Fish are dying! Help

Oneofayykind · Nov 3, 2016

How do I prevent these spikes in the future? What would have caused it? The skimmer I have is cheap built for the biocube. Is anyone else having problems with their biocube filtration? I've only read good things about them.

What attention should I be giving these bioballs?

jsker · Nov 3, 2016

Distilled water using to be used all the time in tank back in the day. It cheaper yes and better to have an RO/DI filter. The distilled water did not cause this.

cmcoker · Nov 3, 2016

How quick did you raise your specific gravity? You said its a little higher than what you shot for, how high? Could you give us a time line on how you made those changes?

I agree with a probable ammonia spike but am also wondering if osmotic shock contributed as well.

You can remove your bio balls the live rock does the same job. However, with a new tank like yours I would only remove a handful every few days watching the ammonia levels in between. That will let make sure the live rock has time to replace the nitrifying bacteria that my be leaving the tank with the bioballs

Oneofayykind · Nov 3, 2016

cmcoker said:
How quick did you raise your specific gravity? You said its a little higher than what you shot for, how high? Could you give us a time line on how you made those changes?

I agree with a probable ammonia spike but am also wondering if osmotic shock contributed as well.

I went from .021 to .026 throughout the course of a day. Slowing adding the higher water over time. I believe part of over shooting was due to topping off with saltwater and not RO. Not that there has been much topping off going on either. The six line was literally added 6 days ago after I brought salinity up as well.

melypr1985 · Nov 3, 2016

Oneofayykind said:
How do I prevent these spikes in the future? What would have caused it? The skimmer I have is cheap built for the biocube. Is anyone else having problems with their biocube filtration? I've only read good things about them.

What attention should I be giving these bioballs?

In a tank this young it is easy to get ammonia spikes just from feeding the corals. It needs to cycle fully and level off before adding any more bioload to the tank. Your tank is simply not stable. I would let it sit and cycle for a bit before trying again. By the time you get your next (1) fish out of QT the tank should have settled a bit (testing to confirm).

My next concern is how you are adding reef crystals to the saltwater you bought at the LFS. Does your LFS use reef crystals in their water? Did you let it mix for several hours before using the water?

cmcoker · Nov 3, 2016

Oneofayykind said:
I went from .021 to .026 throughout the course of a day. Slowing adding the higher water over time. I believe part of over shooting was due to topping off with saltwater and not RO. Not that there has been much topping off going on either. The six line was literally added 6 days ago after I brought salinity up as well.

I think it's possible this could be a contributing factor then. A fish should not experience more than a 0.002 rise in specific gravity over 24 hours. They can handle drops better, but their bodies need time to adjust. 1.026 is a fine reading, they just need more time to adjust.
In the future a quarantine tank would be ideal to allow you to watch/treat for diseases as well as allow a slow change in salinity. I would setup the quarantine with the same specific gravity that the lfs runs (check the water they come in) and slowly raise the sg to match your DT over several days.

Oneofayykind · Nov 3, 2016

Thoughts on adding this? https://www.chewy.com/instant-ocean...gclid=CJnc3_PjjNACFYcmhgodTt0Csg&gclsrc=aw.ds

cmcoker · Nov 3, 2016

Oneofayykind said:
Thoughts on adding this? https://www.chewy.com/instant-ocean...gclid=CJnc3_PjjNACFYcmhgodTt0Csg&gclsrc=aw.ds

IMO, It would be fine to add, but would not speed the recommended timeline to adding livestock (@melypr1985 post above)

scurvy dawg · Nov 3, 2016

Using copper in commercial distilling processes is pretty much non-existent these days. SS is pretty much standard because of the reduced corrosion. If there was really copper leaching into his distilled water I think those snails would be dead by now.

That being said, I am not sure what you mean by "your distiller" Is it a steam distiller for home use? A RO/DI filter would probably have been a better option for what you pay for a home distiller.

Oneofayykind · Nov 3, 2016

scurvy dawg said:
Using copper in commercial distilling processes is pretty much non-existent these days. SS is pretty much standard because of the reduced corrosion. If there was really copper leaching into his distilled water I think those snails would be dead by now.

That being said, I am not sure what you mean by "your distiller" Is it a steam distiller for home use? A RO/DI filter would probably have been a better option for what you pay for a home distiller.

Yea it's one I own. We have it to filter our water for things like our iron and steam cleaner etc because our water is awful.

Oneofayykind · Nov 3, 2016

melypr1985 said:
In a tank this young it is easy to get ammonia spikes just from feeding the corals. It needs to cycle fully and level off before adding any more bioload to the tank. Your tank is simply not stable. I would let it sit and cycle for a bit before trying again. By the time you get your next (1) fish out of QT the tank should have settled a bit (testing to confirm).

My next concern is how you are adding reef crystals to the saltwater you bought at the LFS. Does your LFS use reef crystals in their water? Did you let it mix for several hours before using the water?

I added the reef crystals to 5 gallons of water and let that mix for a few hours. I then slowly added that to the tank over time. The water I get from my lfs is out of their fish only tanks they don't sell water from their reef tanks which is why they keep it at .021.

melypr1985 · Nov 3, 2016

Oneofayykind said:
I added the reef crystals to 5 gallons of water and let that mix for a few hours. I then slowly added that to the tank over time. The water I get from my lfs is out of their fish only tanks they don't sell water from their reef tanks which is why they keep it at .021.

I wouldn't pay for water from a running system. You're pulling water from this system that -probably- is full of fish already peeing and pooing in the water, not to mention any diseases they may have floating around in the water. You're LFS doesn't sell RODI water? Like fresh never used RODI?

tripdad · Nov 3, 2016

Just a question here. You say you added more live rock two days before all this started happening? Where did that come from? Was it cycled or straight out of the ocean? From some stores holding tank? In my past I have always gotten die off from uncured live rock which creates an ammonia spike as suggested. Just wondering aloud here. Hope things go better moving forward.

Oneofayykind · Nov 3, 2016

Yes they do sell RO/DI, but I feel like I should probably invest in my own filtration and also setup a QT as well.

With that said, any recommendations on RO/DI filtration systems and where to go to get good info on how to properly setup and maintain a QT?

Oneofayykind · Nov 3, 2016

tripdad said:
Just a question here. You say you added more live rock two days before all this started happening? Where did that come from? Was it cycled or straight out of the ocean? From some stores holding tank? In my past I have always gotten die off from uncured live rock which creates an ammonia spike as suggested. Just wondering aloud here. Hope things go better moving forward.

Good question. It's the same live rock from when I started the tank, and has been cured, though I split the rock in half so maybe that was the issue? Tell me I'm an idiot and shouldnt have done that!

tripdad · Nov 3, 2016

No, splitting it shouldn't matter in my opinion, unless it was packed full of crap. I'm a little confused though, if it was the same that you started with but it wasn't in your tank then where was it? Maybe from the same supplier but you bought some more? As long as it was fully cured my concerns are minimal.

Maritimer · Nov 3, 2016

I'm just thinking that if there was anything dead in the new liverock, that would cause an ammonia spike . . .

I'm also thinkin' how losing those fish has to really hurt, and how glad I am to see you reaching out and fighting to prevent the same sort of loss from happening again.

Go you.

~Bruce

melypr1985 · Nov 3, 2016

Oneofayykind said:
Yes they do sell RO/DI, but I feel like I should probably invest in my own filtration and also setup a QT as well.

With that said, any recommendations on RO/DI filtration systems and where to go to get good info on how to properly setup and maintain a QT?

Yes indeed! Here is an article just for setting up a proper QT. How to Quarantine

Look at AirWaterIce.com and BRS among others. You can get a good rodi system for aout 150 bucks now a days

Ok_cowboy1 · Nov 3, 2016

I just bought my RODI system from bulk reef! I went with the 6 stage 150 GPD system! You don't have to go that big fore sure and you can ask around, I have heard someone sells refurbed RODI systems pretty reasonable!

Oneofayykind · Nov 3, 2016

Ok_cowboy1 said:
I just bought my RODI system from bulk reef! I went with the 6 stage 150 GPD system! You don't have to go that big fore sure and you can ask around, I have heard someone sells refurbed RODI systems pretty reasonable!

Go big or go home right? I am planning for the future as well. One day I plan to DIY a big 500+ gallon tank in our finished basement once I know what the heck im doing. Seems like if you can keep a nano tank alive and well, the bigger tanks are less of a challenge in a lot of regards.