SmockKnives
New Member
Ok so a little info first. I originally posted this on another forum and got lots of insults and reasons why this will not work. Personally I thought most if not all the reasons were weak. Now if you are happy with your current controller and don't like my idea, that is totally fine. But please be respectful and a simple, "I love my system and it works great as is" works just fine. No reason to call me stupid. I'm a product designer and have designed thousands of products and I'm listed as inventor on 7 patents. So I'm not stupid. I may be wrong and that is perfectly ok. No one system will fit everyone but when I sit back and look at my current options is just makes sense. So please give me your input. I'm mostly looking for reasons on how to improve the idea.
Ok I've been out of the hobby for a while and just got back into it. My last controller was a ReefKeeper 2. So now that I'm back the first thing I needed to do was decide if my old equipment was worth keeping and if not, what do I replace it with? Most of today's components have their own internal or remote controls. Just a couple of examples AI Hydra, Radion, Vortech pumps, auto top off units, and dosing pumps. You almost don't need a controller at all. I've had my new system hooked up to a DJ light bar for over a month and everything worked just fine. My only problem is I didn't know my PH and I couldn't have back up controls for my heater. Plus I wanted to add extra float valves for backups and control of my BRS dosing pumps. I hate plug in timers. But in reality everything could have been done without a controller. This would have been crazy 5+ years ago. Nothing had internal controls. So my point is, that if you want to sell controllers you need to step up the game. From what I can tell, Digital Aquatics are asleep at the wheel and I guess they will be gone in the near future. Nothing new coming from them in a while. Now Neptune.. yes they are innovating and probably at the top of the food chain right now. I bought one. And after 12 hours and 3 hours with tech support, I'm still not up and running. Not to mention having to send them $150 for them to send me a replacement part. Yep their fault and I've spent $680 and still not working. I'm suppose to get the $150 back once I return the old unit but in the mean time I'm out $150. Not cool. I've read a ton of comments on people having problems with updates and not connecting. I love the idea of being able to get online to monitor and control everything but if software updates crash your system can you really trust it? The customer support staff was nice but it took 3 hours of trying the same thing 30 times to figure out it's a bad unit. This process should have taken 5 minutes. Just saying.. Meanwhile I got one of the new Vortech MP40 quiet drives and it arrived not so quiet. Like a boat motor. Called Ecotech and in 5 minutes I was giving my address for a new wet side. They sent it out with a return shipping label and a free gift for my time. Fast and no hassle. Granted it wasn't as expensive of a part but I've had several calls into Ecotech or Aqua Illuminations and those guys are customer service at it's best.
Yes yes so what is my point? I would really like to see another controller product on the market, and yes from Ecotech/AI. You guys might be like, "so what"? Well I'm a product designer and I know companies do listen to feedback. Well at least they should. Sometimes it takes someone to say, "Hey Ecotech build it and they will come". Now will anyone from there read this? I have no clue but it makes me feel better by posting this and at least it's not another, "which skimmer is best". Got to give me credit for originality.
And if we are going to ask them to make it, what do we want it to be? Me personally I want a system that is designed to WORK, not designed to make me buy more stuff. I would have swore but can't remember if I'm aloud. lol Buy a module here, buy a module there... why didn't you think of putting it in the main unit in the first place? Oh ya to get me to spend more money. And I'm sorry but at $530 for a simple brain no smarter than a MP3 player and a $15 power bar, that is just a rip off. I can buy a HP laptop for $530. Input in - display, power outlet on/off. Rocket science. So if I'm going to pay $530 I want enough outlets to run a typical system; not just short so I have to buy another power block, and all the input outlets we would need for that system. I can totally see a Nano, Reef, and Pro systems. I'll focus on the Reef or midsize system as an example. The typical system most would need and I'm ok with around a $500 price tag for this system. Ok how many outlets do we need? Typical system; ATO, return, powerheads, skimmer, 2 dosing pumps, heater, light, reactor, and sump light. So right off the bat all systems that only give 8 outlets are not enough. Say 10-12 total on a base system. You know all of you have a simple power block under your stand. Nano could have less because you usually don't have a sump or dosing pumps so you could get away with 6. Pro system maybe two 10-12 outlet blocks. But 8 just isn't enough and they know it.
Next is monitoring. Reef or middle level system. What would you like to see on it? Personally; PH, ORP, Salinity, Temp, float/switch inputs, leak detection.. you might have others. But they should all have BUILT IN PORTS! Totally understandable that you might have to buy the actual probes or switches but the unit should have them built in. No buying another module to control something that a $530 controller should have already. Ridiculous. If I want to add salinity probe to my system I should just have to buy the probe and plug it in. Not run more wires and mount another module. More money and more possible areas for problems.
Now... wireless. Built it in! And one of the reasons I recommend Ecotech for this project. Beside excellent customer support, built in the USA, they already have wireless control of Vortech pumps, and two of the most popular LED lights out there. No more Director or more modules. Have the controller with built in wireless that can automatically connect to any Vortech, Hydra, or Radion. Imagine all the wires and clutter you could eliminate! Wow! Now to take it up a notch, come out with wireless feeders, webcams, and dosing pumps. A controller with built in wireless has endless possibilities for new products. Just plug in the power to the controller and connect.
Display.. do we really need one? Now this can be an add on. But again build a port for it on the main unit. No module. I like to see what my tank is doing via the display but if the unit is wireless, I would just use my phone or computer. I believe both Reefkeeper and Apex you can do online or phone control but connecting and updating seem to be a huge issue. This I don't have a lot of advise other than make it simple and make it work. Personally I would like to buy an iPad Mini and mount it right beside my tank just for tank control and calendar for scheduling maintenance. Something I've been wanting since day one.
Now I'm sure I'll get some nasty grams for this post but my honest intent is to push the market to come out with something done right instead of done to cheat us into spending more money. If you want me to spend more money, come out with a skimmer that wirelessly tells my wireless controller that the cup is full. Or a product that eliminates all the clutter of modules and wires. Trust me Neptune and Digital Aquatics we know when we are being ripped off. Unfortunately we can't do anything about it at the moment. Hopefully someone... Ecotech, will step up and do the right thing. Because honestly systems today do not 'NEED' a controller. So it has to be really compelling benefit to buy one.
And anyone that wants to step up to the plate, let me know, I'll sign a waver and give you all my ideas I have to help. I've designed thousands of products and know I could help. Just my two cents. Let me know your thoughts. And if you are going to give reasons why not this will work, please add how it can be changed to work. The goal is better products to help this wonderful hobby. And if you are like me and what them to make something, let them know. Sometimes the only way to get new products is to ask for them.
Ok I've been out of the hobby for a while and just got back into it. My last controller was a ReefKeeper 2. So now that I'm back the first thing I needed to do was decide if my old equipment was worth keeping and if not, what do I replace it with? Most of today's components have their own internal or remote controls. Just a couple of examples AI Hydra, Radion, Vortech pumps, auto top off units, and dosing pumps. You almost don't need a controller at all. I've had my new system hooked up to a DJ light bar for over a month and everything worked just fine. My only problem is I didn't know my PH and I couldn't have back up controls for my heater. Plus I wanted to add extra float valves for backups and control of my BRS dosing pumps. I hate plug in timers. But in reality everything could have been done without a controller. This would have been crazy 5+ years ago. Nothing had internal controls. So my point is, that if you want to sell controllers you need to step up the game. From what I can tell, Digital Aquatics are asleep at the wheel and I guess they will be gone in the near future. Nothing new coming from them in a while. Now Neptune.. yes they are innovating and probably at the top of the food chain right now. I bought one. And after 12 hours and 3 hours with tech support, I'm still not up and running. Not to mention having to send them $150 for them to send me a replacement part. Yep their fault and I've spent $680 and still not working. I'm suppose to get the $150 back once I return the old unit but in the mean time I'm out $150. Not cool. I've read a ton of comments on people having problems with updates and not connecting. I love the idea of being able to get online to monitor and control everything but if software updates crash your system can you really trust it? The customer support staff was nice but it took 3 hours of trying the same thing 30 times to figure out it's a bad unit. This process should have taken 5 minutes. Just saying.. Meanwhile I got one of the new Vortech MP40 quiet drives and it arrived not so quiet. Like a boat motor. Called Ecotech and in 5 minutes I was giving my address for a new wet side. They sent it out with a return shipping label and a free gift for my time. Fast and no hassle. Granted it wasn't as expensive of a part but I've had several calls into Ecotech or Aqua Illuminations and those guys are customer service at it's best.
Yes yes so what is my point? I would really like to see another controller product on the market, and yes from Ecotech/AI. You guys might be like, "so what"? Well I'm a product designer and I know companies do listen to feedback. Well at least they should. Sometimes it takes someone to say, "Hey Ecotech build it and they will come". Now will anyone from there read this? I have no clue but it makes me feel better by posting this and at least it's not another, "which skimmer is best". Got to give me credit for originality.
And if we are going to ask them to make it, what do we want it to be? Me personally I want a system that is designed to WORK, not designed to make me buy more stuff. I would have swore but can't remember if I'm aloud. lol Buy a module here, buy a module there... why didn't you think of putting it in the main unit in the first place? Oh ya to get me to spend more money. And I'm sorry but at $530 for a simple brain no smarter than a MP3 player and a $15 power bar, that is just a rip off. I can buy a HP laptop for $530. Input in - display, power outlet on/off. Rocket science. So if I'm going to pay $530 I want enough outlets to run a typical system; not just short so I have to buy another power block, and all the input outlets we would need for that system. I can totally see a Nano, Reef, and Pro systems. I'll focus on the Reef or midsize system as an example. The typical system most would need and I'm ok with around a $500 price tag for this system. Ok how many outlets do we need? Typical system; ATO, return, powerheads, skimmer, 2 dosing pumps, heater, light, reactor, and sump light. So right off the bat all systems that only give 8 outlets are not enough. Say 10-12 total on a base system. You know all of you have a simple power block under your stand. Nano could have less because you usually don't have a sump or dosing pumps so you could get away with 6. Pro system maybe two 10-12 outlet blocks. But 8 just isn't enough and they know it.
Next is monitoring. Reef or middle level system. What would you like to see on it? Personally; PH, ORP, Salinity, Temp, float/switch inputs, leak detection.. you might have others. But they should all have BUILT IN PORTS! Totally understandable that you might have to buy the actual probes or switches but the unit should have them built in. No buying another module to control something that a $530 controller should have already. Ridiculous. If I want to add salinity probe to my system I should just have to buy the probe and plug it in. Not run more wires and mount another module. More money and more possible areas for problems.
Now... wireless. Built it in! And one of the reasons I recommend Ecotech for this project. Beside excellent customer support, built in the USA, they already have wireless control of Vortech pumps, and two of the most popular LED lights out there. No more Director or more modules. Have the controller with built in wireless that can automatically connect to any Vortech, Hydra, or Radion. Imagine all the wires and clutter you could eliminate! Wow! Now to take it up a notch, come out with wireless feeders, webcams, and dosing pumps. A controller with built in wireless has endless possibilities for new products. Just plug in the power to the controller and connect.
Display.. do we really need one? Now this can be an add on. But again build a port for it on the main unit. No module. I like to see what my tank is doing via the display but if the unit is wireless, I would just use my phone or computer. I believe both Reefkeeper and Apex you can do online or phone control but connecting and updating seem to be a huge issue. This I don't have a lot of advise other than make it simple and make it work. Personally I would like to buy an iPad Mini and mount it right beside my tank just for tank control and calendar for scheduling maintenance. Something I've been wanting since day one.
Now I'm sure I'll get some nasty grams for this post but my honest intent is to push the market to come out with something done right instead of done to cheat us into spending more money. If you want me to spend more money, come out with a skimmer that wirelessly tells my wireless controller that the cup is full. Or a product that eliminates all the clutter of modules and wires. Trust me Neptune and Digital Aquatics we know when we are being ripped off. Unfortunately we can't do anything about it at the moment. Hopefully someone... Ecotech, will step up and do the right thing. Because honestly systems today do not 'NEED' a controller. So it has to be really compelling benefit to buy one.
And anyone that wants to step up to the plate, let me know, I'll sign a waver and give you all my ideas I have to help. I've designed thousands of products and know I could help. Just my two cents. Let me know your thoughts. And if you are going to give reasons why not this will work, please add how it can be changed to work. The goal is better products to help this wonderful hobby. And if you are like me and what them to make something, let them know. Sometimes the only way to get new products is to ask for them.
