Battery backup question

[Weasel1960]

I am slowly going through all the DIY pages, oldest to most recent, reviewing topics of interest to me. I am currently designing my DIY stand and want to leave dedicated space for battery backup and trickle charger.

I have seen several threads on battery backup but none specific to using a lithium ion battery (may have missed it or just not gotten there yet).

Has anyone done that yet? If so please point me to the thread or tell me about how you did it.

 

[don_chuwish]

Can't speak to Li-ion - but what do you want the UPS to keep running in a power outage? By far the best (longest running) solution seems to be the VorTech battery backup combined with their pumps.

 

[Weasel1960]

Can't speak to Li-ion - but what do you want the UPS to keep running in a power outage? By far the best (longest running) solution seems to be the VorTech battery backup combined with their pumps.

Thanks for the reply. Haven’t fully decided yet am still in the planning stages. I know that what ever equip is on the list needs to go about 6 hours on a backup. Had a couple of outages last summer that went a little longer than 3 hours.

VorTech is a little out of my price point right now so looking into other options, not afraid to do a little DIY in the process.

Ultimately will come down to final priorities when I start my build.

 

[theatrus]

I am slowly going through all the DIY pages, oldest to most recent, reviewing topics of interest to me. I am currently designing my DIY stand and want to leave dedicated space for battery backup and trickle charger.

I have seen several threads on battery backup but none specific to using a lithium ion battery (may have missed it or just not gotten there yet).

Has anyone done that yet? If so please point me to the thread or tell me about how you did it.

I use a Lithium-Iron-phosphate managed packs - they're sold as lead acid compatible cells, without the weight of the lead acid. Some even have the battery management hooked up to a little bluetooth radio https://www.power-sonic.com/batteries/lithium-bluetooth-series/

I wouldn't (especially as a first timer) build a system out of LiCo or other cells, or bare cells of any kind. Pick a protected, managed battery pack from a source that isn't AliExpress or eBay. The cost is a lot more than a lead acid, but worth it IMO.

There are two useful topologies, either an always-online system (large DC 24 -> managed battery pack -> pump Vin) or a relay switched. The choice is yours.

 

[Weasel1960]

I use a Lithium-Iron-phosphate managed packs - they're sold as lead acid compatible cells, without the weight of the lead acid. Some even have the battery management hooked up to a little bluetooth radio https://www.power-sonic.com/batteries/lithium-bluetooth-series/

I wouldn't (especially as a first timer) build a system out of LiCo or other cells, or bare cells of any kind. Pick a protected, managed battery pack from a source that isn't AliExpress or eBay. The cost is a lot more than a lead acid, but worth it IMO.

There are two useful topologies, either an always-online system (large DC 24 -> managed battery pack -> pump Vin) or a relay switched. The choice is yours.

Thanks for the reply. Not knowledgeable enough to build a battery pack. Want something sealed as a single unit but worry about lead/acid in the house. It looks like the LiPo is cheaper than the Li-Ion?

How has your set up been doing?

I live in rural Wisconsin. Occasionally lose power due to storms between 1 and 4 hours. Have a small generator for space heaters in winter or fridge and fans in summer but think adding aquarium would be too much.

After thinking what @don_chuwish asked I think I would like to keep the heaters, return pumps, and power heads operating. Short outages could get by without lights and skimmer. Recharging off a car if necessary is an option but would prefer system to be able to last at least 2 hours or more before that’s necessary.

Thoughts?

 

[Jonify]

I use a CyberPower UPS, and it keeps my DC return pump and 50W heater going for about 6-9 hours, with my tightly insulated condo. As you browse options, consider going with DC pumps, as they typically have about half the power requirement and can extend the time your tank can operate on battery backup.

 

[Weasel1960]

I use a CyberPower UPS, and it keeps my DC return pump and 50W heater going for about 6-9 hours, with my tightly insulated condo. As you browse options, consider going with DC pumps, as they typically have about half the power requirement and can extend the time your tank can operate on battery backup.

Yup definitely considering DC pumps. Thanks for the info.

 

[don_chuwish]

When the power goes out I have Apex configured to shut off everything but one Tunze powerhead - and that gets set to the lowest flow possible. My UPS is an APC Back-Ups Pro 1500 but it only lasts about 3 hours running that Tunze. If I need more time and heat isn't a worry I switch to a battery powered bubbler. Beyond that or if I need heat it's time to fire up the generator.

 

[theatrus]

Heat is going to be your biggest challenge, if you need to provide it with electric heaters and can't just heat the ambient room up with other sources. Most (all?) aquarium heaters are designed for 120V/240V AC, which means you're strapping an inverter to the output of batteries. They're also, depending on the size of your tank, several hundred watts of power. Lots of DC power heads are in the 20-60W range realistically. If you're only counting on a few hours, prioritize water flow above all else.

 

[Weasel1960]

Good points to consider as I continue my planning thanks for the input. Haven’t lost power yet in the winter ... knock on wood ... but lost power 3 or 4 times this last summer, twice in a couple of days For several hours.

Do you guys run all or some of your power heads (assuming you have several in main tank)? And do yo run your return pump at all or just stick to circulation within the display?

 

[don_chuwish]

My UPS won't run the return pump long enough to make it worth it. I experimented with both and the single Tunze powerhead at minimum speed was the longest lasting. Main thing really is to keep circulation going in the main display - preferably with some surface agitation.

 

[Reef-junky]

One of these with a car battery

 

[don_chuwish]

If the Vortech stuff is too rich for your blood, take a look at the IceCap Battery Backup v3. $129 and cross compatible with a lot of different DC pumps.

 

[Weasel1960]

One of these with a car battery

Thanks for the input

 

[Weasel1960]

If the Vortech stuff is too rich for your blood, take a look at the IceCap Battery Backup v3. $129 and cross compatible with a lot of different DC pumps.

Thanks. As I said looking at all options during the planning and budgeting stage. Will have to make sure all necessities are covered first, then look at upgrades.

 

[theatrus]

If the Vortech stuff is too rich for your blood, take a look at the IceCap Battery Backup v3. $129 and cross compatible with a lot of different DC pumps.

Good option. Are there any known pumps that would not work with effectively running undervolted by half? It looks like the battery output voltage is 12V - is that full time or only when on backup?

Using a much lower voltage is great, you're going to extend runtime significantly (its how the Vortech backup input port works, except for the Vectra which has a 36V booster cable), but since the total torque to a pump drops by a factor of at least 4 if its a 24V pump, it may have restart issues or just not run.

Also 2.5Ah is somewhat piddly

 

[Cwentz758]

Not sure if a generator is out of the question. But harbor freight has a camping generator for 140$
In a pinch some extension cords and that I feel like is a decent bet.

 

[Reef-junky]

Not sure if a generator is out of the question. But harbor freight has a camping generator for 140$
In a pinch some extension cords and that I feel like is a decent bet.

Generator is for sure a good option

 

[Weasel1960]

Thanks for suggestions. Just got a small Honda generator from FIL estate. He used it to run the AC on his 5th wheel camper when he didn’t have a camping site with power. I haven’t checked it out yet but as previously mentioned it would likely run some space heaters and lights if power lost in winter and fridge, freezer, fans if lost in summer. Will check into how much load it can handle maybe the tank could go on it also.

 

[don_chuwish]

The generator I used when out of power for a week was a Honda EU2000. It ran the tank, two refrigerators and a freezer. After that I bought a 5G fuel capacity expansion kit.