Fish not doing well in HT

[Cable]

Hello,

I am pretty new to salt water reefing and made the mistake of not setting up a QT.

I added a Pearly Jawfish to the tank which died in 5 days.

6 days later I woke up to my Clown looking like he was close to dying from either velvet or brook he was fine the night before so I knew I needed to act fast. I attached a photo below of the Clown after successful treatment. No other fish were showing symptoms.

I immediately set up a hospital tank to treat all fish.

Its a 10 gallon tank and houses 5 small fish (Blue Flasher Wrasse, Clown, Wheeler Goby, Purple Fire Fish, Tail Spot Blenny) I realize its some what small for the quantity of fish but it is all I had to work with.

All fish went through a freshwater bath for 5min + 30min in "Rid Ich Plus" which contains Formaldehyde 4.26% (11.52% Formalin) and Zync-Free Chloride Salt of Malachite Green before being added to the HT.

The HT has been ramped up to a copper level (Copper Power) of 1.5 (I am aiming for a level of 2). I added Prime & Bio Spiria to control ammonia. I also as of yesterday added Metro + to treat Brook if Brook is present.

The Clown and Tail Spot Blenny are doing great but my Purple Fire Fish is not doing well he is lethargic heavily breathing. I am not sure how much longer he will make it. He was fine up until yesterday morning. I tried giving him another freshwater bath last night but there has been no improvement so im not sure if parasites are the issue. (I also did a 50% water change yesterday and added an air-stone because I thought maybe the single pump was not sufficient). I have also noticed rapid breathing from the Wrasse and Wheeler Goby but its not as severe as it is on my fire fish.

I understand testing ammonia with prime will lead to false positives so im pretty lost regarding what I should do and am incredibly overwhelmed. Im considering adding him back into the DT even though I need to go fallow for 76 days.

My nitrates are not high & Salinity is at 1.023. The alklinity is at 1.0 which is maybe signifying an imbalanced PH level? Im going to get a new PH test right after work as the strips I have are terrible.

I feel like this is a water peram issue but im not sure as the parameter's that I can measure seem in line.

Let me know if any of you all have advice

Some other less urgent notes are

My Wheeler Goby has not really been eating either since introducing him to the HT so I added some sand in a food safe plastic bowl in hopes to comfort him I will see how he develops.

 

[Eric Cohen]

You're on the right track. Great advice for qt protocol on Humble.fish website.....each fish may need different methods of treatment.....Don't worry about the water quality in the qt tank as you will have to change water often to keep ammonia down. You can use an ammonia indicator or just change partial water every couple days when you re-dose your meds as directed. Really glad you're on the qt research....this is a great way to really protect your main system and get more fish through to long term health.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hello,

I am pretty new to salt water reefing and made the mistake of not setting up a QT.

I added a Pearly Jawfish to the tank which died in 5 days.

6 days later I woke up to my Clown looking like he was close to dying from either velvet or brook he was fine the night before so I knew I needed to act fast. I attached a photo below of the Clown after successful treatment. No other fish were showing symptoms.

I immediately set up a hospital tank to treat all fish.

Its a 10 gallon tank and houses 5 small fish (Blue Flasher Wrasse, Clown, Wheeler Goby, Purple Fire Fish, Tail Spot Blenny) I realize its some what small for the quantity of fish but it is all I had to work with.

All fish went through a freshwater bath for 5min + 30min in "Rid Ich Plus" which contains Formaldehyde 4.26% (11.52% Formalin) and Zync-Free Chloride Salt of Malachite Green before being added to the HT.

The HT has been ramped up to a copper level (Copper Power) of 1.5 (I am aiming for a level of 2). I added Prime & Bio Spiria to control ammonia. I also as of yesterday added Metro + to treat Brook if Brook is present.

The Clown and Tail Spot Blenny are doing great but my Purple Fire Fish is not doing well he is lethargic heavily breathing. I am not sure how much longer he will make it. He was fine up until yesterday morning. I tried giving him another freshwater bath last night but there has been no improvement so im not sure if parasites are the issue. (I also did a 50% water change yesterday and added an air-stone because I thought maybe the single pump was not sufficient). I have also noticed rapid breathing from the Wrasse and Wheeler Goby but its not as severe as it is on my fire fish.

I understand testing ammonia with prime will lead to false positives so im pretty lost regarding what I should do and am incredibly overwhelmed. Im considering adding him back into the DT even though I need to go fallow for 76 days.

My nitrates are not high & Salinity is at 1.023. The alklinity is at 1.0 which is maybe signifying an imbalanced PH level? Im going to get a new PH test right after work as the strips I have are terrible.

I feel like this is a water peram issue but im not sure as the parameter's that I can measure seem in line.

Let me know if any of you all have advice

Some other less urgent notes are

My Wheeler Goby has not really been eating either since introducing him to the HT so I added some sand in a food safe plastic bowl in hopes to comfort him I will see how he develops.

Firstly- How old is this tank?
Did you cycle it and if so, how and for how long?
What test kits are you using ?

Salinity needs to come up to 1.024-1.025
Alk should be 8-11dkh but more important for corals
Fallow is 6-8 weeks, not 76 days and that pertains to leaving tank fishless from disease. Why do you need to go fallow?

Youre throwig in a lot of treatments which lower oxygen and not sure what you are treating for. You need to take a step back and first perfect water quality.
Dont waste your money on strip and badges and try to sustain your livestock investment.
Are you acclimating fish- how and for how long ?
If parasites, go straight to copper level- Do Not ramp it up which will do more harm than good

What symptoms are you seeing and can you provide pics and video under white lighting ?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hello,

I am pretty new to salt water reefing and made the mistake of not setting up a QT.

I added a Pearly Jawfish to the tank which died in 5 days.

6 days later I woke up to my Clown looking like he was close to dying from either velvet or brook he was fine the night before so I knew I needed to act fast. I attached a photo below of the Clown after successful treatment. No other fish were showing symptoms.

I immediately set up a hospital tank to treat all fish.

Its a 10 gallon tank and houses 5 small fish (Blue Flasher Wrasse, Clown, Wheeler Goby, Purple Fire Fish, Tail Spot Blenny) I realize its some what small for the quantity of fish but it is all I had to work with.

All fish went through a freshwater bath for 5min + 30min in "Rid Ich Plus" which contains Formaldehyde 4.26% (11.52% Formalin) and Zync-Free Chloride Salt of Malachite Green before being added to the HT.

The HT has been ramped up to a copper level (Copper Power) of 1.5 (I am aiming for a level of 2). I added Prime & Bio Spiria to control ammonia. I also as of yesterday added Metro + to treat Brook if Brook is present.

The Clown and Tail Spot Blenny are doing great but my Purple Fire Fish is not doing well he is lethargic heavily breathing. I am not sure how much longer he will make it. He was fine up until yesterday morning. I tried giving him another freshwater bath last night but there has been no improvement so im not sure if parasites are the issue. (I also did a 50% water change yesterday and added an air-stone because I thought maybe the single pump was not sufficient). I have also noticed rapid breathing from the Wrasse and Wheeler Goby but its not as severe as it is on my fire fish.

I understand testing ammonia with prime will lead to false positives so im pretty lost regarding what I should do and am incredibly overwhelmed. Im considering adding him back into the DT even though I need to go fallow for 76 days.

My nitrates are not high & Salinity is at 1.023. The alklinity is at 1.0 which is maybe signifying an imbalanced PH level? Im going to get a new PH test right after work as the strips I have are terrible.

I feel like this is a water peram issue but im not sure as the parameter's that I can measure seem in line.

Let me know if any of you all have advice

Some other less urgent notes are

My Wheeler Goby has not really been eating either since introducing him to the HT so I added some sand in a food safe plastic bowl in hopes to comfort him I will see how he develops.

Welcome to Reef2Reef!

Were these fish shipped to you? I stopped using FW and/or malachite green dips on incoming shipped fish due to unacceptably high mortality rate. If you bought them from a local store it isn’t quite as much of an issue.

What is the actual ammonia test running?
You need to get your copper power up to 2.5 ppm - what test kit do you have?

Jay

 

[Cable]

Firstly- How old is this tank?
Did you cycle it and if so, how and for how long?
What test kits are you using ?

Salinity needs to come up to 1.024-1.025
Alk should be 8-11dkh but more important for corals
Fallow is 6-8 weeks, not 76 days and that pertains to leaving tank fishless from disease. Why do you need to go fallow?

Youre throwig in a lot of treatments which lower oxygen and not sure what you are treating for. You need to take a step back and first perfect water quality.
Dont waste your money on strip and badges and try to sustain your livestock investment.
Are you acclimating fish- how and for how long ?
If parasites, go straight to copper level- Do Not ramp it up which will do more harm than good

What symptoms are you seeing and can you provide pics and video under white lighting ?

Hey, thanks for the reply.

I will up the salinity in my HT. My HT is NOT cycled.

I bought my tank used and it was already pre-established for multiple years. I left it empty (invert and fishless) for 2 weeks monitoring the parameter's and getting used to the maintenance.

All fish were drip acclimated and were doing great for almost a month until I added the Jawfish. The jawfish rarely came out until the night he died (5 days after being acclimated) and was breathing incredibly heavy lethargic etc.. He had no signs of parasites or disease but he was also pearly white so it was hard to tell. At this point all other fish were fine

6 days later my clown looked to have Velvet or Brook. I don't have pictures of what he looked like in my DT as I rushed to get him treated as he was clearly going die soon with out treatment.

My thought was if I introduced velvet Ick or brook in the tank by failing to initially Quarantine then I should leave it fallow for the maximum time parasites can survive fishless.

My DT's parameter's are solid - low nitrates, phosphates, alk is at 9, no ammonia, and salinity is at 1.025

I posted 2 videos below.

1. Showing purple fire fish and Wrasse

2. Showing Clown (you can see the wounds left over from what ever was infecting him)

-- I also wanted to note the clown had white dots everywhere before with splotches of brown discoloration before treatment was started.

-- The rock looking thing in the HT is also made of out ceramic (its not live rock)

 

[Cable]

Welcome to Reef2Reef!

Were these fish shipped to you? I stopped using FW and/or malachite green dips on incoming shipped fish due to unacceptably high mortality rate. If you bought them from a local store it isn’t quite as much of an issue.

What is the actual ammonia test running?
You need to get your copper power up to 2.5 ppm - what test kit do you have?

Jay

Thank you for your reply.

I want to note that the fish were already acclimated in my DT and they are now moved to my Hospital tank for treatment.

I have a Hanna copper HR device.

I bought all fish from the same LFS.

My ammonia levels were elevated at 0.25 before adding prime and Bio Spira. (Used API test kit)

 

[vetteguy53081]

Thank you for your reply.

I want to note that the fish were already acclimated in my DT and they are now moved to my Hospital tank for treatment.

I have a Hanna copper HR device.

I bought all fish from the same LFS.

My ammonia levels were elevated at 0.25 before adding prime and Bio Spira. (Used API test kit)

Overall, fish look good with exception of flasher which is breathing very labored.
I question ammonia and nitrate levels with this breathing as Prime is a water conditioner (and good one) but misconception that it addresses and removes ammonia- It does not. Ammonia via chemical does not bond and vanish. The API mainly ammonia notorious for false readings often showing zero when its not. I highly urge you to take a water sample to a trusted LFS (not the one you use) that does NOT use Api kits and have them test ammonia-ph-nitrate and see what readings they come up with even if its an hour drive for those nice looking fish.
I believe you are running air stone and needed for wrasse.
If copper power or coppersafe. . . . therapeutic level is 2.25-2.5 for a FULL 30 days and level should not fall in this 30 day period known as treatment cysle.
If Chelated- safe level is .5 for a Full 30 days and monitor ammonia level with a RELIABLE test kit such as Hanna or salifert brand

 

[Cable]

Overall, fish look good with exception of flasher which is breathing very labored.
I question ammonia and nitrate levels with this breathing as Prime is a water conditioner (and good one) but misconception that it addresses and removes ammonia- It does not. Ammonia via chemical does not bond and vanish. The API mainly ammonia notorious for false readings often showing zero when its not. I highly urge you to take a water sample to a trusted LFS (not the one you use) that does NOT use Api kits and have them test ammonia-ph-nitrate and see what readings they come up with even if its an hour drive for those nice looking fish.
I believe you are running air stone and needed for wrasse.
If copper power or coppersafe. . . . therapeutic level is 2.25-2.5 for a FULL 30 days and level should not fall in this 30 day period known as treatment cysle.
If Chelated- safe level is .5 for a Full 30 days and monitor ammonia level with a RELIABLE test kit such as Hanna or salifert brand

Got it I just did a 50% water change. I'm going to hold off on adding more Prime until I can verify ammonia level (I have been adding it every 24hrs + 50% water changes daily)

Thanks again for the replies

 

[vetteguy53081]

Got it I just did a 50% water change. I'm going to hold off on adding more Prime until I can verify ammonia level (I have been adding it every 24hrs + 50% water changes daily)

Thanks again for the replies

Keep asking if needed. My hunch is mainly water quality from display tank

 

[Cable]

You're on the right track. Great advice for qt protocol on Humble.fish website.....each fish may need different methods of treatment.....Don't worry about the water quality in the qt tank as you will have to change water often to keep ammonia down. You can use an ammonia indicator or just change partial water every couple days when you re-dose your meds as directed. Really glad you're on the qt research....this is a great way to really protect your main system and get more fish through to long term health.

Got it will check it out. I have seen a bunch of his posts but did not realize he had a website. And yeah I will never add a fish or invert without QT at this point would rather not be in the hobby then put my other fish at risk.