Electrical Question

[KJoFan]

If there are any electricians in the house I'd appreciate some input.

Full story as concise as I can make it is a few weeks ago, a burner on our electric stove went out which ended up tripping the breaker for the stove. Not a big deal (other than it's a $600 fix) we've been getting along fine without the burner. Fast forward to a day or so ago, our dryer is tripping the breaker. After much investigation it appears the heating coil must be touching the housing somehow and heating more than it should in terms of time and heat. When running the dryer on air dry, the coil is glowing. Ok, so we unplugged it last night because we read it can heat even when the dryer is off.

Last night, we had some storms come through, but nothing special, just typical thunderstorms, lightning but nothing close even. Woke up at 12 something to a GFCI in the living room alerting that was tripped. I unplugged the air freshener and reset it and it was fine.

Fast forward a few hours later the surge protector by the bed is alarming. I flipped it on and off and no change. So I left it off.

This morning I went downstairs to check things out and the GFCI for the tank was also tripped, no power there. I reset the GFCI and everything started back up.

Is this just all an unfortunate chain of unrelated events or is there something more going on here. As I said, we didn't lose power or even have it flicker in the night with the storms but...something is surging to cause all these trips I'd have to think.

All tripped outlets and surge protectors are on different circuits as well.

@Brew12

 

[Billdogg]

I'm not an electrician but do consider myslef to be a very DIY sort of guy. I finished our 2200sf basement, ran a 100A box from the main panel over to my workshop area, did all the lighting, etc myself. Considering all the seemingly random trips, I would want to have it all checked by someone who was (an electrician) if it were my house.

 

[Brew12]

If there are any electricians in the house I'd appreciate some input.

Full story as concise as I can make it is a few weeks ago, a burner on our electric stove went out which ended up tripping the breaker for the stove. Not a big deal (other than it's a $600 fix) we've been getting along fine without the burner. Fast forward to a day or so ago, our dryer is tripping the breaker. After much investigation it appears the heating coil must be touching the housing somehow and heating more than it should in terms of time and heat. When running the dryer on air dry, the coil is glowing. Ok, so we unplugged it last night because we read it can heat even when the dryer is off.

Last night, we had some storms come through, but nothing special, just typical thunderstorms, lightning but nothing close even. Woke up at 12 something to a GFCI in the living room alerting that was tripped. I unplugged the air freshener and reset it and it was fine.

Fast forward a few hours later the surge protector by the bed is alarming. I flipped it on and off and no change. So I left it off.

This morning I went downstairs to check things out and the GFCI for the tank was also tripped, no power there. I reset the GFCI and everything started back up.

Is this just all an unfortunate chain of unrelated events or is there something more going on here. As I said, we didn't lose power or even have it flicker in the night with the storms but...something is surging to cause all these trips I'd have to think.

All tripped outlets and surge protectors are on different circuits as well.

@Brew12

I would worry that the neutral conductor between your house and the utility transformer that supplies you may have developed an open.
If you didn't know, your house feed is a 240V circuit that is center tapped. The center tap is connected to ground at your house. If that center tap becomes disconnected from ground you still get 240V to your house but you may have a 120V circuit that is 50v to ground and the other is 190V to ground. This can cause heating element failure along with damaging surge suppression devices and cheaply made electronics. It is a dangerous situation that has led to quite a few house fires. I had this happen in our new house when it was less than 10 years old. Fire ants ate the insulation off the cable jacked and our acidic soil caused it to erode in half.

This used to be very noticeable when we used incandescent light bulbs because the lights on one circuit would dim while the ones on the other would grow brighter. The easiest way to check now is with an AC volt meter. Test multiple outlets to ground. They should all be in the 110V to 120V range. If you see some at 125V and others at 110V then this is the likely issue.

Hope that helps!

 

[KStatefan]

Open neutral was my first thought also. I would get an electrician there to check it out.

 

[alton]

Call your utility company. They should have a service tech that can come out and check voltage and determine if your system has an issue, and they are free. If not definitely call an electrical contractor. I have only seen it once where the utility company sent voltage over the grounded system and fried home owners appliances, but it did happen.

 

[KJoFan]

Thanks everyone! Your input is very valuable. I'm glad I'm not overreacting or imagining there might be something bigger at work here.

I have called my utility company and they are going to check into things on their end and send a tech out to take a look as soon as they can.

 

[KJoFan]

Just got a call back from the utility company. They had someone check things out and find nothing amiss. The neutral conductor did not appear to have any issues. They looked back through the voltage readings for the house over the last few days and find no readings out of whack.

Their suggestion was to just have the overall panel in the house looked at by an electrician.

 

[Brew12]

I wish I knew what testing he did. Looking won't find much. Any chance you have a volt meter?

 

[KJoFan]

I wish I knew what testing he did. Looking won't find much. Any chance you have a volt meter?

Not sure he did any actual testing based on what was relayed to me as in “he didn’t see anything wrong”.

He did mention that in my neighborhood of 16 houses they have had 3 houses with failed lines from pole to house in the past couple years. But their symptoms were lights dimming for 10 minutes or so at a time, which doesn’t match ours.

We do not have a volt meter but could pick one up in the next couple days.

 

[Brew12]

But their symptoms were lights dimming for 10 minutes or so at a time, which doesn’t match ours.

If you don't have incandescent lights they are unlikely to visibly dim.

I will say that if you are fed overhead it is much easier to visibly see issues, and it sounds like you are. I've gotten used to the South were almost everything is run underground now. Something about not having frozen ground 11 months a year. :p

 

[KJoFan]

If you don't have incandescent lights they are unlikely to visibly dim.

I will say that if you are fed overhead it is much easier to visibly see issues, and it sounds like you are. I've gotten used to the South were almost everything is run underground now. Something about not having frozen ground 11 months a year. :p

We have mostly cfl and led bulbs. A few incandescent but not sure they’re in the house. Garage maybe.

The line from the pole to the house is underground. Even with frozen ground for 11 months a year. ;)

 

[KJoFan]

Had an electrician to the house this morning. Nothing found that would point to our recent issues. Could just be a series of unfortunate incidents.

Several neutrals in the panel were loose that got tightened up. One 15 amp breaker had a wire arcing to the screw on the back, so they replaced that. Seems like that actually might have been the breaker for the circuit the tank is on.

A few breakers were loose overall, so everything got a once over and tightened up.

They tested the stove and no issues there (except the burnt out burner) as far as power draw. The dryer was also tested and it's drawing 37 amps on a 30 amp breaker when it should only draw about 20. The heating element is only partially heating so COULD be the cause for the extra draw and need to be replaced. But unsure if that's the only issue there.

They did overall power draw testing for the house as well, even with some extra appliances on just to see if they see anything out of the ordinary, everything was perfect.

So, while we got no definite answer, it would seem nothing major is afoot and really could have just been a bunch of coincidences. He did mention with the lightning we've had from some storms recently he's gotten a lot of calls about issues, so I guess count us in that same category.

 

[Brew12]

Several neutrals in the panel were loose that got tightened up. One 15 amp breaker had a wire arcing to the screw on the back, so they replaced that. Seems like that actually might have been the breaker for the circuit the tank is on.

This is a pretty substantial issue imo and I'm glad you had an electrician come look. Any time you have loose connection or arcing it will create harmonics on the power system. These harmonics can cause electronics and motors to run hot, they can trip GFCI's (especially ones over 7-8 years old), and they can break down surge arrestors. It will also increase the impact of any lightening strikes or switching transients in your area.

Hopefully this will fix things up for you!

 

[KJoFan]

This is a pretty substantial issue imo and I'm glad you had an electrician come look. Any time you have loose connection or arcing it will create harmonics on the power system. These harmonics can cause electronics and motors to run hot, they can trip GFCI's (especially ones over 7-8 years old), and they can break down surge arrestors. It will also increase the impact of any lightening strikes or switching transients in your area.

Hopefully this will fix things up for you!

I do wonder how things get loosened up...just time/age? Now, I have to find out if I can just purchase a new heating element locally from an appliance store and tackle that problem and get the dryer back online.

Hard to line dry clothes in the freezing weather. ;) (j/k it's a refreshing 56 degrees out)

 

[Brew12]

Hard to line dry clothes in the freezing weather. ;) (j/k it's a refreshing 56 degrees out)

It's a chilly 88F right now, but at least the humidity is high so it doesn't feel too cold. We should hit 96F-98F this afternoon so it should be another comfortable day working outside. ;)

FYI... my wife was born and raised in MN and my mom currently lives in Belle Plaine. I grew up in Chicago and spent my summers in Wisconsin. I'm very familiar with the misquitos... I mean... weather.