Co2 scrubber / ozone question

[LEOreefer]

how would one run a co2 scrubber with a ozone generator. My co2 scrubber will be hooked into my lifereef skimmer as follows...... intake to the scrubber to the collection cup and output of scrubber to Venturi. Where would a ozone generator fit in there ?

 

[jsker]

#reefsquad

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

IMO, the uncertainty is whether the sodalime will break down ozone. There's a suggestion in the literature of ozone that it might:

https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/7129/9487582dd81c0942f5c52fb33f21556f9978.pdf

"Typical of the problems involved in working with ozone, it was necessary to prevent appreciable amounts of ozone from reaching mechanical vacuum pumps, otherwise explosions occurred in the pumps. Tubes containing soda lime were sometimes used to protect various sections of apparatus from ozone;"

Thus the ozone generator would need to be after the sodalime.

The other issue is that sodalime works best with damp air while the ozone generator works best with dry air. Bit of a conundrum there.

 

[blfuller123]

Are there any negative effects of feeding ozone and a co2 scrubber into separate ports in the skimmer venturi?

 

[PSXerholic]

IMO, the uncertainty is whether the sodalime will break down ozone. There's a suggestion in the literature of ozone that it might:

https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/7129/9487582dd81c0942f5c52fb33f21556f9978.pdf

"Typical of the problems involved in working with ozone, it was necessary to prevent appreciable amounts of ozone from reaching mechanical vacuum pumps, otherwise explosions occurred in the pumps. Tubes containing soda lime were sometimes used to protect various sections of apparatus from ozone;"

Thus the ozone generator would need to be after the sodalime.

The other issue is that sodalime works best with damp air while the ozone generator works best with dry air. Bit of a conundrum there.

Randy, @Randy Holmes-Farley
I found this article very interesting and it seems not to make sense to run the ozone enriched air to run through the scrubber first and then feed the skimmer.
It makes sense to feed the skimmer with air from the scrubber and tie in the ozone from a side feed to the skimmer that comes from a ozone generator and dryer.

Here a new tricky question, I like to reuse the skimmer cup air in recirculating mode, and asking myself if the skimmer air with remaining ozone, when passing through the scrubber, would have any bad chemical reactions going on?

-Andre

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Why recirculate the air? That inhibits oxygenation.

 

[PSXerholic]

Why recirculate the air? That inhibits oxygenation.

That is correct.
I'm being playful here and try to increase PH here in Houston, using already outside air where possible.
Here the situation and setup.

One of the overflows is aerated with outside air, then scrubbed, compressed by a hydroponic air pump and being fed into one of the overflows, with 4 large wooden airstones to have very fine bubbles. There is no standpipe and a regulation valve that maintains the overflow water level slightly below overflow, hence the entire aerated water column is what I use for degassing of Co2 and mainly aeration with fresh oxygen. The overflow is also filled with bioballs to allow longer reaction times. So a big aeration chamber.

The skimmer is used for degassing of Co2, and aeration where possible.
If I use the outside air directly, I achieve lower PH in the morning and afternoon.
IT's of course better if I scrub the skimmer air with better PH, but go through a lot of soda lime.
But If I use the air from the skimmer and recirculate it through the skimmer with the scrubber between I achieve even better and higher PH by 0.1 and the soda lime lasts much longer. Basically it mostly need to be replaced because it clumps, not because it's exhausted.
Btw. not sure what happen to the Jorvet Soda lime, but the new canisters are from China now with smaller pellets, the previous one was from Norway and looked exactly like the pellets that are in Julian S Co2 absorber.


However, I see your point of oxygenation. Need to get my O2 meter back out to verify this.

 

[blfuller123]

Here a new tricky question, I like to reuse the skimmer cup air in recirculating mode, and asking myself if the skimmer air with remaining ozone, when passing through the scrubber, would have any bad chemical reactions going on?

-Andre

This is how I have been running mine for the past 4 or 5 months.

-Brett

 

[stacksoner]

Ozone requires dry air and C02 scrubbers require moist air. The best bet is to get an ozone reactor to safely run it in your system with the correct dryer and an airflow pump that you can fine tune (alita makes great ones).

 

[AlbertGF]

Here a new tricky question, I like to reuse the skimmer cup air in recirculating mode, and asking myself if the skimmer air with remaining ozone, when passing through the scrubber, would have any bad chemical reactions going on?

-Andre

Did you find out anything about possible ozone / sodalime bad chemical reactions when recirculating scrubbed air from skimmer and using ozone?

 

[PSXerholic]

Did you find out anything about possible ozone / sodalime bad chemical reactions when recirculating scrubbed air from skimmer and using ozone?

Well, if you run the Skimmer air exhaust, saturated with Ozone and scrub it through a Soda Lime media then the Ozone is being let me say neutralized.
Means no Ozone afterwards that could be used after the Soda Lime.
There are methods and installations in industrial and military installations where Soda lime is being used to protect the environment from Ozone leaks as an emergency backup.
However it has apparently led to self ignited fires, when Ozone was supplied into Soda Lime in industrial applications.
So if you ask me, I would not run Ozone through a Soda Lime scrubber!

 

[AlbertGF]

Well, if you run the Skimmer air exhaust, saturated with Ozone and scrub it through a Soda Lime media then the Ozone is being let me say neutralized.
Means no Ozone afterwards that could be used after the Soda Lime.
There are methods and installations in industrial and military installations where Soda lime is being used to protect the environment from Ozone leaks as an emergency backup.
However it has apparently led to self ignited fires, when Ozone was supplied into Soda Lime in industrial applications.
So if you ask me, I would not run Ozone through a Soda Lime scrubber!

Wow... Thank you for you answer... I'll have to rethink my installation! Although I suppose the exhaust from skimmer is not saturated with ozone, my idea is to use as little ozone as possible, so there will be ozone in exhaust but not too much... I suppose...

 

[PSXerholic]

Wow... Thank you for you answer... I'll have to rethink my installation! Although I suppose the exhaust from skimmer is not saturated with ozone, my idea is to use as little ozone as possible, so there will be ozone in exhaust but not too much... I suppose...

I typically did only supply so much ozone, that I could not smell it in the skimmer air exhaust!
Usually the point where the exhaust doesnt stink anymore is right on.

 

[Pistondog]

how would one run a co2 scrubber with a ozone generator. My co2 scrubber will be hooked into my lifereef skimmer as follows...... intake to the scrubber to the collection cup and output of scrubber to Venturi. Where would a ozone generator fit in there ?

(assuming skimmer venturi does not have an ozone port)
Get a y adapter made of ozone safe material.
Feed co2 scrubber in one side of y, ozone into the other and the last leg of y into the venturi.
You might have to restrict the air flow on the ozone side.
Make sure to shut off power to the ozone generator if the skimmer is not running.
Skimmers meant for ozone must be made of materials that wont degrade, so your skimmer materials might suffer.
Don't use an air pump to drive the ozone, let the skimmer draw do it.
I bought a uv type generator, way better, no air dehumidifier, just bulb changes.