Article: Are LEDs a suitable primary light source? + a thread.

A. grandis · Oct 30, 2016

By the way... you guys could bring all the details about your LED systems here and kinda teach others whatever you want to teach, like coral placements, etc...
Post LED pics... Tank pics...
LED data...

Grandis.

bif24701 · Oct 30, 2016

A. grandis said:
Oh yeah, forgot about that important detail!
Thanks for reminding me!:D

Grandis.

Well it certainly is a significant cost.

I did consider a 8 bulb 60" ATI fixture, to more or LESS equal what I get in coverage and PAR from by 2 each Kessil AP700s, so add the initial cost of bulbs (they don't come with bulbs when you buy them) then replacement every 9-11 months. Each set of bulbs would have been ~200$. Ideally if I went with two each 36" 8 bulb fixtures bulb cost would be even higher.

A. grandis · Oct 31, 2016

bif24701 said:
Well it certainly is a significant cost.

I did consider a 8 bulb 60" ATI fixture, to more or LESS equal what I get in coverage and PAR from by 2 each Kessil AP700s, so add the initial cost of bulbs (they don't come with bulbs when you buy them) then replacement every 9-11 months. Each set of bulbs would have been ~200$. Ideally if I went with two each 36" 8 bulb fixtures bulb cost would be even higher.

Certainly. But why would you even consider the ATI fixture?
Better coverage?
Grandis.

bif24701 · Oct 31, 2016

A. grandis said:
Certainly. But why would you even consider the ATI fixture?
Better coverage?
Grandis.

Why? Why wouldn't I? ATI, T5s have a proven track record. Anyone who knows anything and building a new system would at least CONSIDER ATIs and/or T5s. I evaluated many many different pieces of equipment when I built my 180 display/300 system. Most I passed on. In fact I am so pleased with every single piece of equipment I purchased I wouldn't go back and change anything.

What are you asking? Is this some how an argument against LEDs? lol.

I have yet to see any scientific data from you that leads any where close to a argument against the sol use of LEDs in a reef aquarium.

I'm done with this thread. I commend the folks who have taken their valuable time and done a great job of marking clear that this thread and it's OP have no valid argument here.

I would welcome any data that you might have but it's clear you do not and had your chance.

We are done here. Good night.

A. grandis · Oct 31, 2016

bif24701 said:
Why? Why wouldn't I? ATI, T5s have a proven track record. Anyone who knows anything and building a new system would at least CONSIDER ATIs and/or T5s. I evaluated many many different pieces of equipment when I built my 180 display/300 system. Most I passed on. In fact I am so pleased with every single piece of equipment I purchased I wouldn't go back and change anything.

What are you asking? Is this some how an argument against LEDs? lol.

I have yet to see any scientific data from you that leads any where close to a argument against the sol use of LEDs in a reef aquarium.

I'm done with this thread. I commend the folks who have taken their valuable time and done a great job of marking clear that this thread and it's OP have no valid argument here.

I would welcome any data that you might have but it's clear you do not and had your chance.

We are done here. Good night.

Oh man, I didn't mean in a bad way...
Wow!
Grandis.

Paul B · Oct 31, 2016

My tank is certainly no where near the nicest one on here and I have very few SPS except montipora that grows like weeds and 4 or 5 others. I can't keep all the delicate SPS that some of you guys do for a few reasons that I know as I have been doing this for a while ever since my trilobites died. My DIY water cooled LED fixture only has 72 LEDs on it over a 6' long tank. That is a LED about every 2 1/2". As you know the fixtures you buy will have a LED about every quarter of an inch so I am way under lit. I am only running 216 watts over this 100 gallon tank. Even with nitrates at about 160, I can still grow many SPS and all LPS.
If I wanted to keep more sticks, I would have to double my lighting, (and lower my nitrates) but I like my tank the way it is and for a few years have concentrated more on gorgonians, sponges and LPS as I just find them more interesting. I am also more interested in having all my fish spawn which is the reason for the nitrates.
I also didn't have problems with MH except for the heat, cost of lamps and bulkiness. I believe I could keep anything under LEDs if I just added more, which would be easy and very cheap as I would add them to my existing fixture.

You can see here how far apart the LEDs are and I can still grow what I want to grow. (Water runs through that and to a radiator)

Knapp870 · Oct 31, 2016

DIY water cooled LED fixture...LOVE IT! Tank looks great Paul!

Paul B · Oct 31, 2016

Thanks, does anyone need a water cooled LED fixture? Of course not. But anyone can go out and buy a fixture. Where is the fun in that?

I also have a water cooled LED fixture for my algae scrubber.

happyhourhero · Oct 31, 2016

This has to just be the alt account of the guy who insisted bayer was not an effect coral dip.

Paul B · Oct 31, 2016

I never dipped a coral in anything in my life. And I'm old. :eek:

McMullen · Oct 31, 2016

@A. grandis
I'm assuming you ran out of people to argue with in another reef site and decided to bring a years old argument here!? Boooooo! Troll!!!! Booooooo!!!!!!!

Paul B · Oct 31, 2016

For comparism, if anyone is interested. This is the natural colors of coral in sunlight in about 35' of water in the South Pacific. Yes, it is very dull and that is the way coral looks unless it is in very shallow water.

This is the way it looks with a flash. This was Bora Bora. Many of us artificially enhance the colors of our corals which is fine, but not natural unless we are simulating a reef 6" deep.

This was the Caribbean.

gus6464 · Oct 31, 2016

Paul B said:
Thanks, does anyone need a water cooled LED fixture? Of course not. But anyone can go out and buy a fixture. Where is the fun in that?

I also have a water cooled LED fixture for my algae scrubber.

You running closed loop in the watercooling setup of you have a reservoir?

Paul B · Oct 31, 2016

That is a closed loop. No reservoir. The fixture just gets a little warm. That picture of it on my workbench is the entire unit just after completion and testing.

TheEngineer · Oct 31, 2016

Paul B said:
For comparism, if anyone is interested. This is the natural colors of coral in sunlight in about 35' of water in the South Pacific. Yes, it is very dull and that is the way coral looks unless it is in very shallow water.

This is the way it looks with a flash. This was Bora Bora. Many of us artificially enhance the colors of our corals which is fine, but not natural unless we are simulating a reef 6" deep.

This was the Caribbean.

I agree with the sentiment, but to be fair... the colorful corals come from Indonesia and the like. Not where your photos are from.

Paul B · Oct 31, 2016

That's fair. I am not sure what the corals look like in Indonesia, but I have dove the Barrier Reef and all the Hawaiian, Tahitian Islands and most of the Caribbean. I realize most of us want our tanks to be very colorful. I am just pointing out that in most of the oceans, they don't look like that in natural sunlight and bright colors do not necessarily mean healthy corals.
We will never be able to duplicate the spectrum or intensity of the sun as it rises and wanes throughout the day, but as I said I don't think it matters as long as we get the same intensity and spectrum from each light we want to use.

TheEngineer · Oct 31, 2016

Paul B said:
That's fair. I am not sure what the corals look like in Indonesia, but I have dove the Barrier Reef and all the Hawaiian, Tahitian Islands and most of the Caribbean. I realize most of us want our tanks to be very colorful. I am just pointing out that in most of the oceans, they don't look like that in natural sunlight and bright colors do not necessarily mean healthy corals.
We will never be able to duplicate the spectrum or intensity of the sun as it rises and wanes throughout the day, but as I said I don't think it matters as long as we get the same intensity and spectrum from each light we want to use.

No arguments here! :)

I've seen pictures of stunningly purple corals in natural light from Indonesia. Just crazy.

Paul B · Oct 31, 2016

Maybe I should plan a dive trip there. :D

Knapp870 · Oct 31, 2016

Paul B said:
Maybe I should plan a dive trip there. :D

I dove Thailand on my honeymoon. There were bright clams the size of tractor tires and corals of all kind of colors. It was amazing and I highly recommend it.

Paul B · Oct 31, 2016

I dive in New York harbor all the time and there are Bright tractor tires of all colors the size of clams. It is also amazing. :D
Sorry, OK back to lighting. :)