Black Bugs - An Acro keepers worst nightmare?

[305Reefer]

This is going to be a difficult post for me to write, bear with me.

Last night after 3 days of research, discussion with other reefers, testing treatments under a microscope, and bringing myself to actually do it; I tore down my Acro tank. Not a hurt acro tank, but a beautiful growing acro tank that had been up for approximately 8 months with acros and 2 years total. I chopped up all my encrusted frags and colonies and basically chucked them in the trash keeping a tiny 1-2" frag of the healthiest corals to not loose the bloodlines.

It all started about two weeks ago when I noticed my alkalinity staying stable for once, which is weird for my tank. It's always going low because my tank was transitioning from its "bunch of frags stage" to the "every frag is taking off into a colony stage". I noticed I didn't have to make my weekly adjustment dose and then up my daily dose and I noticed a few corals looking like the edges of the encrusting part where white and maybe beginning to STN. I didnt think much about it and attributed it to no water changes for 3 months. While parameters were perfect I figured my trace elements were getting out of wack finally. So I did two 20g water changes back to back in my 90g tank with 30g frag tank.

A few days later I noticed 3 of my Acros where now actually STNing. That day another more experienced SPS reefer swung by my house to get some stuff and saw my tank. He immediately told me something was very wrong. And that my issue wasn't water parameters, trace elements, low phosphates, etc. He said something was attacking them. My first thought was AEFW. I started researching and decided to let them stay in the tank and try out the KZ Flatwork Stop and Wrasse Technique. I figured those corals were stressed from something else or a combination of things and well I basically didnt know what was going on. I have been dosing KZ Coral Booster for a while and several people told me with that product, corals can actually withstand a AEFW infestation and you wont see it, you'll just see bite marks here and there and you'll see growth slow, colors fade, etc.

So I posted to SPS Junkies on facebook group a picture of my STNing RR Pink Floyd and a guy from California immediately messaged me saying, "Im sorry to say this but I'm 99% sure you have black bugs, the absolutely worst Acro pest" I called him up and we talked thru IDing them. I pulled the Pink Floyd out and dipped it in 2 cap fulls of Revive in 16oz of water which is approximately 4x strength. Immediately a bunch of little black bugs emerged from the coral.





At this point everything is spiraling downward incredibly quickly. In the course of a week I went from a few sick corals to loosing thousands of dollars worth of Acros. A whole section of frags on a frag rack are obviously being eaten alive by these bugs and it all hits me, HOLY CRAP I gotta do something NOW. Basically the lower half of the tank along with the frag racks where all STN/RTNing. Since I can't see them with the naked eye, I bust out my camera and macro lens and start taking pictures so I can zoom in on them and inspect which corals need to be cut out first.. Thats when I discover I ALSO HAVE AEFW when I see their bite marks on some corals. Double Whammy. The crazy part is that no new corals had been added to the tank since RAP in April.



In my research I found that most people do not beat them. Lots of people didn't even want to discuss it with me. One guy even told me, kiss your tank good bye. A few others had experimented with extreme dipping methods. It seemed a few people had success with cutting bases off corals, dipping at 4x dose revive for 5 minutes.. Every week for 8 weeks and leaving the tank fallow of acros for 4-6 months to destroy the entire lifecycle before replanting frags. I experimented with Bayer, even super concentrated did nothing to them at all.

So thats what Im doing at the moment. Experimenting and dipping. But I had to tear down the tank.



I'm not sure I will revisit sticks again after this. Thank god I'm single and young, no wife/no kids. No wife would stand for the amount of money I spent on frags this past year and then deal with loosing 75% of them.

The death toll is serious:
RR Ultimate Orange Passion
RR Angry Birds
RR Lion King
RR Equinox
RR Diesel
RR Pink Venom
RR Badger
RR Inferno
RR WM Fusion
RR Red Velvet
RR Strawberry Fields
Vivid Confetti
PC Rainbow
SC Orange Passion
CB Beast Mode Acro
CB Gumdrop Acro
CB Wet Dreams
CB Miami Orchid
CB Sick Nasty
CB Fruity Pebbles
CB Birthday Cake
CB Rainbow Treasure
CB Valhalla
CB Big Papi
DJ Skitty's FHRITP
TCK Rainbow Matrix
TCK Candy Crush
TCK Mardi Gras

I managed to save:
Big R Walt Disney
JF Fox Flame
JF Homewrecker
RRC OG Jawdropper
RR Aussie Gold Tort
RR Rainbow Loom
HSF Leviathan Acro
CB Flaming Unicorn
CB Versace Acro
CB Icecap Acro
BC Bubblebath Unicorn (maybe, its hurt bad)
GARF Bonsai

One more note, I think these are rare. I think there are more than one kind, and I think each kind eats certain types of Acros. The one I have seems to eat acros with textured skin and passes on smooth skin acros. Not proven, just from observation.

I made this post so everyone can see what they look like. Discuss experiences, and be aware. These things make AEFW seem fun.

 

[305Reefer]

Since I'm actively talking to a lot of people about this right now. Someone on FB who dealt with them said that leaving the tank fallow of Acros will not solve the issue and they can live for extended periods in a tank even without Acros in it. A complete reboot from scratch is the only way to solve them. Not sure I believe that totally, but it does scare me even more now.

 

[bubbaque]

I think @codydemmel4 delt with them at one point. He dosed interceptor at 4x the recommend strength to kill them if I remember correctly. I believe he had the same symptoms as you. I also seen someone say they killed them on FB a week or so ago at that same strength.

I think a lot of people say they are unbeatable without trying everything first. Not just with black bugs but when it comes to a lot of things in the hobby. People say they have hair algae issues without ever buying a cleanup crew. Others say they can not get rid of cyano without ever using chemiclean. I get it, no one likes to dose meds into their tank but if it’s getting to the point of shutting the tank down, it’s worth a try.

 

[305Reefer]

I think @codydemmel4 delt with them at one point. He dosed interceptor at 4x the recommend strength to kill them if I remember correctly. I believe he had the same symptoms as you. I also seen someone say they killed them on FB a week or so ago at that same strength.

I think a lot of people say they are unbeatable without trying everything first. Not just with black bugs but when it comes to a lot of things in the hobby. People say they have hair algae issues without ever buying a cleanup crew. Others say they can not get rid of cyano without ever using chemiclean. I get it, no one likes to dose meds into their tank but if it’s getting to the point of shutting the tank down, it’s worth a try.

I'm willing to try anything. At this point I have a FOWLR tank with a bunch of Montis and Millis in it. I could care less. I'll move my Mandarin to a friends tank and dump whatever amount of Interceptor it takes. Although in my research many people who did 4x dose had them come back. I think the idea is you have to do a 4x dose, every week, for 3 months, which Im ok with because who needs pods or inverts. Id rather have a tank that can take Acros again so I dont have to start from scratch with new rock.

 

[outeastreefer]

Dustin Dorton of ORA has used interceptor (dog heartworm pill) to kill those black bugs. If you google him and or interceptor for black bugs, you will find many pages and dosage recommendations. You must remove all crustaceans as the meds are dangerous to them. Good luck.

 

[bubbaque]

I'm willing to try anything. At this point I have a FOWLR tank with a bunch of Montis and Millis in it. I could care less. I'll move my Mandarin to a friends tank and dump whatever amount of Interceptor it takes. Although in my research many people who did 4x dose had them come back. I think the idea is you have to do a 4x dose, every week, for 3 months, which Im ok with because who needs pods or inverts. Id rather have a tank that can take Acros again so I dont have to start from scratch with new rock.

I think it's just like red bugs where you only have to do it for 3 weeks. It's the 4x the recommended dose that is killing them.

 

[CoralWealth]

I did not have the black bugs that you have luckily for me. Mine were more like red bugs, that small but black and gray. I couldnt see them with the naked eye. I had to use a magnify glass to see them. Interceptor definitely worked on the ones I had. I am not sure about the ones you have as they seem a lot bigger and harder to kill.

I definitely would try interceptor at 4X the strength and see what happens. Nothing negative happened for me besides on shrimp dying that I couldnt catch, all snails were fine.

 

[Kent12456]

A few years a ago I had an infestation of Montipora eating black bugs. They appeared to be a little different than the variety of black bugs in your video. Barely visible, they looked like pepper on the coral. Greatly magnified they looked like copepods with claws. I found very few sources of information on how to treat for them. The only effective in tank treatment was “Interceptor” it was off the market and impossible to find. I learned that the active ingredient in Interceptor is “Milbemcyn oxime”. The main ingredient in the coral dip made by Dr. G’s is the same.... Milbemcyn oxime. The product is called “Dr.G's SPS & LPS Coral Dip Solution”
The thread with details on its use is on Reef Central, 2014, titled “Found another option for red bug tank treatments”
Good luck to you, I know how painful it is to watch your corals being decimated when you’re only inches away.

 

[305Reefer]

Just a little update on how things have gone. After dipping in revive for a few weeks the corals really bounced back. But the bugs eventually came back. I just did a set of 3 x 6.5x interceptor doses one week apart and nothing. They are still alive, crawling around eating my OG Jawdropper and Homewrecker. My mandarin dragonet was forced to eat mysis (thank god he does) for nothing. Tore up my rocks to save my pistol shrimp and emeralds. Tanks a mess. Corals are starting to move in the wrong direction once again. Lol. ***,

I’m gonna get weird on these bugs. I have nothing to loose at this point. So I’m thinking I’ll try even higher doses of dips. Tomorrow I’m going to throw a few pieces in like 400x interceptor dip and see what happens. Also like a 6x revive dip for 5 minute or 4x for 15 minutes. See what kills corals or what kills black bugs. I’m really friggin sad about all this. So much time, money, effort and potential wasted.

If anyone has read or heard any comments recently about black bugs on R2R or FB or among other hobbyists, send it my way. I’m on Facebook as Albert Manduca.

 

[wangspeed]

If you are experimenting on them anyways, would you try Melafix and see if it affects them at all? I stopped dipping in Bayer and switched to Melafix for AEFW, but I’m not sure it works on bugs.

 

[305Reefer]

If you are experimenting on them anyways, would you try Melafix and see if it affects them at all? I stopped dipping in Bayer and switched to Melafix for AEFW, but I’m not sure it works on bugs.

Melafix is basically the same thing as Revive.. I think it will have similar results, meaning that you can shock and remove the bugs with a strong enough dose. But they can still hide in the nooks and crannies.. With a strong enough dose for long enough, you kill the bug in the dip but also potentially kill or severely hurt the coral.

 

[wangspeed]

Melafix is basically the same thing as Revive.. I think it will have similar results, meaning that you can shock and remove the bugs with a strong enough dose. But they can still hide in the nooks and crannies.. With a strong enough dose for long enough, you kill the bug in the dip but also potentially kill or severely hurt the coral.

Oh thanks. I’ve never used revive before. It has a strong tea tree oil scent? Smells like I’m in a salon when I’m dipping [emoji23]

 

[Nburg's Reef]

I had black bugs a few years back that only were observed on a monti cap and a nice wrasse cleaned them up. Maybe not the same tho since acros were fine and montis didn't seem to be significantly affected.

 

[305Reefer]

Oh thanks. I’ve never used revive before. It has a strong tea tree oil scent? Smells like I’m in a salon when I’m dipping [emoji23]

Pretty much.. Its a blend of essential oils, smells kinda like pine sol mixed with tea tree oil..

I had black bugs a few years back that only were observed on a monti cap and a nice wrasse cleaned them up. Maybe not the same tho since acros were fine and montis didn't seem to be significantly affected.

Yeah these are different, they are mostly nocturnal so wrasses dont really help as much. And they only seem to attack certain types of Acros and leave everything else well enugh alone.

 

[Nburg's Reef]

Im thinking about getting back into acros and these stories make me second guess

 

[DEWreefing]

We had a guy in our club that dips acro in fresh water for 2 to 3 seconds and the bugs would explode. Try that on a piece you don't care for see what happens. It's a 50/50 shot the coral will survive.

 

[3mm3]

Just a little update on how things have gone. After dipping in revive for a few weeks the corals really bounced back. But the bugs eventually came back. I just did a set of 3 x 6.5x interceptor doses one week apart and nothing. They are still alive, crawling around eating my OG Jawdropper and Homewrecker. My mandarin dragonet was forced to eat mysis (thank god he does) for nothing. Tore up my rocks to save my pistol shrimp and emeralds. Tanks a mess. Corals are starting to move in the wrong direction once again. Lol. ***,

I’m gonna get weird on these bugs. I have nothing to loose at this point. So I’m thinking I’ll try even higher doses of dips. Tomorrow I’m going to throw a few pieces in like 400x interceptor dip and see what happens. Also like a 6x revive dip for 5 minute or 4x for 15 minutes. See what kills corals or what kills black bugs. I’m really friggin sad about all this. So much time, money, effort and potential wasted.

If anyone has read or heard any comments recently about black bugs on R2R or FB or among other hobbyists, send it my way. I’m on Facebook as Albert Manduca.

Following along.
I did a crazy dose with interceptor on a shipment of sps with red bugs many years back with zero coral losses. I hope it works out for you.

 

[naterealbig]

Any updates on treatment?

 

[reef80]

This is a cut and paste on another posting about these bugs that I posted years ago...that just thought I would share for what it is worth....

If its what is being capture in these videos then I got them. Not sure what species or type of bug they are but they have shut down many people's tanks and such...Their movement is slug looking and adult kind of have a bent body curve. Black and Greyish is their color.
I wrote my experience on here on someones else page...but here is a quick recap. I got them about 2 or 3 years ago and could not figure out how to kill them at all. Tried a couple of other dips and nothing seemed to work and just kept coming back. I was doomed to quit and thrown in the towel... They are tough buggers for sure and remind me of super bed bugs but for sps except they decimate frags and colonies in days. I rather AEFW anyday... Anyways, I dip for no less then 8 min straight on 4x the strength they recommend with Revive and that did the trick for me. Nothing less in timing and nothing less in strength because I experiment with different dosage and they would always come back alive once they they were in the tank water again. I wanted to make sure these suckas died in my dipping cup and was just not disoriented where they can easily grab hold onto the sps and return back to the display or quarantine tank! I did that dosage 1x a week for 6weeks straight and have not seen a bug since then in over 2 years. A separate quarantine and dipping tank is the best bet. Better to put the frags and colonies on rack and remove them completely into dipping trays and alternate the racks ever time your dip to ensure nothing gets left behind. I don't want to use the same tray over and over incase they hold onto the racks or if I missed something. They are the most aggressive at eating about 1.5 to 2 hrs of lights out. They are like swarms of ants if you have reach a plague and are extremely focus and committed at eating acros around that time. They multiply very heavy and lay eggs that are not so cluster like AEFW but look just like their eggs.

Its harsh on the sps for sure and some will die with that dipping strength but it was the lessor of the two evils...do something and save something or everything else goes. I had a good grip of their behaviors and eating patterns and such and sure enough, my strategies worked out. Never again will a new sps see my display without this type of dipping and quarantine practice. I developed PTSD as a result...best of luck and don't give up!!!

 

[reef80]

This is a cut and past from another post that I wrote up that i thought I just also reference here for what it is worth....

If its what is being capture in these videos then I got them. Not sure what species or type of bug they are but they have shut down many people's tanks and such...Their movement is slug looking and adult kind of have a bent body curve. Black and Greyish is their color.
I wrote my experience on here on someones else page...but here is a quick recap. I got them about 2 or 3 years ago and could not figure out how to kill them at all. Tried a couple of other dips and nothing seemed to work and just kept coming back. I was doomed to quit and thrown in the towel... They are tough buggers for sure and remind me of super bed bugs but for sps except they decimate frags and colonies in days. I rather AEFW anyday... Anyways, I dip for no less then 8 min straight on 4x the strength they recommend with Revive and that did the trick for me. Nothing less in timing and nothing less in strength because I experiment with different dosage and they would always come back alive once they they were in the tank water again. I wanted to make sure these suckas died in my dipping cup and was just not disoriented where they can easily grab hold onto the sps and return back to the display or quarantine tank! I did that dosage 1x a week for 6weeks straight and have not seen a bug since then in over 2 years. A separate quarantine and dipping tank is the best bet. Better to put the frags and colonies on rack and remove them completely into dipping trays and alternate the racks ever time your dip to ensure nothing gets left behind. I don't want to use the same tray over and over incase they hold onto the racks or if I missed something. They are the most aggressive at eating about 1.5 to 2 hrs of lights out. They are like swarms of ants if you have reach a plague and are extremely focus and committed at eating acros around that time. They multiply very heavy and lay eggs that are not so cluster like AEFW but look just like their eggs.

Its harsh on the sps for sure and some will die with that dipping strength but it was the lessor of the two evils...do something and save something or everything else goes. I had a good grip of their behaviors and eating patterns and such and sure enough, my strategies worked out. Never again will a new sps see my display without this type of dipping and quarantine practice. I developed PTSD as a result...best of luck and don't give up!!!