First Sump Set Up

crys

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I currently have a IM Fusion 20 about 3ft off the floor. I’m planning on adding a sump for additional water volume, clean look(hiding equipment), and a good sized Refugium for nutrient export but mainly for copepods.

I cant/don’t want to drill the tank so a hob overflow box seems to be my best bet (PF NANO). The over flow box will connect to the sump which would be Eshopps nano Refugium/sump cube. And the return pump would be a sicce syncra 1.0.

The overflow box is rated for a max flow rate of 200gph and has a 3/4” bulkhead which id have to connect to the 1” tube that the nano cube comes with. The return pump is rated for 251 gph and is adjustable which seems like a good option.

When it comes to the sump setup do you guys see any problems or am I missing anything?

I’m simply planning it out now so in the near future I can save the headache :)
 
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Ippyroy

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I'd just use a HOB refugium. Much easier and cheaper.
 

Rob.bucek

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I know there's been some improvements with HOB overflows over the years with add-ons to help kick start the siphon etc but in my experience the only thing HOB overflows are good for is overflowing water onto your floor. In essence if you ever lose power and your siphon doesn't start you'll empty your sump into your main tank which I doubt will handle the additional volume well at all.
 
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crys

crys

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I'd just use a HOB refugium. Much easier and cheaper.
I did consider a hob Refugium at first. I would do the aqua clear 70 Refugium mod. But I felt like that would only help with having a place for copepods and the extra water volume/nutrient export would be minimum if any. I could go with the larger cpr HOB Refugiums but the cost of those compared to the benefits didn’t seem worth it. i do plan on somewhat heavily stocking my tank (I’ve made sure the species would be all compatible and don’t grow too large or require extra swimming space) so I felt like having much more water volume would help with that as well.
 
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crys

crys

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I know there's been some improvements with HOB overflows over the years with add-ons to help kick start the siphon etc but in my experience the only thing HOB overflows are good for is overflowing water onto your floor. In essence if you ever lose power and your siphon doesn't start you'll empty your sump into your main tank which I doubt will handle the additional volume well at all.
During the research I did, I definitely saw overflowing as a risk. If I were to go the sump route and drilling the tank isn’t an option, I felt like an overflow box is the way to go. Do you know any alternatives to drilling and hob overflows? Or any way I could maybe minimize the risk of it overflowing the bad way?
 
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Ippyroy

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Drilling a tank for a sump is the only safe way to do it. HOB gear is awesome, but for an overflow is a disaster waiting to happen. It is super easy for your tank. Just drill the one hole, the glass can be drilled. Attach the box, no need for the front weir, your tank is set up for it.
 

Ippyroy

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During the research I did, I definitely saw overflowing as a risk. If I were to go the sump route and drilling the tank isn’t an option, I felt like an overflow box is the way to go. Do you know any alternatives to drilling and hob overflows? Or any way I could maybe minimize the risk of it overflowing the bad way?
You are fighting gravity. Gravity always wins.
 

Rob.bucek

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During the research I did, I definitely saw overflowing as a risk. If I were to go the sump route and drilling the tank isn’t an option, I felt like an overflow box is the way to go. Do you know any alternatives to drilling and hob overflows? Or any way I could maybe minimize the risk of it overflowing the bad way?
So way back when I had my last tank (a 40 breeder) I made the jump from fowlr to reef and went to a CPR hob overflow. I really don't think there was anything fundamentally wrong with their design at all. It's just the inherent risks associated with the approach. Literally twice a year for a variety of reasons I'd lose the siphon and walk into a house with salt water all over the floor.

Can you articulate your reasons it's not an option? If the bank of your tank is tempered, then yeah, I get it. After that I'd look at the bottom. Of course either option requires you to disrupt your tank but that's still an option. I've successfully done rip cleans and you could yank everything out on a day, put it in totes etc and have it all back in within a few hours. I've done similar for different reasons with no losses at all.
 
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Pistondog

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I currently have a IM Fusion 20 about 3ft off the floor. I’m planning on adding a sump for additional water volume, clean look(hiding equipment), and a good sized Refugium for nutrient export but mainly for copepods.

I cant/don’t want to drill the tank so a hob overflow box seems to be my best bet (PF NANO). The over flow box will connect to the sump which would be Eshopps nano Refugium/sump cube. And the return pump would be a sicce syncra 1.0.

The overflow box is rated for a max flow rate of 200gph and has a 3/4” bulkhead which id have to connect to the 1” tube that the nano cube comes with. The return pump is rated for 251 gph and is adjustable which seems like a good option.

When it comes to the sump setup do you guys see any problems or am I missing anything?

I’m simply planning it out now so in the near future I can save the headache :)
Stupid piston went down this path with the same eshopps overflow on a waterbox. Air gets in the siphon tube and cannot escape with a lowish flow pump like you've specified. Have to clear the air every couple of days, or it will break siphon.
Haven't had an overflow, but it is when not if.
Ordered a new tank, a little bigger (bonus), to drill and transfer old tank contents, next week.
Don't make the same mistake.
 
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crys

crys

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So way back when I had my last tank (a 40 breeder) I made the jump from fowlr to reef and went to a CPR hob overflow. I really don't think there was anything fundamentally wrong with their design at all. It's just the inherent risks associated with the approach. Literally twice a year for a variety of reasons I'd lose the siphon and walk into a house with salt water all over the floor.

Can you articulate your reasons it's not an option? If the bank of your tank is tempered, then yeah, I get it. After that I'd look at the bottom. Of course either option requires you to disrupt your tank but that's still an option. I've successfully done rip cleans and you could yank everything out on a day, put it in totes etc and have it all back in within a few hours. I've done similar for different reasons with no losses at all.
I really just didn’t wanna go the drilling route because of the setting up for drilling and it just scares me. It looks like drilling is the safest/best option in the long term. I’ll definitely have to do some research on drilling it. At the moment I only have 20lbs of rock and two clown fish so taking it down temporarily to do it isn’t going to be the hardest.
 

Pistondog

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I really just didn’t wanna go the drilling route because of the setting up for drilling and it just scares me. It looks like drilling is the safest/best option in the long term. I’ll definitely have to do some research on drilling it. At the moment I only have 20lbs of rock and two clown fish so taking it down temporarily to do it isn’t going to be the hardest.
Lots of videos on it.
Do it outside.
Set up a dam around hole with plumbers putty
Let the drill weight cut the hole
Lighten up as you are about to break thru to minimize chips on the backside
Towel to catch glass slug
You got this.
 

christopher wainright

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Do you have an apex? If you're dead set on a hob overflow you could wore float switches to a break out box then have the apex shut the return pump down if it ever lost the siphon. Bonus points for Neptune on the fact that the apex will notify you when it happens.
 
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crys

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Do you have an apex? If you're dead set on a hob overflow you could wore float switches to a break out box then have the apex shut the return pump down if it ever lost the siphon. Bonus points for Neptune on the fact that the apex will notify you when it happens.
Yeah that seems like a good option. I’m currently looking into the drilled route to see if it’s doable. If not I’ll definitely need to install a float switch.
 
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crys

crys

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So way back when I had my last tank (a 40 breeder) I made the jump from fowlr to reef and went to a CPR hob overflow. I really don't think there was anything fundamentally wrong with their design at all. It's just the inherent risks associated with the approach. Literally twice a year for a variety of reasons I'd lose the siphon and walk into a house with salt water all over the floor.

Can you articulate your reasons it's not an option? If the bank of your tank is tempered, then yeah, I get it. After that I'd look at the bottom. Of course either option requires you to disrupt your tank but that's still an option. I've successfully done rip cleans and you could yank everything out on a day, put it in totes etc and have it all back in within a few hours. I've done similar for different reasons with no losses at all.
I’m looking at the eclipse S overflow box. Drilling is definitely way easier than I envisioned. When it comes to plumbing how would I go about connecting the eclipse S to the Eshopps nano cube sump/Refugium. I’m thinking I’ll have to get a stronger return pump maybe the size up from the sicce 1.0.
 

Rob.bucek

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I’m looking at the eclipse S overflow box. Drilling is definitely way easier than I envisioned. When it comes to plumbing how would I go about connecting the eclipse S to the Eshopps nano cube sump/Refugium. I’m thinking I’ll have to get a stronger return pump maybe the size up from the sicce 1.0.
I'm not familiar with their layouts but I'll look up the tank and see if I can give any suggestions.
 

Rob.bucek

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I really just didn’t wanna go the drilling route because of the setting up for drilling and it just scares me. It looks like drilling is the safest/best option in the long term. I’ll definitely have to do some research on drilling it. At the moment I only have 20lbs of rock and two clown fish so taking it down temporarily to do it isn’t going to be the hardest.
Yeah I totally get drilling is scary af if you haven't done it before. Best advice out there is get a 10 or 20 gallon cheap Petco tank and turn out into swiss cheese by practice drooling holes
 

Ippyroy

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I’m looking at the eclipse S overflow box. Drilling is definitely way easier than I envisioned. When it comes to plumbing how would I go about connecting the eclipse S to the Eshopps nano cube sump/Refugium. I’m thinking I’ll have to get a stronger return pump maybe the size up from the sicce 1.0.
Just drill it in the middle rear section about 2/3 of the way up. You only attach the box on the outside, you won't need the weir in the front. The best part of drilling an AIO is it's hard to place it in a bad place because the water level is maintained by the divider in the tank.
 

anthonygf

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I know there's been some improvements with HOB overflows over the years with add-ons to help kick start the siphon etc but in my experience the only thing HOB overflows are good for is overflowing water onto your floor. In essence if you ever lose power and your siphon doesn't start you'll empty your sump into your main tank which I doubt will handle the additional volume well at all.
I use a high level sensor in my DT to turn off the return pump if syphon stops and water level gets to 1/2" from top. Works great, I tried it intentionally.
 
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