Cycling Parameters, high Nitrites

[Kruss7]

Hey, I am looking for some input on the cycling process of my 35G AIO cube.

Some background, I dosed 2ppm QuikCycl ammonia to the tank and followed the instructions on MicroBacter start xlm. I am using an API test kit for everything as well as an additional Salifert ammonia test kit

​

April 7nd
Ammonia 2ppm, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0

April 11th
Ammonia 1ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 20ppm

April 12th
Ammonia 0.5ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

April 13th
Ammonia 0.25ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

April 14th
Ammonia 0ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

I am planning on a water change to lower the Nitrate to a more desirable 20ppm.

I have read some articles on here stating that Nitrite does not matter in a marine aquarium due to chlorides out competing them in saltwater. If this is the case does this mean my tank display is cycled and ready for my quarantined clownfish? Can I add a small clean up crew?

If not what should be my next course of action?

Thank you!

 

[Idoc]

Yes, nitrites aren't an issue.

Yes, looks to be cycled

 

[Garf]

Hey, I am looking for some input on the cycling process of my 35G AIO cube.

Some background, I dosed 2ppm QuikCycl ammonia to the tank and followed the instructions on MicroBacter start xlm. I am using an API test kit for everything as well as an additional Salifert ammonia test kit

​

April 7nd
Ammonia 2ppm, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0

April 11th
Ammonia 1ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 20ppm

April 12th
Ammonia 0.5ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

April 13th
Ammonia 0.25ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

April 14th
Ammonia 0ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

I am planning on a water change to lower the Nitrate to a more desirable 20ppm.

I have read some articles on here stating that Nitrite does not matter in a marine aquarium due to chlorides out competing them in saltwater. If this is the case does this mean my tank display is cycled and ready for my quarantined clownfish? Can I add a small clean up crew?

If not what should be my next course of action?

Thank you!

Sounds good. You got a pic

 

[Azedenkae]

Hey, I am looking for some input on the cycling process of my 35G AIO cube.

Some background, I dosed 2ppm QuikCycl ammonia to the tank and followed the instructions on MicroBacter start xlm. I am using an API test kit for everything as well as an additional Salifert ammonia test kit

​

April 7nd
Ammonia 2ppm, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0

April 11th
Ammonia 1ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 20ppm

April 12th
Ammonia 0.5ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

April 13th
Ammonia 0.25ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

April 14th
Ammonia 0ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

I am planning on a water change to lower the Nitrate to a more desirable 20ppm.

I have read some articles on here stating that Nitrite does not matter in a marine aquarium due to chlorides out competing them in saltwater. If this is the case does this mean my tank display is cycled and ready for my quarantined clownfish? Can I add a small clean up crew?

If not what should be my next course of action?

Thank you!

Wow, your results are beautiful. Both the way ammonia decreases at a pretty freaking consistent rate. And beautifully, the conversion of 2ppm ammonia to 5ppm is around what you'd expect based on the molecular weights of ammonia and nitrite. If my math checks out.

I mean.

I mean look at this. LOOK AT THIS. XD

Anyways, I digress. So it looks like your ammonia oxidation rate is 0.286 (to 3 s.f.) per day, which is not bad.

Personally, I prefer that ammonia oxidation rate is 2ppm a day. And that ammonia is oxidized completely to nitrate each day. So to me, it is not cycled. I would dose 2ppm each time ammonia and nitrite drops to 0, until ammonia and nitrite reads 0 within 24 hours of dosing 2ppm ammonia.

But it is not compulsory. You can start now, just that you may have to start slow, add a few fish at a time. The advantage of making sure 2ppm of ammonia is fully oxidized to nitrate each day is that you are more than able to fully stock your tank right away, at least where ammonia and nitrite is concerned.

 

[Kruss7]

Sounds good. You got a pic

Yes, here it is!

 

[Kruss7]

Wow, your results are beautiful. Both the way ammonia decreases at a pretty freaking consistent rate. And beautifully, the conversion of 2ppm ammonia to 5ppm is around what you'd expect based on the molecular weights of ammonia and nitrite. If my math checks out.

I mean.

I mean look at this. LOOK AT THIS. XD

Anyways, I digress. So it looks like your ammonia oxidation rate is 0.286 (to 3 s.f.) per day, which is not bad.

Personally, I prefer that ammonia oxidation rate is 2ppm a day. And that ammonia is oxidized completely to nitrate each day. So to me, it is not cycled. I would dose 2ppm each time ammonia and nitrite drops to 0, until ammonia and nitrite reads 0 within 24 hours of dosing 2ppm ammonia.

But it is not compulsory. You can start now, just that you may have to start slow, add a few fish at a time. The advantage of making sure 2ppm of ammonia is fully oxidized to nitrate each day is that you are more than able to fully stock your tank right away, at least where ammonia and nitrite is concerned.

Wow, it really did have an amazing decrease.

Thank you, I’ll see if I can get the ammonia oxidation rate up!

 

[Ztealthman117]

Hey, I am looking for some input on the cycling process of my 35G AIO cube.

Some background, I dosed 2ppm QuikCycl ammonia to the tank and followed the instructions on MicroBacter start xlm. I am using an API test kit for everything as well as an additional Salifert ammonia test kit

​

April 7nd
Ammonia 2ppm, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0

April 11th
Ammonia 1ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 20ppm

April 12th
Ammonia 0.5ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

April 13th
Ammonia 0.25ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

April 14th
Ammonia 0ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

I am planning on a water change to lower the Nitrate to a more desirable 20ppm.

I have read some articles on here stating that Nitrite does not matter in a marine aquarium due to chlorides out competing them in saltwater. If this is the case does this mean my tank display is cycled and ready for my quarantined clownfish? Can I add a small clean up crew?

If not what should be my next course of action?

Thank you!

Hey, I am looking for some input on the cycling process of my 35G AIO cube.

Some background, I dosed 2ppm QuikCycl ammonia to the tank and followed the instructions on MicroBacter start xlm. I am using an API test kit for everything as well as an additional Salifert ammonia test kit

​

April 7nd
Ammonia 2ppm, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0

April 11th
Ammonia 1ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 20ppm

April 12th
Ammonia 0.5ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

April 13th
Ammonia 0.25ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

April 14th
Ammonia 0ppm, Nitrite 5ppm, Nitrate 50ppm

I am planning on a water change to lower the Nitrate to a more desirable 20ppm.

I have read some articles on here stating that Nitrite does not matter in a marine aquarium due to chlorides out competing them in saltwater. If this is the case does this mean my tank display is cycled and ready for my quarantined clownfish? Can I add a small clean up crew?

If not what should be my next course of action?

Thank you!

I literally i’m in the exact same situation with my 20 by 20 in cube. and i’m curious as to what you did and how it’s turning out. my ammonia took 2 weeks to reach 0 but my nitrite has been stuck at 0.5 and i could use some advice.

 

[brandon429]

Ignore nitrite, it no longer factors in reef cycling, your cycle is done too

How to unstick any seemingly stuck cycle

non digital ammonia test kit readings (api, Red Sea, nyos, seachem badges) make you think you aren’t cycled when indeed you are if you owned a $200 expensive seneye meter, you’d never be doubting your cycle status. since .01% of the reefing population owns these, we need a way to help the...

www.reef2reef.com

after studying that thread we see two themes

no reef cycle stalls, only non digital test kits stall


nitrite doesn’t matter, don’t own the kit at all nor run it in your tank. You don’t need to be testing for nitrate for the first several months of the tank, you need to focus on fish disease prevention as the concern. Begin testing for nitrate 4-5 months after basic reefing where you feed and change water and hand clean out the uglies phase before they take over your reef. Nitrate has no bearing in the first few months after a cycle, per above, you can message any reefer there to see how we did with their cycle. Both you and poster #1 paid money to be able to start a reef quicker than waiting for typical compliance from an unassisted cycle, and you can do that owing to the the ammonia movement shown in both cases.

 

[Lasse]

I am of opposite opinion - please read this thread Read it an judge for yourself how to handle your situation. Your cycle is stalled in the second stage - Brandon do not agree but science do.

By the way you real nitrate is probably near 0. It is the 5 ppm nitrite that give you a false reading of nitrate

Sincerely Lasse

 

[brandon429]

Lasse


do you have any links that show losses by omitting nitrite details, do you have any negative outcomes we can read about other than for nitrate testing - any actual losses on file? We show lots of happy reefs there above, all nitrite positive at the start


second question

what good does paying extra for bottle bac and a quick start do if they just have to wait three months anyway?

if someone does want to carry a quick bioload and do it ethically, what’s the quickest you’d allow them to start putting in fish

 

[Lasse]

I have answer your question so many times now - will not do it again. But reefing success is not measured fish die directly or not - it is measured in how you are able to minimize the stress of your animals. You always say that diseases is more a problem than death by nitrite - yes that´s maybe true but ask yourself why the disease rate is so high. Even if nitrite do not is acute toxic - it create stress, stress among newcomers is setting down the immune response - more likely a disease breakout.

But I will not convince you and I will for sure not change view in this issue. It is up to the readers and train their own capability of independent thinking

Sincerely Lasse

 

[brandon429]

I didn’t think you had any examples new to add, just checking.

Your statement implies that waiting for nitrite compliance eases disease, but that’s not true in the fish disease forum at all. The practice of quarantine and fallow wins out, it’s why nothing about nitrite is listed in the forum and why none of your practices are part of the stickies.

It’s easy to make claims about stress and fish disease when you avoid work done in the fish disease forum and make posts about your own tank solely.


Make posts in the fish disease forum here about waiting four months before adding fish, that will give nitrite compliance time, advise them to skip quarantine and fallow, and we can track out the outcomes. make the thread about you guiding others tanks, don’t post a single detail about your own.

Make the thread appear right here so we can track it, then add it to your nitrite studies as the thread matures with reef tank examples for fifteen pages

Fish Disease Treatment and Diagnosis

A forum for discussing treatment and diagnosing saltwater reef fish.

www.reef2reef.com

 

[DeniableArc]

I do enjoy a brandon429 discussion and most of the time it’s over my head! But I definitely know this much, you hate bottled bacteria and you love a rip clean!

 

[brandon429]

I do love disassembling reef tanks remotely and having them put back together again this is admitted

we can do so much positivity with rip cleans…saving reefs from invasion or moving them safely to new homes…


the reason we argue about nitrite issues endlessly here is because we are evolving using claims and examples what it means to select an ethical start date for reef tanks. The camp that does factor nitrite wants longer wait times for starts than the camp that doesn’t factor nitrite measure and wants exact start dates for reef tanks, consistent ethical start dates.

if Lasse and Dr. Zoidberg’s claims are true that nitrite levels common to reef tank cycles are harmful then we need to wait longer to add fish than nearly all new startup tanks are doing. They’re also directly stating the disease levels seen in posts in the fish disease forum will drop substantially if we merely ensure the tanks have no nitrite.

 

[Garf]

I literally i’m in the exact same situation with my 20 by 20 in cube. and i’m curious as to what you did and how it’s turning out. my ammonia took 2 weeks to reach 0 but my nitrite has been stuck at 0.5 and i could use some advice.

This vid is new;

 

[Lasse]

How many in the fish disease forum follow up the nitrite concentrations? Can you really say that diseases in new started tanks not can´t be caused of nitrite related stress factors? Have you hundreds of measuring to back this up? I have started 100 of aquarium my way and never have this huge problems with diseases and ugly stages. Never ever had a nitrite problem either.

We know that stress create diseases and that nitrite cause stress - these two circumstances is enough for me in order to be careful with my animals.

Sincerely Lasse

 

[brandon429]

Agreed I think it’s legit to test Lasse its not a variable we’ve controlled for.


test the claim by making a thread in the fish disease forum inviting others to post their tanks, omit using any degree of reflection or posting about your tank, manage only their cycles remotely and collect your proofs. Include nitrite data in some, exclude it from others, post your results and patterns.


even though my cycle work using others tanks isn’t scientific it’s at least fifteen pages of work using others reefs with specific start dates and you have the ability to message them and report back here any claims I made that didn’t pan out.


we can’t eliminate nitrite as a disease component until you make a clear clean test on the matter. So far I’m going off what Randy has posted about it’s non toxicity and am going off the countless logged completed cycles on file/linkable for inspection