Avoiding the ugly stage?!?

[tzoa]

Good Luck LOL

You mean with everything in general or just adding the coral?

 

[tzoa]

My 200 gallon is all dry, it has been running since late July with no lights. The sump has 30 pounds of Tampa bay base rock and 20 pounds of their live sand. Waiting to buy the lights so I have forced my hand. It’ll be interesting to see what happens in my tank.

I’m hoping for a result like @exnisstech but not counting on it. Overall I may be looking at the tank running for close to a year without lights on.

Wow, you got a lot of patience lol

 

[tzoa]

Live ocean rock will lessen the blow but you will probably start seeing uglies 3-6 months starting with dry rock and a bottle of bac.

Thx I'll keep that in mind

 

[Lavey29]

A little late for that. I'm just trying to only have blue lights on to minimize the algae growth

Blue lights at low intensity may minimize algae growth but if you have already added coral then you better make sure you have enough par and spectrum to support it.

 

[Exotrezy]

A little late for that. I'm just trying to only have blue lights on to minimize the algae growth

Wouldn't blue light also still grow algae?

 

[Lavey29]

Wouldn't blue light also still grow algae?

Yes but if it's low intensity then the algae growth will be slow and minimal. Basically you are just prolonging the inevitable.

 

[ChrisfromBrick]

All avoidable if nutrients are properly managed imo

sorry but have to disagree. I have tested and adjusted daily. Not one reefer I’ve ever met has avoided some stage of the uglies

 

[thatone08]

My tanks at a bout A year and a half. Bare bottom dry rock. No lights except ambient light first 4 months. Then a small 2 bulb t5 fixture for 2 months, then a Radion g6. Diatoms showed up after a mo th of the t5. So five months in, they will always show up. Then chrysophytes at about 7 months in. Then cyano at about 1 year currently seeing development of coraline and healthy formation of film algae on the glass. Nutrients in my desired range and struggle keeping phosphates up.

If anything just make sure not to zero out your nutrients because your seeing normal growth on rocks.

 

[sixty_reefer]

sorry but have to disagree. I have tested and adjusted daily. Not one reefer I’ve ever met has avoided some stage of the uglies

We can only test for nitrate and phosphate, their impact on some of the nuisances are minimal, nutrient management to me is about choosing pathways to help aid the control of ammonium.
In saltwater aquaria this is the most desirable nutrient by all photosynthetic organisms hence we never being able to test for it.
Once light is added to a new tank the first organisms that will use it is diatoms especially if started with dry rock, once silica becomes limited the green film will start showing up on rocks and here is the most important part of nutrient management.
If not enough photosynthetic organisms are added green hair algae or other algae’s will start to develop as they won’t have any competition available, if enough photosynthetic organisms are present such as other desirable algae’s or enough coral you can create a competitive pathway for ammonia.
This pathways need to be established early on as photosynthetic organisms are way more efficient at using ammonia vs nitrifying bacteria, in most tanks the notification process is outcompeted by photosynthetic organisms.

Nitrate and phosphate usually only becomes a problem if it’s too low or bottomed out in the cycling process. They don’t start a problem for photosynthetic organisms as they will have to spend energy to convert nitrate into ammonia.

To me nutrient management is maintaining nitrates and phosphate within acceptable ranges (never allowing them to bottom out) , creating multiple pathways for ammonium management including promoting the growth of photosynthetic films on the rock and adding herbivorous to control any possible outbreaks at early stages including pods and other types of zooplankton.

This is a example of a tank 5 weeks old that have been managed nutrient from day zero, firstly with silica and diatoms and then adding macro algae’s

Nitrates 20 mg/l
Phosphate 0.4 mg/l

Before

After 5 weeks

Notice how all the rock has become full of beneficial photosynthetic biofilms that will aid the nuisance competition process.
Once I have enough coral and coraline algae in there I will remove the macro algae’s and replace the ammonia pathway this way.

 

[tzoa]

yea you will avoid it maybe for a month or 2. But, you WILL get algae/dinos/ etc. It’s very hard to avoid

If I put in some starter coraline algae will I avoid it?

 

[Jonreefer]

If I put in some starter coraline algae will I avoid it?

no

 

[tzoa]

Wouldn't blue light also still grow algae?

I didn't think so too much, but now im thinking it will in a month or 2.

 

[tzoa]

We can only test for nitrate and phosphate, their impact on some of the nuisances are minimal, nutrient management to me is about choosing pathways to help aid the control of ammonium.
In saltwater aquaria this is the most desirable nutrient by all photosynthetic organisms hence we never being able to test for it.
Once light is added to a new tank the first organisms that will use it is diatoms especially if started with dry rock, once silica becomes limited the green film will start showing up on rocks and here is the most important part of nutrient management.
If not enough photosynthetic organisms are added green hair algae or other algae’s will start to develop as they won’t have any competition available, if enough photosynthetic organisms are present such as other desirable algae’s or enough coral you can create a competitive pathway for ammonia.
This pathways need to be established early on as photosynthetic organisms are way more efficient at using ammonia vs nitrifying bacteria, in most tanks the notification process is outcompeted by photosynthetic organisms.

Nitrate and phosphate usually only becomes a problem if it’s too low or bottomed out in the cycling process. They don’t start a problem for photosynthetic organisms as they will have to spend energy to convert nitrate into ammonia.

To me nutrient management is maintaining nitrates and phosphate within acceptable ranges (never allowing them to bottom out) , creating multiple pathways for ammonium management including promoting the growth of photosynthetic films on the rock and adding herbivorous to control any possible outbreaks at early stages including pods and other types of zooplankton.

This is a example of a tank 5 weeks old that have been managed nutrient from day zero, firstly with silica and diatoms and then adding macro algae’s

Nitrates 20 mg/l
Phosphate 0.4 mg/l

Before

After 5 weeks

Notice how all the rock has become full of beneficial photosynthetic biofilms that will aid the nuisance competition process.
Once I have enough coral and coraline algae in there I will remove the macro algae’s and replace the ammonia pathway this way.

makes a lot of sense. that makes me wonder if I should get macro algae to out compete the hair algea/diotoms before it even comes

 

[ReefSauce]

You are gonna need a lot of it for this hobby. You hit fast forward in the most volatile time in your tanks life. Dont add anymore corals. And keep an eye on your fish. I recommend doing fishless cycles. But its too late for that. Research is your friend in this hobby. The information is out there. A wise man once said..
"An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure"

Good luck.

 

[Lasse]

With this method - I have always avoided the Ugly phase - the holy graal is a lot of different types of clean up crew - including corals

Sincerely Lasse

 

[sixty_reefer]

makes a lot of sense. that makes me wonder if I should get macro algae to out compete the hair algea/diotoms before it even comes

You should add the macros after the diatoms go only, before it may kill them. (There’s nothing that I’m aware that is able to compete with diatoms).
Have a look at dragon’s breath (halymenia durvillei) they grow well with ammonia and look better than coral imo.

 

[GARRIGA]

Avoiding the ugly stage like avoiding pimples as a kid. Sometimes you just need to out grow things

 

[tzoa]

With this method - I have always avoided the Ugly phase - the holy graal is a lot of different types of clean up crew - including corals

Sincerely Lasse

I'm getting a lot of different information. Idk what to do lol

 

[sixty_reefer]

I'm getting a lot of different information. Idk what to do lol

@Lasse method is a good way to avoid/minimise the ugly stage, I do also agree that many new folks joining the hobby over react in regards to nitrates and phosphate and usually strip those nutrients that would be essential for the organism that are trying to establish.

 

[ReefSauce]

I'm getting a lot of different information. Idk what to do lol

I would start by taking your zoa frag out and put it in a buddys tank or have your lfs hold it for you and just shut your lights off for like a month. Your fish wont care.