Current Quarantine Protocol

[huthain]

The consensus on this form is it does help much. Beyond a day or just hours and ammonia is right back and possibly even higher once prime is gone. Ammonia is not going anywhere with prime, is just gets coated for a moment when prime is used.

With all this said, a WC is your best best and dose bacteria. I have personally tried prime almost two years ago and nothing worked in the QT tank at the time. I resorted to simply doing WC’s.

Ive done roughly 80% water change but the fish still look bad. Not sure if it will take time for them to recover or theyre too far gone. The naso seems to move around every now and then so maybe its not too far gone. Not sure what more I can do. Ive added a dose of prime just now for an emergency fix so lets hope for the best. Will also add a bit of bacteria and see how it goes

 

[huthain]

Sadly the Naso just passed... not sure what else I can do this is very frustrating after months of research to start QT and the endless questions ive asked here. This is very depressing

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Jay would prime be ok with the copper power and for later on with prazipro liquid form

I'm not a big fan of Prime - do you want to use it to control high ammonia? If so, I'd suggest either water changes, adding beneficial bacterial or using Amquel to control it. Copper Power will give a false positive in many ammonia tests - often around 0.50 ppm. I don't worry about ammonia in tanks being treated with copper power or coppersafe if the level is at or below 0.50 ppm.

Prime is o.k. to use with Prazipro, but any reducing agent (Prime, sodium thiosulfate, dechlor, etc.) *may* be a problem when dosed with amine-chelated copper products. Nobody has really researched this, but it is possible that these reducing agents, if over-dosed, might break the amine-copper bond, releasing more free copper, which is more toxic to the fish.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Sadly the Naso just passed... not sure what else I can do this is very frustrating after months of research to start QT and the endless questions ive asked here. This is very depressing

Sorry to see that. How long did you have this blonde naso? There is a big issue with that species now, where they often die for no apparent reason within 40 days or so of acquisition. I'm not sure what the issue is with this species, the problem seemed to crop up during Covid, when there was a shift to collecting more of this species, but with longer transit times. It may be a supply chain handling issue - IDK for sure.

 

[huthain]

Sorry to see that. How long did you have this blonde naso? There is a big issue with that species now, where they often die for no apparent reason within 40 days or so of acquisition. I'm not sure what the issue is with this species, the problem seemed to crop up during Covid, when there was a shift to collecting more of this species, but with longer transit times. It may be a supply chain handling issue - IDK for sure.

Ive had him for about 10 days. It was shipped from Kenya ,transit times arent that long to here although it would be to thr states so I doubt transit was the culprit.

Im sure whatever killed the blue tang probably killed him. Blue tang died less than 24 hours ago. The naso followed less than 24 hours and my flame hawkfish which I bought from an established tank seems to not be doing too well.

Also today was the first day almost all the fish didnt want to feed in the morning after I removed the blue tang.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Ive had him for about 10 days. It was shipped from Kenya ,transit times arent that long to here although it would be to thr states so I doubt transit was the culprit.

Im sure whatever killed the blue tang probably killed him. Blue tang died less than 24 hours ago. The naso followed less than 24 hours and my flame hawkfish which I bought from an established tank seems to not be doing too well.

Also today was the first day almost all the fish didnt want to feed in the morning after I removed the blue tang.

Not 100%, but fish from Kenya tend to fair much better than those from SE Asia, so I don't think the issue that I spoke about was the issue here.....

 

[huthain]

Not 100%, but fish from Kenya tend to fair much better than those from SE Asia, so I don't think the issue that I spoke about was the issue here.....

I know this is probably impossible to guess what went wrong here, but if u were to take an educated guess what do you think it would be? Possibly parasites? Something in the gill? Ammonia?

 

[winxp_man]

@huthain sorry to hear this!

During this whole ordeal how were the fish breathing?

 

[huthain]

@huthain sorry to hear this!

During this whole ordeal how were the fish breathing?

So breakdown
Blue tang died 24 hours ish he seemed lethargic even though he ate well and was swimming infront of the wave maker. Found him dead this morning and removed immediately and fed.
Fox face - breathing normal fed a decent amount but less than usual
Sohal - breathing normal but started flashing at the bottom but ate decent
Cleaner wrasse - ate normal shows no signs of any stress
Naso - didnt eat, breathing rapidly, color darkened completely, died just a couple of hours ago
Flame hawkfish - hasn't eaten yet, breathing rapidly, color hasn't changed.

Hope that helps

 

[winxp_man]

So breakdown
Blue tang died 24 hours ish he seemed lethargic even though he ate well and was swimming infront of the wave maker. Found him dead this morning and removed immediately and fed.
Fox face - breathing normal fed a decent amount but less than usual
Sohal - breathing normal but started flashing at the bottom but ate decent
Cleaner wrasse - ate normal shows no signs of any stress
Naso - didnt eat, breathing rapidly, color darkened completely, died just a couple of hours ago
Flame hawkfish - hasn't eaten yet, breathing rapidly, color hasn't changed.

Hope that helps

My educated guess would be flukes. We have to remember we can’t always see physical signs of flukes. And velvet would be ruled out most likely at 2.25ppm copper.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I know this is probably impossible to guess what went wrong here, but if u were to take an educated guess what do you think it would be? Possibly parasites? Something in the gill? Ammonia?

It could be gill flukes, but without any scratching, they aren't likely to be severely infected. I ruled out ammonia due to your testing reports. Copper would take care of any protozoan parasites, so there aren't many other identifiable causes.

Can you post a video of the remaining fish?

 

[huthain]

It could be gill flukes, but without any scratching, they aren't likely to be severely infected. I ruled out ammonia due to your testing reports. Copper would take care of any protozoan parasites, so there aren't many other identifiable causes.

Can you post a video of the remaining fish?

I woke up to a dead Sohal which was showing minimal signs of scratching but had a good appetite. Im not left with the flame hawkfish who seems in stress, a cleaner wrasse who looks ok and a foxface which isnt eating and has popeye!!!

My main tank which is a 50 gallon cube running for over a year i ran it fallow 10 days ago. Out of fear of killing the rest of the fish i closed down the QT tank and moved them all back to my main display.

 

[huthain]

Videos as requested none eating much today

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Videos as requested none eating much today

I'm sorry - I am totally confused! These fish are in a reef tank, I thought you were treating them with copper?

 

[huthain]

I'm sorry - I am totally confused! These fish are in a reef tank, I thought you were treating them with copper?

I mentioned a couple of posts above out of panic because my fish were dying i closed down the tank and rushed them back to my main display

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I mentioned a couple of posts above out of panic because my fish were dying i closed down the tank and rushed them back to my main display

There is likely an uncontrolled gill parasite issue - I'm not sure which one though.

 

[winxp_man]

There is likely an uncontrolled gill parasite issue - I'm not sure which one though.

Maybe a FW dip? Without truly visible signs this one’s interesting for sure. Out side of not eating and breathing is labored.


Op how are they doing since the switch?

 

[huthain]

Maybe a FW dip? Without truly visible signs this one’s interesting for sure. Out side of not eating and breathing is labored.


Op how are they doing since the switch?

The move to my display was 10 hours ago, cleaner wrasse seems normal and eating. The flame hawk definitely moving more and has remained his color but no appetite at all. The foxface has been hiding the whole time, color is stressed and still with popeye refuses to eat even when I put the pipette right infront of him.

Whats surprising me the most is finding the sohal dead earlier, it was completely normal with very limited scratching and a large appetite. But to me that was the nail in the coffin I figured whatever is in this tank is going to wipe out the rest so I rushed and dumped them into my display, not gonna lie I didnt acclimate luckily salinity and temp are matching though, but I didnt want them in that water for a second more than they have to be. So in 24 hours took out my hippo, followed by naso then sohal! Im just hoping my foxface makes it have had him for 9 months and he was healthy.

 

[huthain]

Foxface just came out here's a video, he still doesn't want to eat and hes glass surfing. You can see the popeye clearly. @winxp_man I am assuming hes a goner hes been pacing back and forth non stop in total panic

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Maybe a FW dip? Without truly visible signs this one’s interesting for sure. Out side of not eating and breathing is labored.


Op how are they doing since the switch?

If the OP has a microscope, then FW dip as a diagnostic tool might be warranted - only Neobenedenia is large enough to see in dip water without a scope.

There is also an empirical test - if the fish improves the day after FW dip, then the issue is a gill parasite, either flukes or velvet.

But, a FW dip on a weak fish may cause its demise.