Big Ammonia Problem help

[In need of help]

Please help, i have a hugh ammonia problem and dont know what to do.

Starting from the beginning, i have run the tank for 6 months with no issues, but about two weeks ago i stupidly stirred up the sand bed after 6 months on it being untouched with a vacuum (first mistake) for the week after this the ammonia spiked to 0.5ppm usually 0 ppm. I did a few water changes after this, thinking this would help the issue and cut down on feeding and rechecked the ammonia 3 days later and it has spiked to a shockly high 8ppm. Since seeing the ammonia i have been adding Prime daily and stopped feeding the fish for 6 days. I also did a 30% water change one day, then a 50%change the next and then 30% the day after that. This had absolutely no affect on the Ammonia level which remained at 8ppm.

I have 0 ppm nitrite, the ph has dropped to 7.8 and the nitrate is 10 ppm.

But i have no idea what to do i would have expected the water to have diluted by the proportion of water change or even just seen a slight decrease... Something... Anything!! But nothing.

So then i thought perhaps something is polluting the water and causing the ammonia, but it cant be the fish as they havent eaten. So i took a sample of decor, sand and rocks out and put in clean water to see if anything could be causing the ammonia, but the decor and rock read 0 ppm in the 'clean' water and the sand came in at 0.5 ppm. Nothing to really cause the 8 ppm.

I also changed the filters and added live bacteria balls but no affect. Still high ammonia at 8ppm.

There are no dead fish in the tank. In fact the fish look fine, probably due to daily dose of prime.

I also brought a new test kit just in case but that reads 8 ppm also.

Please help? Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

 

[redfishbluefish]

Your ammonia can't be 8 ppm with fish in the tank. That level would kill the fish almost immediately. Something is not right with testing. I'd start by carefully rereading the testing instructions.

Oh, and welcome to R2R.

 

[homer1475]

Your ammonia can't be 8 ppm with fish in the tank. That level would kill the fish almost immediately. Something is not right with testing. I'd start by carefully rereading the testing instructions.

Oh, and welcome to R2R.

Agreed 100%

What test kits are you using?

 

[In need of help]

Your ammonia can't be 8 ppm with fish in the tank. That level would kill the fish almost immediately. Something is not right with testing. I'd start by carefully rereading the testing instructions.

Oh, and welcome to R2R.

I have tested the water repeatedly, even had a neighbour who is into the hobby come around and check for me just in case. Its definitely 8ppm i am using searchem prime which i think is binding the ammonia and stopping it from harming the fish. Before i put it in the fish was hardly moving at the bottom of the tank and i lost one fish which i quicky removed so since Ive been putting prime in daily they seem fine and are swimming happily. Thanks for the response any help is greatly appreciated.

 

[In need of help]

Agreed 100%

What test kits are you using?

I am using Marine lab nh3 ammonia test. I originally was using api master test kit but brought this one just to double check. Both tests show 8ppm.

I have tested the water repeatedly, even had a neighbour who is into the hobby come around and check for me just in case. Its definitely 8ppm i am using searchem prime which i think is binding the ammonia and stopping it from harming the fish. Before i put it in the fish was hardly moving at the bottom of the tank and i lost one fish which i quicky removed so since Ive been putting prime in daily they seem fine and are swimming happily. Thanks for the response any help is greatly appreciated.

 

[homer1475]

Never heard of it. API sure, but there is no way you have fish alive at 8ppm. Your either reading it wrong, or performing the test wrong.

 

[Garf]

I am using Marine lab nh3 ammonia test. I originally was using api master test kit but brought this one just to double check. Both tests show 8ppm.

I have tested the water repeatedly, even had a neighbour who is into the hobby come around and check for me just in case. Its definitely 8ppm i am using searchem prime which i think is binding the ammonia and stopping it from harming the fish. Before i put it in the fish was hardly moving at the bottom of the tank and i lost one fish which i quicky removed so since Ive been putting prime in daily they seem fine and are swimming happily. Thanks for the response any help is greatly appreciated.

You got a pic of the tank?

 

[Azedenkae]

I also changed the filters

Sorry, can I ask what do you mean by 'change the filters'?

Also, I presume you are using the API ammonia test kit, because of the readings you provided. API test kits are not accurate, but not necessarily not precise. Especially since you have been measuring 8ppm with multiple tests, while other values for others, so does not sound like you are misreading anything.

What I would recommend is doing a serial dilution read. Because 8ppm is the highest value on the scale, it could be that your ammonia is even higher than that, so even after the water changes it still read 8 because... despite a reduction in ammonia you still can't read the actual level.

It is super, super, super high though. I don't have enough knowledge about how well Prime works with really high ammonia, so can't make a call on if there is anything wonky going on here.

Anyways yeah, to do a 1:2 serial dilution, basically mix half tank water and half 'fresh' water, and read ammonia for that. If it still reads 8ppm, do another dilution of the half/half mix with fresh water, so that you end up with a sample with 1/4th water from your tank and 3/4th 'fresh' water. Then read that. If that's too high, keep on repeating until you can measure something, then multiply it back up to get the original value.

If you are unfamiliar with the concept of serial dilution, http://www.fao.org/3/AC802E/ac802e0o.jpg.

Either way if you are 100% sure you have so much ammonia, might be best to do a 100% water change.

 

[In need of help]

Never heard of it. API sure, but there is no way you have fish alive at 8ppm. Your either reading it wrong, or performing the test wrong.

The instructions are pretty simple to follow. But I have taken photos of the latest test (see attached) and even took some water to the local aquatic store so they could test and it still came back at 8ppm! They told me to do water changes etc.
It honestly doesnt make sense? Also see attached pic of prime i am dosing also.

 

[In need of help]

You got a pic of the tank

 

[In need of help]

Sorry, can I ask what do you mean by 'change the filters'?

Also, I presume you are using the API ammonia test kit, because of the readings you provided. API test kits are not accurate, but not necessarily not precise. Especially since you have been measuring 8ppm with multiple tests, while other values for others, so does not sound like you are misreading anything.

What I would recommend is doing a serial dilution read. Because 8ppm is the highest value on the scale, it could be that your ammonia is even higher than that, so even after the water changes it still read 8 because... despite a reduction in ammonia you still can't read the actual level.

It is super, super, super high though. I don't have enough knowledge about how well Prime works with really high ammonia, so can't make a call on if there is anything wonky going on here.

Anyways yeah, to do a 1:2 serial dilution, basically mix half tank water and half 'fresh' water, and read ammonia for that. If it still reads 8ppm, do another dilution of the half/half mix with fresh water, so that you end up with a sample with 1/4th water from your tank and 3/4th 'fresh' water. Then read that. If that's too high, keep on repeating until you can measure something, then multiply it back up to get the original value.

If you are unfamiliar with the concept of serial dilution, http://www.fao.org/3/AC802E/ac802e0o.jpg.

Either way if you are 100% sure you have so much ammonia, might be best to do a 100% water change.

Thank you so much for your advise. I using api and marine lap tests. I wasnt sure if i did 100% water change whether that would affect any of the 'good bacteria'?? also do you reckon it would be ok to move the fish?? I wasnt sure if it would stress them out given the ammonia levels but they seem ok!

But that serial dilution makes sence and might expalin why my earlier water changes had no effect.

When i said filter.. I meant the aquarium floss (i think thats what it is called aka the white mesh in the sump) any advise would be appreciated. Thank you

 

[Azedenkae]

Thank you so much for your advise. I wasnt sure if i did 100% whether that would affect any of the 'good bacteria'?? also do you reckon it would be ok to move the fish?? I wasnt sure if it would stress them out given the ammonia levels but they seem ok! When i said filter.. I meant the aquarium floss (i think thats what it is called aka the white mesh in the sump) any advise would be appreciated. Thank you

Ah okay, that is fine then re: filter change. I was just worried you removed the biological filtration itself.

Doing a 100% water change is fine when it comes to the nitrifying microbes, because they predominantly live within your biomedia, rock, sand, and so on, not in the water. The only concern is that your live stock will be transitioning between waters with different parameters, but between that and 8+ ppm (presuming the measurement is correct), the former is probably preferable.

 

[redfishbluefish]

I am not familiar with your test kit, and not familiar with Prime. I know of Prime, but no idea how it works. However, that is not going to stop me from guessing. Just to take a step back, ammonia (NH3) is highly toxic to fish. Not only is 8ppm extremely toxic, so is 0.8ppm, and 0.08ppm, and I'd even question 0.008. That said, I think what is happening is that Prime is oxidizing the ammonia (NH3) to ionized ammonia (NH4), which is not as toxic as NH3. I also believe that test kits do NOT discriminate between NH3 and NH4, so what you're seeing is a combination of the two, with the majority, if not all, NH4. Again, all a guess on my part.

 

[homer1475]

Ahh yes, missed the prime part. I know it detoxifies ammonia(not harmful to the inhabitants), but it will still register as high ammonia on a test kit.