Did Nitrite stall my cycle?

[Aeiyr]

So I have extremely (of the charts) high Nitrite levels. I set up my tank the last weekend of April. Using Dr. Tim's Fishless cycling using All-in-One and Ammonia Chloride.

I will admit I thought I'd overdosed Ammonia at first. and honestly likely did, as I didn't know the live sand I used would have Ammonia of it's own due to natural die-off, and I didn't think to check for ammonia BEFORE dosing the Chloride. I left things alone and figured time would tell. Surely enough, within a week I saw very faint levels of Nitrite and a week after that the smallest hint of Nitrate. move to a week ago, the Seachem Badge I have shows no Ammonia and I confirmed this with my RedSea test kit. All ammonia has been processed into a very high Nitrite buffer. When I say high I mean the color of the test is such an intense fuchsia it looks like a final boss item from a video game. Nitrate continues to test more intensely as well but at a much slower rate if that makes any sense.

Looked into Dr. Tims, found a video where he discussed the Nitrite bacteria having a much slowly propagation rate than the first stage bacteria, and that very high nitrite (above 0.5) CAN stall out the bacterias ability to proliferate and keep up. So today I did a water change, about 3 gallons of my 14g tank. Which after rock and sand valume is probably a closer to a 12 gallon system? maybe 12.5. I'll ballpark it and call it a 25% WC.

Tested Nitrite. still off the charts. Though detectable Nitrates did drop measurably from was was between 10-20 on the RedSea color card, to a solid 5.

The question is, do I leave it? I know nothing good happens fast in this hobby. And I'm totally on board with that. But if it IS being stalled, and another water change could help should I swap out another 3 gallons-ish?

I will also admit that partially into the cycle, I was unhappy with the rockscape I'd made, and have switched out two pieces of the dry marcorock with new ones I made (all rock in the system is dry marcorock, no liverock or cooked rock was used) But I left the sandbed as undisturbed in the process as possible, as it's my understanding that the vast majority of bacteria are going to live in my ceramic bio media and the sandbed.

Thanks in advance for any knowledge or lessons you guys drop my way.

 

[Dave1993]

nitrites do not matter in salt water if you can process ammonia you are good to go

 

[vetteguy53081]

So I have extremely (of the charts) high Nitrite levels. I set up my tank the last weekend of April. Using Dr. Tim's Fishless cycling using All-in-One and Ammonia Chloride.

I will admit I thought I'd overdosed Ammonia at first. and honestly likely did, as I didn't know the live sand I used would have Ammonia of it's own due to natural die-off, and I didn't think to check for ammonia BEFORE dosing the Chloride. I left things alone and figured time would tell. Surely enough, within a week I saw very faint levels of Nitrite and a week after that the smallest hint of Nitrate. move to a week ago, the Seachem Badge I have shows no Ammonia and I confirmed this with my RedSea test kit. All ammonia has been processed into a very high Nitrite buffer. When I say high I mean the color of the test is such an intense fuchsia it looks like a final boss item from a video game. Nitrate continues to test more intensely as well but at a much slower rate if that makes any sense.

Looked into Dr. Tims, found a video where he discussed the Nitrite bacteria having a much slowly propagation rate than the first stage bacteria, and that very high nitrite (above 0.5) CAN stall out the bacterias ability to proliferate and keep up. So today I did a water change, about 3 gallons of my 14g tank. Which after rock and sand valume is probably a closer to a 12 gallon system? maybe 12.5. I'll ballpark it and call it a 25% WC.

Tested Nitrite. still off the charts. Though detectable Nitrates did drop measurably from was was between 10-20 on the RedSea color card, to a solid 5.

The question is, do I leave it? I know nothing good happens fast in this hobby. And I'm totally on board with that. But if it IS being stalled, and another water change could help should I swap out another 3 gallons-ish?

I will also admit that partially into the cycle, I was unhappy with the rockscape I'd made, and have switched out two pieces of the dry marcorock with new ones I made (all rock in the system is dry marcorock, no liverock or cooked rock was used) But I left the sandbed as undisturbed in the process as possible, as it's my understanding that the vast majority of bacteria are going to live in my ceramic bio media and the sandbed.

Thanks in advance for any knowledge or lessons you guys drop my way.

Unless sky high (well over 100), disregard nitrates which play a role in freshwater opposed to saltwater. With your cycle, once ammonia chloride added, ammonia and nitrate will rise and fall and once the ammonia is steady for 5 days at Zero and nitrates are 20 or below for 5 days - you are cycled.

 

[Aeiyr]

nitrites do not matter in salt water if you can process ammonia you are good to go

I was unaware of this fact. Could you explain the science on it at all? Not doubting you, just very interested to learn how that works.

Unless sky high (well over 100), disregard nitrates which play a role in freshwater opposed to saltwater. With your cycle, once ammonia chloride added, ammonia and nitrate will rise and fall and once the ammonia is steady for 5 days at Zero and nitrates are 20 or below for 5 days - you are cycled.

I would definitely say the nitrate held at 20 or below for at least a week with ammonia at 0. That being said, Ammonia remained at 0 because there is nothing living in the tank other than said bacteria. Am I done then? in just three weeks? Should I re-dose Chloride at all for a second round of testing or just, drop in a fishy friend?

 

[vetteguy53081]

I was unaware of this fact. Could you explain the science on it at all? Not doubting you, just very interested to learn how that works.

I would definitely say the nitrate held at 20 or below for at least a week with ammonia at 0. That being said, Ammonia remained at 0 because there is nothing living in the tank other than said bacteria. Am I done then? in just three weeks? Should I re-dose Chloride at all for a second round of testing or just, drop in a fishy friend?

yes you are

 

[IslandLifeReef]

I was unaware of this fact. Could you explain the science on it at all? Not doubting you, just very interested to learn how that works.

I would definitely say the nitrate held at 20 or below for at least a week with ammonia at 0. That being said, Ammonia remained at 0 because there is nothing living in the tank other than said bacteria. Am I done then? in just three weeks? Should I re-dose Chloride at all for a second round of testing or just, drop in a fishy friend?

What are you using to test for Nitrate? If your Nitrite is still sky high, I would recommend a large water change to bring it down and then wait. Stocking your aquarium before both ammonia and nitrite are at 0.00 won't kill the fish, but it will complicate things later as you fight the ugly phase. Also, if you are keeping corals, high nitrate can be a problem. As long as you have measurable nitrite in your tank, you will not know that actual level of your nitrate because most test kits on the market won't give you a proper nitrate reading with nitrite in the system.

 

[Aeiyr]

What are you using to test for Nitrate? If your Nitrite is still sky high, I would recommend a large water change to bring it down and then wait. Stocking your aquarium before both ammonia and nitrite are at 0.00 won't kill the fish, but it will complicate things later as you fight the ugly phase. Also, if you are keeping corals, high nitrate can be a problem. As long as you have measurable nitrite in your tank, you will not know that actual level of your nitrate because most test kits on the market won't give you a proper nitrate reading with nitrite in the system.

I'm using the Red Sea Marine Care Multi Kit for all of my Ammonia, Nitrite, and Nitrate readings. Nitrate showed about a half value drop with the water change I did, but Nitrite still shows a way more intense color than the card reads at its highest value. Both my Seachem badge and manual Red Sea testing shows Ammonia at full Zero.

As for tank inhabitants, I have nothing. No fish, No corals, no Inverts. The only living thing in the tank would be the Bacteria, and some Coralline Algea.

To explain the coralline, I stupidly purchase a bottle from AlgeaBarn earlier than I had meant to, and needed to use it before the expiration date on the bottle. It does say it includes nitrifying bacteria species, so I figure it could not have harmed anything. Best case, I get a jumpstart on my Coralline, and the worst that can happen is the spores remain dormant or die off and oh well, a $20 lesson learned. I will also be looking to drop in some AlgeaBarn Ecopods for a microfauna population once I'm sure the cycle is good to help diversify things in my favor and brace for Uglies.

On the note of corals, I am looking to keep Softies and LPS in a few months (3 to 4 months is what I hear people suggest to newbies), and maybe once I get my lighting dialed in half a year or more from now, a Derasa Clam. I will not be venturing into SPS with this tank.

 

[brandon429]

If you do a full water change you'll have clean water and cycling bacteria on the rocks

Dr Tim didn't tell us this trick. It works great, saves you from having to wait. Ten days was enough to build up the required bacteria

It's not required to wait until the wastewater clears when you're past day ten of wait time= rule of new cycling science

 

[Dave1993]

I was unaware of this fact. Could you explain the science on it at all? Not doubting you, just very interested to learn how that works.

I would definitely say the nitrate held at 20 or below for at least a week with ammonia at 0. That being said, Ammonia remained at 0 because there is nothing living in the tank other than said bacteria. Am I done then? in just three weeks? Should I re-dose Chloride at all for a second round of testing or just, drop in a fishy friend?

salt water are not bothered about nitrites unless VERY HIGH

 

[MnFish1]

There is no reason to worry about nitrites (as a toxin) - however - nitrates are turned into nitrates - which one would want to remove. I might suggest 10% changes each day - measuring nitrate

 

[Aeiyr]

There is no reason to worry about nitrites (as a toxin) - however - nitrates are turned into nitrates - which one would want to remove. I might suggest 10% changes each day - measuring nitrate

I am considering doing that until the nitrites are gone for the first week or two once i add the first two small fish. Last night I decided to dose 1ppm ammonia chloride to gauge how quickly the bacteria I do have will convert it. it looks to be handled within 12 hours. The stage two bacteria will propagate more as time rolls on correct? until I have enough that Ammonia and Nitrite are being processed nearly as fast as livestock add them/oxidize?

 

[MnFish1]

I am considering doing that until the nitrites are gone for the first week or two once i add the first two small fish. Last night I decided to dose 1ppm ammonia chloride to gauge how quickly the bacteria I do have will convert it. it looks to be handled within 12 hours. The stage two bacteria will propagate more as time rolls on correct? until I have enough that Ammonia and Nitrite are being processed nearly as fast as livestock add them/oxidize?

I would stop adding ammonia and wait until your nitrate rises

 

[Aeiyr]

I would stop adding ammonia and wait until your nitrate rises

Nitrate had risen. Was between 10-20ppm on the RedSea color card priot to me swapping out a nee batch of water

 

[IslandLifeReef]

Nitrate had risen. Was between 10-20ppm on the RedSea color card priot to me swapping out a nee batch of water

Since you are using the Red Sea nitrate test kit, you don't really know what your nitrate is since you have nitrite in the water. The test kit turns nitrate to nitrite, and then measures total nitrite and presents it as nitrate. Since you already have nitrite in the system, you may have nitrate that the test kit is turning to nitrite and then measuring, or you may only be measuring the nitrite already in the system. There is no way to know.

As @MnFish1 said, stop adding ammonia. Either do a couple large water changes to get the nitrite to 0.00 ppm or do multiple smaller water changes. Once your nitrite is at 0.00 ppm, then you can add some ammonia and see how fast it converts it to nitrate. Both your ammonia and nitrite should read 0.00 ppm within 24 hours of adding the ammonia. The last thing you want to do is start rushing things.

 

[a.t.t.r]

Cycles don't stall

 

[MnFish1]

Cycles don't stall

Who said they did - besides the OP - who has been corrected?