Does my tank still have Velvet?

[srcleary]

Hi. It's been a while since I posted and I almost feel like I've left and come back. :-)

I had a tragic situation with Velvet in my two FOWLR tanks. An 800g and a 1,000g (not including sumps). Completely my fault and thats another story.

Anyway I have a stingray, sharks and eels in the 1,000g display. When the Velvet broke out, I was able to set up a 600g hospital tank and removed all the boney fish into QT and started treatment. I lost about 25-30% of the fish.

I left the ray, sharks and eels in the tank and didn't know how to treat. I left it without the boney fish for 10+ weeks. I knew the sharks and eels could carry the parasite.

Three weeks ago I added three fish back into the tank that came out of a healthy reef tank that was being broken down. I added a flame angel, a long nose hawk and a Scopa tang. They are all doing fine. One week ago there were more fish from a tank breakdown and I added a mimic tang and a pyramid butterfly.

As of today, they are all doing fine. My desire is to add back in all the fish I removed and went through QT. Plus I have added a few more than have been through QT. I have about 15 large angels and tangs.

When would it be safe (as safe as reasonable) to add these back in to the 1,000g? Obviously I don't want to battle Velvet or Ich again and I had gone two years without any issues. And I thought about adding another fish that is more parasite prone. I do have a powder blue tang but he is now blind from the secondary infections.

I had to treat the entire 800g display and they are also now fine but I lost about 35% of the fish there as well.

I wondered if I had Ich and not Velvet but I could NOT count all the white spots (it was like flour) and they were swimming into the powerhead none stop. And I had to deal with secondary bacterial infections. Honestly I am surprised I saved as many as I did, which is why I questioned whether I had Velvet.

What are your thoughts on how I should add fish back in? I have read Velvet will usually show up in 14 days unless a fish has recently gone through copper, which as far as I know, the fish I added so far, have not. They came from a reef. And I want to get to the point where I can add all my current fish from the 600g hospital back in.

Thanks, - Steve

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi. It's been a while since I posted and I almost feel like I've left and come back. :-)

I had a tragic situation with Velvet in my two FOWLR tanks. An 800g and a 1,000g (not including sumps). Completely my fault and thats another story.

Anyway I have a stingray, sharks and eels in the 1,000g display. When the Velvet broke out, I was able to set up a 600g hospital tank and removed all the boney fish into QT and started treatment. I lost about 25-30% of the fish.

I left the ray, sharks and eels in the tank and didn't know how to treat. I left it without the boney fish for 10+ weeks. I knew the sharks and eels could carry the parasite.

Three weeks ago I added three fish back into the tank that came out of a healthy reef tank that was being broken down. I added a flame angel, a long nose hawk and a Scopa tang. They are all doing fine. One week ago there were more fish from a tank breakdown and I added a mimic tang and a pyramid butterfly.

As of today, they are all doing fine. My desire is to add back in all the fish I removed and went through QT. Plus I have added a few more than have been through QT. I have about 15 large angels and tangs.

When would it be safe (as safe as reasonable) to add these back in to the 1,000g? Obviously I don't want to battle Velvet or Ich again and I had gone two years without any issues. And I thought about adding another fish that is more parasite prone. I do have a powder blue tang but he is now blind from the secondary infections.

I had to treat the entire 800g display and they are also now fine but I lost about 35% of the fish there as well.

I wondered if I had Ich and not Velvet but I could NOT count all the white spots (it was like flour) and they were swimming into the powerhead none stop. And I had to deal with secondary bacterial infections. Honestly I am surprised I saved as many as I did, which is why I questioned whether I had Velvet.

What are your thoughts on how I should add fish back in? I have read Velvet will usually show up in 14 days unless a fish has recently gone through copper, which as far as I know, the fish I added so far, have not. They came from a reef. And I want to get to the point where I can add all my current fish from the 600g hospital back in.

Thanks, - Steve

Best is . . .. if the tank has been Fallow (without fish ) for 6-8 weeks, should be safe for re=stock. If less than this period, get to 7 weeks and then do water change. This will apply to both ich and velvet

 

[jadedog]

If you left the rays shark and eels in the tank there's some possibility ich or velvet remains in the tank I think. Id be wary on adding new fish even if they came from a "clean tank" ideally you still probably wanna quarantine them too.

 

[MnFish1]

Hi. It's been a while since I posted and I almost feel like I've left and come back. :-)

I had a tragic situation with Velvet in my two FOWLR tanks. An 800g and a 1,000g (not including sumps). Completely my fault and thats another story.

Anyway I have a stingray, sharks and eels in the 1,000g display. When the Velvet broke out, I was able to set up a 600g hospital tank and removed all the boney fish into QT and started treatment. I lost about 25-30% of the fish.

I left the ray, sharks and eels in the tank and didn't know how to treat. I left it without the boney fish for 10+ weeks. I knew the sharks and eels could carry the parasite.

Just to make sure - you have never had a full fallow period?
Sharks do not get velvet, Rays can, and eels can.(Some are more resistant than others)

Three weeks ago I added three fish back into the tank that came out of a healthy reef tank that was being broken down. I added a flame angel, a long nose hawk and a Scopa tang. They are all doing fine. One week ago there were more fish from a tank breakdown and I added a mimic tang and a pyramid butterfly.

Assuming they also were not quarantined

As of today, they are all doing fine. My desire is to add back in all the fish I removed and went through QT. Plus I have added a few more than have been through QT. I have about 15 large angels and tangs.

When would it be safe (as safe as reasonable) to add these back in to the 1,000g? Obviously I don't want to battle Velvet or Ich again and I had gone two years without any issues. And I thought about adding another fish that is more parasite prone. I do have a powder blue tang but he is now blind from the secondary infections.

Given the fact that your tank had no fallow period - there is no possible way to answer this question (see below) - its unclear whether your treatment of the tank was enough. I personally would not add them until absolutely necessary (i.e. maybe give the fish in the current display 2 months with no more additions.

I had to treat the entire 800g display and they are also now fine but I lost about 35% of the fish there as well.

What did you treat with? Which will make a difference

I wondered if I had Ich and not Velvet but I could NOT count all the white spots (it was like flour) and they were swimming into the powerhead none stop. And I had to deal with secondary bacterial infections. Honestly I am surprised I saved as many as I did, which is why I questioned whether I had Velvet.

Velvet in marine fish mainly causes breathing issues the mucosal irritation is seen late in the disease. The symptoms suggest velvet to me. Either way - both would have required treatment with either copper.

What are your thoughts on how I should add fish back in? I have read Velvet will usually show up in 14 days unless a fish has recently gone through copper, which as far as I know, the fish I added so far, have not. They came from a reef. And I want to get to the point where I can add all my current fish from the 600g hospital back in.

Thanks, - Steve

What a mess you've been through - it seems like things are stabilizing. Because I don't believe your 14 day rule - and because you had such a bad time - I would wait 8 weeks. That will give you time to watch both groups of fish for any problems. (Call it an observation quarantine). I hope your fish do well going forward

 

[srcleary]

It is true I did not technically allow the tank to go fallow. And I know it is true that sharks and eels can carry Ich and Velvet. I simply removed the boney fish for 10 weeks and then added three "canary" fish to see what would happen. In three weeks they have remained symptom free.

I have no issues waiting longer but I am curious if I had Velvet in the tank, shouldn't one of the fish be showing symptoms by now? I have read frequently that a fish, unless recently having been treated for Velvet, will show symptoms within 14 days.

But again, I am not in a rush. I am actually quite encouraged that I have made it this far and it has given me some hope that the sharks and eels did NOT in fact carry the Velvet and my tank went through a "fallow" type period without removing them. I am hoping what I am going through might be helpful to others in the future. Assuming the Velvet is actually gone.

I have not moved any of my treated fish over yet assuming they might have some resistance to Velvet having just gone through it. I treated all of them with Copper Safe. 45 days therapeutic and fairly high levels to kill the Velvet. It wasn't easy.

And I am obviously not keen on adding anyone else's fish whereas now I have 5 fish in the tank that are basically on observation QT. I am probably going to move my Powder Blue tang as he is blind (or mostly blind) and may find food easier in the bigger tank with less fish and more algae.

I guess the only question left is how much longer I should wait. Seems a full 8 weeks of observation should be enough to have confidence to add my other fish back?

Steve

 

[jadedog]

It is true I did not technically allow the tank to go fallow. And I know it is true that sharks and eels can carry Ich and Velvet. I simply removed the boney fish for 10 weeks and then added three "canary" fish to see what would happen. In three weeks they have remained symptom free.

I have no issues waiting longer but I am curious if I had Velvet in the tank, shouldn't one of the fish be showing symptoms by now? I have read frequently that a fish, unless recently having been treated for Velvet, will show symptoms within 14 days.

But again, I am not in a rush. I am actually quite encouraged that I have made it this far and it has given me some hope that the sharks and eels did NOT in fact carry the Velvet and my tank went through a "fallow" type period without removing them. I am hoping what I am going through might be helpful to others in the future. Assuming the Velvet is actually gone.

I have not moved any of my treated fish over yet assuming they might have some resistance to Velvet having just gone through it. I treated all of them with Copper Safe. 45 days therapeutic and fairly high levels to kill the Velvet. It wasn't easy.

And I am obviously not keen on adding anyone else's fish whereas now I have 5 fish in the tank that are basically on observation QT. I am probably going to move my Powder Blue tang as he is blind (or mostly blind) and may find food easier in the bigger tank with less fish and more algae.

I guess the only question left is how much longer I should wait. Seems a full 8 weeks of observation should be enough to have confidence to add my other fish back?

Steve

I feel like your just going to have to make a judgement call. If you don't plan on removing the shark eels etc. Your tank was never truly fallow and you take on the risk(low or high) of still possibly having velvet. Id say its a good sign that your new fishes don't show any illness. Maybe observe for a couple more weeks? I'd look into if velvet can become dormant and re appear later on.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

It is true I did not technically allow the tank to go fallow. And I know it is true that sharks and eels can carry Ich and Velvet. I simply removed the boney fish for 10 weeks and then added three "canary" fish to see what would happen. In three weeks they have remained symptom free.

I have no issues waiting longer but I am curious if I had Velvet in the tank, shouldn't one of the fish be showing symptoms by now? I have read frequently that a fish, unless recently having been treated for Velvet, will show symptoms within 14 days.

But again, I am not in a rush. I am actually quite encouraged that I have made it this far and it has given me some hope that the sharks and eels did NOT in fact carry the Velvet and my tank went through a "fallow" type period without removing them. I am hoping what I am going through might be helpful to others in the future. Assuming the Velvet is actually gone.

I have not moved any of my treated fish over yet assuming they might have some resistance to Velvet having just gone through it. I treated all of them with Copper Safe. 45 days therapeutic and fairly high levels to kill the Velvet. It wasn't easy.

And I am obviously not keen on adding anyone else's fish whereas now I have 5 fish in the tank that are basically on observation QT. I am probably going to move my Powder Blue tang as he is blind (or mostly blind) and may find food easier in the bigger tank with less fish and more algae.

I guess the only question left is how much longer I should wait. Seems a full 8 weeks of observation should be enough to have confidence to add my other fish back?

Steve

I agree - you may need to make a judgement call here. Generally, 45 days with no symptoms is a good indication that all active ectoparasites in the tank have either died out, or gone dormant. If you wait longer, it's just that much safer.

 

[srcleary]

Thanks for all the feedback. I will wait a total of 45 - 60 days before moving any fish over. And cross my fingers!

 

[winxp_man]

Thanks for all the feedback. I will wait a total of 45 - 60 days before moving any fish over. And cross my fingers!

I would do the 76 days. I know time is money. But cutting the period short can bring back problems. I did cut my time short once and it was not nice…..

 

[MnFish1]

Note - repeating some of my answers

It is true I did not technically allow the tank to go fallow. And I know it is true that sharks and eels can carry Ich and Velvet. I simply removed the boney fish for 10 weeks and then added three "canary" fish to see what would happen. In three weeks they have remained symptom free.

All good

I have no issues waiting longer but I am curious if I had Velvet in the tank, shouldn't one of the fish be showing symptoms by now? I have read frequently that a fish, unless recently having been treated for Velvet, will show symptoms within 14 days.

No - not necessarily. A low stocking density may mean velvet etc do not find a host in time. If they do - they don't find enough to multiple - this also applies to your canary fish idea

But again, I am not in a rush. I am actually quite encouraged that I have made it this far and it has given me some hope that the sharks and eels did NOT in fact carry the Velvet and my tank went through a "fallow" type period without removing them. I am hoping what I am going through might be helpful to others in the future. Assuming the Velvet is actually gone.

Me too.

I have not moved any of my treated fish over yet assuming they might have some resistance to Velvet having just gone through it. I treated all of them with Copper Safe. 45 days therapeutic and fairly high levels to kill the Velvet. It wasn't easy.

Fish may develop some immunity to velvet. It's not as well studies as ich. The mortality is often 100% in an overstocked tank - but not always

And I am obviously not keen on adding anyone else's fish whereas now I have 5 fish in the tank that are basically on observation QT. I am probably going to move my Powder Blue tang as he is blind (or mostly blind) and may find food easier in the bigger tank with less fish and more algae.

I would not.

I guess the only question left is how much longer I should wait. Seems a full 8 weeks of observation should be enough to have confidence to add my other fish back?

Yes - it would seem that way - But - Since neither of us know - it's hard to rubber stamp it. I would say - have you considered an aquabiomics test for pathogens.

Steve

You're welcome - Of course this is stressful, etc - Hopefully it will work out

 

[littlefoxx]

More time is best, I think since you have a huge A** WT tank then there isnt as much of a rush as those of us with like only a 40B QT and a 300 display (personal experiance)

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Just to clarify - the “76 days” you hear all over the place was from a study in a lab many years ago - but for ich, Cryptocaryon. It was a Petri dish study at low temperatures, in a bacteria free solution. Real world clearing time for ich is 60 days.

Velvet, Amyloodinium, has a shorter life cycle. Noga days three weeks, but less than 45 days makes me nervous.