014 GFCI's in your house. Newer GFCI's shouldn't have an issue with inductive loads any longer. They have been greatly improved.

 

[ChelseaBidwell]

@ChelseaBidwell

Do we have a GFCI? I think we do? Need you to show me where it is. It would be HIGHLY unfortunate if something like this happened during the week when you'r 500 miles away working.. ;Shifty;Hurting;Mask

 

[ruskimax]

Hey @ruskimax , my apology for the negative comment, while being a bit touchy after the Zap and concerned for Safety of my Wife, kids and me.

I assume the joke was to lighten up the mood. I can handle that.

Didn't plan this but I cracked a joke about your comment in my Video. (At the Very end).
Wasn't done on purpose...It just blurted out. (Hope you enjoy it).

That is an dumb and insensitive reply. Not a joking matter when it come to possible electrocution.
Nothing more to say except that you should change your alarm clock since it may be doing damage.

I literally couldn’t have peppered more sarcasm into my post, either way I disagree abt finding

Lol, never feed the trolls man! PS I’m not very handy but I’m will to try anything around the house except electric. Screw that noise, that being said I’m not on GCFI at the moment.