Calling all apex users!

[CindyKz]

In the picture above, your Apex is reading the temp at 79.1 . Your programming tells the apex to turn the outlet on when the temp is below 78.0, and off when the temp is above 80. The graph shows the temp as decreasing down from a high of 80.3. So the outlet was turned off, and won't turn back on until you go below 78.0 again. You can correct this by programming a narrower range for the outlet to turn on and off. I use 0.4 degrees.

This doesn't explain why your BRS controller was reading at 74 degrees though. How do you have the BRS controller programmed? Does the BRS probe need calibrating? I am not familiar with the BRS controller but I know I had to calibrate my Inkbird controllers.

In any case, check the temp with a third probe and see which probe (BRS or Apex) is correct.

 

[SuncrestReef]

+1 on posting code. And check for any other code doing anything at all with outlet 7. Also heater should be in outlet 4 or 8.

They are rated for higher power.

This is only true for the EB8. All 8 outputs newer EB832 are identical.

 

[CindyKz]

Take a look at this thread on the Neptune Community forum. It gets into the weeds a bit but I found it to be very helpful.

Best Practices for heater controllers?

The sticky in this section is great for the basics. But as many are aware, heater redundancy and failsafes are critical. The Apex should never be the only thing controlling your heater(s). If you have two heaters they should be on separate EB8s at least, if not separate circuits. If they have...

forum.neptunesystems.com

 

[CindyKz]

Also, you have your fallback set to OFF, which means that the outlet will turn off if the EB832 loses communication with apex. Since you're using a second controller as well, you might want it to fall back to "on" if you live somewhere cold.

 

[Erick Armanii]

In the picture above, your Apex is reading the temp at 79.1 . Your programming tells the apex to turn the outlet on when the temp is below 78.0, and off when the temp is above 80. The graph shows the temp as decreasing down from a high of 80.3. So the outlet was turned off, and won't turn back on until you go below 78.0 again. You can correct this by programming a narrower range for the outlet to turn on and off. I use 0.4 degrees.

This doesn't explain why your BRS controller was reading at 74 degrees though. How do you have the BRS controller programmed? Does the BRS probe need calibrating? I am not familiar with the BRS controller but I know I had to calibrate my Inkbird controllers.

In any case, check the temp with a third probe and see which probe (BRS or Apex) is correct.

The apex temp probe read 76.4 and did not turn on.

 

[CindyKz]

The apex temp probe read 76.4 and did not turn on.

I guess I am just trying to understand the sequence of events. When you put your hand in the water and it felt cool, and you saw on the EB832 that the outlet status was "off", what temp was the apex reading? The heaters obviously kicked in at some point to warm the tank back up, I imagine you manually left the toggle to "on".

Take a look at your screen in Fusion. The toggle tells you what you have the outlet set to do "off", "auto", or "on". The indicator above and right of the outlet toggle tells you the actual status of the outlet, as in this screenshot. When you put your toggle to "auto" what does the indicator say? If the apex thinks the outlet is "on" but the EB832 says "off" that could be the problem.

Is the the temp range set for on<78.0 and off>80.0? I had a hard time reading it, and blowing it up on my screen made it blurry.

Lastly, how is the BRS controller programmed?

 

[CindyKz]

Also it looks like you have the logs turn on. Can you go back to the logs and correlate the outlet on/off times with the temperatures or any other factors?

 

[Erick Armanii]

I guess I am just trying to understand the sequence of events. When you put your hand in the water and it felt cool, and you saw on the EB832 that the outlet status was "off", what temp was the apex reading? The heaters obviously kicked in at some point to warm the tank back up, I imagine you manually left the toggle to "on".

Take a look at your screen in Fusion. The toggle tells you what you have the outlet set to do "off", "auto", or "on". The indicator above and right of the outlet toggle tells you the actual status of the outlet, as in this screenshot. When you put your toggle to "auto" what does the indicator say? If the apex thinks the outlet is "on" but the EB832 says "off" that could be the problem.

Is the the temp range set for on<78.0 and off>80.0? I had a hard time reading it, and blowing it up on my screen made it blurry.

Lastly, how is the BRS controller programmed?

Sequence;
- I was running a test filling the vials when I noticed the temp was cooler than normal.
- Looked at the BRS temp controller (same design as the inkbird) the screen was black.
- I assumed that somehow it got unplugged which is highly unlikely
- Checked the EB832 and the LED indicator showed the outlet was off.
- Opened apex fusion saw the temp was reading 76 and the BRSHeat outlet was set to auto
- I toggled the outlet OFF then back to AUTO. The heater was still off..
- I toggled the outlet from AUTO to ON. The heater turned on and displayed 76.4

 

[CindyKz]

Sequence;
- I was running a test filling the vials when I noticed the temp was cooler than normal.
- Looked at the BRS temp controller (same design as the inkbird) the screen was black.
- I assumed that somehow it got unplugged which is highly unlikely
- Checked the EB832 and the LED indicator showed the outlet was off.
- Opened apex fusion saw the temp was reading 76 and the BRSHeat outlet was set to auto
- I toggled the outlet OFF then back to AUTO. The heater was still off..
- I toggled the outlet from AUTO to ON. The heater turned on and displayed 76.4

Thank you, that's a lot clearer. Now, when you toggle the switch to "auto" (with the temp between 78-80) does the indicator on the upper right of the toggle show "on" or "off"? This will help determine if the problem is the apex or the power bar, since it doesn't seem to be your programming.

 

[Erick Armanii]

Thank you, that's a lot clearer. Now, when you toggle the switch to "auto" (with the temp between 78-80) does the indicator on the upper right of the toggle show "on" or "off"? This will help determine if the problem is the apex or the power bar, since it doesn't seem to be your programming.

Good question, I toggled it a few times yesterday and earlier today with the same issue so I left the toggle ON to keep temp consistent..
Ill try it again in a few. Also someone recently said there might be a delay before the heater turns back on? Is that possible?

 

[CindyKz]

Good question, I toggled it a few times yesterday and earlier today with the same issue so I left the toggle ON to keep temp consistent..
Ill try it again in a few. Also someone recently said there might be a delay before the heater turns back on? Is that possible?

I don't see a delay programmed, so I don't know a reason for one.

 

[Erick Armanii]

BRS heater display shows 79.7
Apex temp prob reads 79.1

I toggled the switch back to auto and it powered off the BRSheater also the EB832 shows that outlet is powered off

 

[Erick Armanii]

I don't see a delay programmed, so I don't know a reason for one.

Replied

 

[CindyKz]

BRS heater display shows 79.7
Apex temp prob reads 79.1

I toggled the switch back to auto and it powered off the BRSheater also the EB832 shows that outlet is powered off

Ok. Try it again after it drifts down below 78. If the temp is coming down after the outlet was turned off at 80, it will stay off until the apex reads below 78. If you wanted you could just take the probe out of the tank and put it in cool water to test.

 

[homer1475]

BRS heater display shows 79.7
Apex temp prob reads 79.1

I toggled the switch back to auto and it powered off the BRSheater also the EB832 shows that outlet is powered off

Outlet should have been off, why would you expect it to be on when the temp is above your set point of 78? What state did the outlet say it was in? on the right hand side above the actual switch, it tells you the state of the outlet(ON or OFF), not what the toggle is set to(OFF, ON, AUTO)

77.9 is when it will turn on, and 80.1 is when it will turn off. Apex logic, the statement has to be true before it will do anything. So for your setpoints, the outlet would turn on at 77.9 and off at 80.1

Set your apex for 77.5 and 81(4 degrees swing is fine). Then set the thermostat on the BRS heater to 78 and 80. That way the apex outlet stays on, and is only a redundancy for the heaters thermostat. If it gets stuck off, the apex will alert you, if it gets stuck on, the apex will shut the outlet off when it hits 81.1, but turn the heater back on when the temps fall.

I find letting the apex constantly turn the outlet on and off can actually hurt heaters with built in thermostats, so we only use the apex as a backup in this situation.

 

[CindyKz]

Outlet should have been off, why would you expect it to be on when the temp is above your set point of 78? What state did the outlet say it was in? on the right hand side above the actual switch, it tells you the state of the outlet(ON or OFF), not what the toggle is set to(OFF, ON, AUTO)

77.9 is when it will turn on, and 80.1 is when it will turn off. Apex logic, the statement has to be true before it will do anything. So for your setpoints, the outlet would turn on at 77.9 and off at 80.1

Set your apex for 77.5 and 81(4 degrees swing is fine). Then set the thermostat on the BRS heater to 78 and 80. That way the apex outlet stays on, and is only a redundancy for the heaters thermostat. If it gets stuck off, the apex will alert you, if it gets stuck on, the apex will shut the outlet off when it hits 81.1, but turn the heater back on when the temps fall.

I find letting the apex constantly turn the outlet on and off can actually hurt heaters with built in thermostats, so we only use the apex as a backup in this situation.

Troubleshooting to determine if the EB832 and the Apex are reading the same status for the outlet. Yes, "off" was the expected outcome.

I would not accept a 2 degree swing for my reef. Using the apex to control temp and the add - on BRS controller as backup will allow tighter control. I have <1 deg swing on my temp this way.

in the initial post, the OP stated he has the BRS heater and controller, so I'm pretty sure the heater doesn't have an internal thermostat.

The outlet is not turning off as expected/programmed, which is the problem.

 

[CindyKz]

Set your apex for 77.5 and 81(4 degrees swing is fine). Then set the thermostat on the BRS heater to 78 and 80. That way the apex outlet stays on, and is only a redundancy for the heaters thermostat. If it gets stuck off, the apex will alert you, if it gets stuck on, the apex will shut the outlet off when it hits 81.1, but turn the heater back on when the temps fall.

After looking at the BRS controller, it has a swing of only 0.3 deg so this way would work for him (I had large temp swings when I tried it this way using the Inkbird).

 

[Erick Armanii]

Outlet should have been off, why would you expect it to be on when the temp is above your set point of 78? What state did the outlet say it was in? on the right hand side above the actual switch, it tells you the state of the outlet(ON or OFF), not what the toggle is set to(OFF, ON, AUTO)

77.9 is when it will turn on, and 80.1 is when it will turn off. Apex logic, the statement has to be true before it will do anything. So for your setpoints, the outlet would turn on at 77.9 and off at 80.1

Set your apex for 77.5 and 81(4 degrees swing is fine). Then set the thermostat on the BRS heater to 78 and 80. That way the apex outlet stays on, and is only a redundancy for the heaters thermostat. If it gets stuck off, the apex will alert you, if it gets stuck on, the apex will shut the outlet off when it hits 81.1, but turn the heater back on when the temps fall.

I find letting the apex constantly turn the outlet on and off can actually hurt heaters with built in thermostats, so we only use the apex as a backup in this situation.

Troubleshooting to determine if the EB832 and the Apex are reading the same status for the outlet. Yes, "off" was the expected outcome.

I would not accept a 2 degree swing for my reef. Using the apex to control temp and the add - on BRS controller as backup will allow tighter control. I have <1 deg swing on my temp this way.

in the initial post, the OP stated he has the BRS heater and controller, so I'm pretty sure the heater doesn't have an internal thermostat.

The outlet is not turning off as expected/programmed, which is the problem.

From original post the outlet was not turning on when below the triggered temp.

What I assume is the outlet is stuck in the off position (and still is) when set to auto.

@Homer the BRS heater is backed up by the Apex like you suggested and I agree for the safety and Redundancy this is a good idea! As of about3-4 days ago this combo was working as expected then randomly powered off..

 

[homer1475]

Try another piece of eupiment that will rely on on/off programming. Just to rule out the energy bar outlet being bad.

 

[homer1475]

BRS heater display shows 79.7
Apex temp prob reads 79.1

I toggled the switch back to auto and it powered off the BRSheater also the EB832 shows that outlet is powered off

This what i was referencing in my post below. Your on temp is 78(temp would have to be 76.9 to turn on), your tank temp was 79.1, why should you have expected the outlet to be on?

Outlet should have been off, why would you expect it to be on when the temp is above your set point of 78? What state did the outlet say it was in? on the right hand side above the actual switch, it tells you the state of the outlet(ON or OFF), not what the toggle is set to(OFF, ON, AUTO)