GFO bad for high end SPS?

[R6REEFER]

So I've been using GFO for about 2 years now and never encountered a big problem with it BUT now that I'm getting into high end SPS I am wondering. In my new system (160g) I of course started out with a carbon reactor as well as GFO. I recently encountered the problem of hitting 0 No3 and 0 Po4, as soon as I saw the LPS start to deteriorate I cut off the reactors and skimmer plus started feeding immensely. After 2 weeks my corals seem to be happy again even though No3 is still virtually undetectable. Po4 is at 0.04 which I'm assuming has a little to do with it. I've been doing a bit of research this evening and I'm finding alot of people reporting SPS RTN after incorporating GFO. Have any of you had a negative experience with GFO? I suppose I can cut on and off as needed but my problem is every time I do that I have to empty the water out of the reactor which is annoying. Could GFO possess a potential problem for acropora/humilis/millepora? The main thing I'm trying to avoid is change as SPS hate it. I want to keep the reactor running minimally, at a constant, but not if it has potential to kill some quite expensive pieces.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Too low of nutrients by any means is a problem, but I've not seen convincing evidence that GFO itself is a concern if you do not overuse i.e. :)

 

[Kungpaoshizi]

Advanced aquarist did a thing on iron and running GFO. It DID introduce and spike to a certain extent. I myself used multiple kinds of gfo but something always seemed off about it. Without even hitting 0...

 

[jcdeng]

well, GFO should not cause a problem if you use them properly, meaning you give a pre-rinse to minumize the dusting effect into your DT, and if you put the output of the GFO reactor near the skimmer mouth so any dust that gets through gets immediately skimmed out.

 

[CodyRVA]

+1 @Randy Holmes-Farley, it's not specifically the GFO, but how much you use, how often you replace it, and what other means of filtration you're utilizing. I ran into the very same problem; removing GFO entirely did help replenish my nutrient levels, but I don't blame the GFO directly. It really came down to how much I was using in unison with an over sized skimmer, excessive pellets, etc.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Advanced aquarist did a thing on iron and running GFO. It DID introduce and spike to a certain extent. I myself used multiple kinds of gfo but something always seemed off about it. Without even hitting 0...

Of course, don't forget that your favorite company who has teams of scientists studying the effects of their products (at least as you reported) recommends maintaining dissolved iron levels 0.15 ppm) in excess of what was reportedly dissolved from GFO (<0.05 ppm). So it wouldn't seem to be a problem. :)

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

+1 @Randy Holmes-Farley, it's not specifically the GFO, but how much you use, how often you replace it, and what other means of filtration you're utilizing. I ran into the very same problem; removing GFO entirely did help replenish my nutrient levels, but I don't blame the GFO directly. It really came down to how much I was using in unison with an over sized skimmer, excessive pellets, etc.

Definitely, phosphate too low is an issue, and some folks not using GFO even dose phosphate for that reason. :)

 

[R6REEFER]

Definitely, phosphate too low is an issue, and some folks not using GFO even dose phosphate for that reason. :)

Yessir, I'm going to shoot for 0.02 ppm Po4. Maybe last time I ran this reactor I had too much flow running through it. I used less media as well as choked it down and placed return line in the skimmer section. As long as the GFO doesn't have any direct impact on my No3 (common sense says it doesn't) levels then I'm not too worried about it. I have a big order from Adam over at Battlecorals coming in next week and I have no room for error! I guess I got worked up last night because I read 4 different stories on how members isolated GFO as the cause of their SPS tank crashing. It doesn't sound like that would immediately be the cause but I can see how it can contribute. Too much of anything is a bad thing. Thanks for the info guys, I'll report any changes/findings in this thread.

 

[R6REEFER]

+1 @Randy Holmes-Farley, it's not specifically the GFO, but how much you use, how often you replace it, and what other means of filtration you're utilizing. I ran into the very same problem; removing GFO entirely did help replenish my nutrient levels, but I don't blame the GFO directly. It really came down to how much I was using in unison with an over sized skimmer, excessive pellets, etc.

What size tank and how much did you cut down? When you say cut down you're referring to the quantity correct? It's been 24 hours, I cut the flow down to a crawl and I haven't seen any negative impact so far. I have some testing to do here shortly though.

 

[Oceansize]

The recommended dose of GFO on the various labels seem to be geared towards rapid reduction of phosphates, as opposed to prevention. Once you've reduced your phosphates to or beyond your target level, it makes sense to materially reduce the amount of GFO you're using, since you've now moved on to prevention rather than reduction.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Yessir, I'm going to shoot for 0.02 ppm Po4. Maybe last time I ran this reactor I had too much flow running through it. I used less media as well as choked it down and placed return line in the skimmer section. As long as the GFO doesn't have any direct impact on my No3 (common sense says it doesn't) levels then I'm not too worried about it. I guess I got worked up last night because I read 4 different stories on how members isolated GFO as the cause of their SPS tank crashing. It doesn't sound like that would immediately be the cause but I can see how it can contribute. Too much of anything is a bad thing. Thanks for the info guys, I'll report any changes/findings in this thread.

I do not know what happened to those folks, but I can be sure the GFO is not impacting nitrate.

I'd also add that not all GFO are the same, and I'm told that Triton has correlated a European GFO brand (I don't know which one) with release of barium. I do not know if that is a problem, but it is worth noting.

 

[R6REEFER]

The recommended dose of GFO on the various labels seem to be geared towards rapid reduction of phosphates, as opposed to prevention. Once you've reduced your phosphates to or beyond your target level, it makes sense to materially reduce the amount of GFO you're using, since you've now moved on to prevention rather than reduction.

The recommended dose has always seemed like way to much to me. I've always used less like for instance, this time I used 100 ml for a 150g system. That's around 1/4 of the recommended dose. I've always thought the doses were intended to move product as is the case with alot of other media and supplements.

 

[R6REEFER]

I do not know what happened to those folks, but I can be sure the GFO is not impacting nitrate.

I'd also add that not all GFO are the same, and I'm told that Triton has correlated a European GFO brand (I don't know which one) with release of barium. I do not know if that is a problem, but it is worth noting.

That is interesting. I used to use the Phosban brand, this time I'm using Skimz brand carbon and GFO. I was already thinking of sending a sample off to the Triton lab, that comment may expedite the sample! :p

 

[CodyRVA]

What size tank and how much did you cut down? When you say cut down you're referring to the quantity correct? It's been 24 hours, I cut the flow down to a crawl and I haven't seen any negative impact so far. I have some testing to do here shortly though.

This was a 46G bow front; minus rock and sand - 35G. I was using a BRS mini reactor so 1/2 cup carbon mixed with 1/4 cup of GFO. I was also running maybe 30ML of bio pellets, and a large HOB protein skimmer. I noticed corals receding, losing color, and just looking deathly. I was feeding heavy as heck, and still no nitrate or phosphate was detectable. I completely removed the GFO, which i was changing every 2 weeks, and cut back on the bio pellets as well. It took a few weeks and my coloring came back.

 

[Shep]

I can't imagine that "high end" sps would act or respond any differently than any other type of sps

 

[CodyRVA]

I can't imagine that "high end" sps would act or respond any differently than any other type of sps

Agreed. Considering SPS is simply a generic term. My SPS across the board didn't show as much stress as my LPS and softies did.

 

[R6REEFER]

I can't imagine that "high end" sps would act or respond any differently than any other type of sps

By "high end" I mean finicky and some of the more delicate SPS. Not to mention they are very expensive pieces I can't afford to lose because of something like GFO. I have some SPS that can survive anything you throw at them, such as the case with alot of my montipora. Now my acro's and humi's on the other hand will not tolerate error. With that being said, that was a very vague statement you made.

 

[R6REEFER]

Agreed. Considering SPS is simply a generic term. My SPS across the board didn't show as much stress as my LPS and softies did.

Yes, when I hit zero on Po4 and No3 my LPS started suffering. My chalice coral suffered the most while my favia seemed almost unaffected. Of course zoa's and paly's didn't care either way! :p

 

[Shep]

By "high end" I mean finicky and some of the more delicate SPS. Not to mention they are very expensive pieces I can't afford to lose because of something like GFO. I have some SPS that can survive anything you throw at them, such as the case with alot of my montipora. Now my acro's and humi's on the other hand will not tolerate error. With that being said, that was a very vague statement you made.

Not really, "high end" sps are not actually distinct from other sps. Yes some types of sps have different levels of care but being high end has nothing to do with that. High end is purely a trade distinction.

 

[R6REEFER]

This was a 46G bow front; minus rock and sand - 35G. I was using a BRS mini reactor so 1/2 cup carbon mixed with 1/4 cup of GFO. I was also running maybe 30ML of bio pellets, and a large HOB protein skimmer. I noticed corals receding, losing color, and just looking deathly. I was feeding heavy as heck, and still no nitrate or phosphate was detectable. I completely removed the GFO, which i was changing every 2 weeks, and cut back on the bio pellets as well. It took a few weeks and my coloring came back.

You were changing the media every two weeks?! That's crazy bro. I usually give GFO a solid 3 months before I change, or until I see Po4 go up. You definitely had the same problem I am having right now though. I'd like to cut off GFO completely but when I do the rust colored sand algae returns. I've heard that it's diatoms that fill those characteristics but these aren't diatoms. I don't have any silicates in my tank and this algae reacts purely to increased Po4 and lighting. It disappears at night. Either way it's extremely unsightly and I won't put up with it so here I am at the standoff haha.