Hawaii Fish Ban Update

[Dr. Reef Verified Sponsor]

Unfortunately as Hobbyist there are so many things behind the scene, whose who and what they belive and who they funding and cooperating with etc. They say they are doing all this for the betterment of the hobby and thats what I used to believe till I stepped over from hobbyist to retail. If they succeed I can almost guarantee the end of this hobby as we know it.
I really hope Hawaii opens back up and we can go back to our glory days.

 

[areefer01]

I’m easy. All I want is a yellow tang which used to be everywhere

Well the good news is that you can get one today.

 

[areefer01]

IMO, still too low… the old prices are gone forever!

So is the price for a soda, gallon of gas, and a Big Mac. Times change.

 

[areefer01]

Unfortunately as Hobbyist there are so many things behind the scene, whose who and what they belive and who they funding and cooperating with etc. They say they are doing all this for the betterment of the hobby and thats what I used to believe till I stepped over from hobbyist to retail. If they succeed I can almost guarantee the end of this hobby as we know it.

It will change for sure, but it won't be the end.

 

[Dr. Reef Verified Sponsor]

$40 retail for yellow tang is likely not gonna happen.

 

[areefer01]

$40 retail for yellow tang is likely not gonna happen.

Nor should it. Collectors will, or should, adjust pricing to match the effort and we should respect that.

 

[Dr. Reef Verified Sponsor]

Nor should it. Collectors will, or should, adjust pricing to match the effort and we should respect that.

This is not confirm by any means but I except them to sell for 100-140 range

 

[areefer01]

This is not confirm by any means but I except them to sell for 100-140 range

Yeah, I have no idea but I know pre ban vs today the economy has changed. If by chance the collectors need to change methods I would assume prices go up accordingly. Maybe also they work out compromises between those that captive breed in pricing.

In either case it is a mess and all I hope is that both parties that deal with the animals find common ground while ignoring the other side.

Hope your day is well.

 

[Biokabe]

$40 retail for yellow tang is likely not gonna happen.

And I think anyone who expects that to happen has blinders on, ignoring everything that has happened to the economy and the industry as a whole since the ban went into effect.

Royal grammas used to be $10. They're now $50, and they have never, to my knowledge, been under any kind of collection restriction. Other fish, too - flame angels were about $40, they're now $100. Coral beauties were $20, they're now $50. Things are more expensive.

 

[albano]

I'm afraid so - my dream of having a "school" of 7 is gone.

I’ll keep you in mind, in case I need to sell my 7 ,wild caught, Hawaiian Yellow Tangs!

 

[iReefer12]

Just catching up here. Can someone explain, is the list of fish that will be allowed to be caught/sold still the same list of ~8 species? Or has that expanded and if opens, will be open to all species?

Hoping the latter… flame wrasse, potters wrasse, potters angelfish, bandit angelfish, Tinkeri butterfly…

 

[Tony Thompson]

So passed unanimously. but with motion passed to amendments.

Amendments are as follows

From the 8 species on the Trade representative PIJAC (now known as Pet Advocacy Network) proposed white list (which I posted earlier as the attached document in pdf), the amendments passed by the board would reduce this to 5 Species.

The species where often referred to by the Hawaiian cultural names so I am calculating the actual species.


The three species to be removed from the original proposed white list, so effectively not allowed to be collected by virtue of a 0 catch limit are


Not allowed to be collected

Orangespine unicorn fish (Naso lituratus)

Kole Tang Goldring surgeonfish (Ctenochaetus strigosus)

Chevron Tang (Ctenochaetus hawaiiensis)



Allowed to be collected


Yellow Tang (Zebrasoma flavescens) Total Catch limit Per Year reduced from 200,000 to 100,000

Bird wrasse, (Gomphosus varius) Total catch limit Per Year 344

Potters Angelfish, (Centropyge potteri,) Total catch limit Per Year 4,376

Brown surgeonfish, (Acanthurus nigrofuscus) Total Catch Limit Per Year 800

Thompson's Sugeonfish (Acanthurus thompsoni) Total Catch limit Per Year 2,016



Now goes to public consultation, time line is difficult to calculate however proposed timeline is Collection of above species to begin Summer 2026.

 

[albano]

Allowed to be collected

Yellow Tang (Zebrasoma flavescens) Total Catch limit Per Year reduced from 200,000 to 100,000

Potters Angelfish, (Centropyge potteri,) Total catch limit Per Year 4,376

With the limits reduced, I’d guess that the price of wild caught YTs will make the captive raised one, look cheap!

Potters Angels will be not be for sale at your LFS!

 

[areefer01]

With the limits reduced, I’d guess that the price of wild caught YTs will make the captive raised one, look cheap!

Not a challenge but what would be reasonable to you? Or anyone in the thread for that matter?

I don't remember the price of a Yellow in 2015, 2016, or 2017 but maybe around 60 to 70 USD depending on the state of purchase?

Average price of a Big Mac in the US was 4.70. Today it is 5.79. What is that, 20, 23 percent? 23 percent of 70 is 16 so maybe 86 USD for a YT today?

My math may be wrong - early and no coffee. I guess my thought was only to ask what is a number hobbyist find reasonable while knowing that maybe collection rules have changed as has the economy which will play a role.

 

[mpatterson42]

I don't remember the price of a Yellow in 2015, 2016, or 2017 but maybe around 60 to 70 USD depending on the state of purchase?

https://web.archive.org/web/20170625175821/http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/392/yellow-tang-hawaii
The Wayback Machine shows in 2017 yellow tangs were under $40.

 

[albano]

I wouldn’t be surprised to see, $2-300+ on WC YT… fortunately I don’t need any, currently have 7!

 

[Dr. Reef Verified Sponsor]

If my math is correct, and my assumption of cost is correct, we should be able to sell our wild Yellow tangs for $139.99 to 159.99 range.
Of course if the cost I have in my mind goes up price will go up.

 

[JayM]

So passed unanimously. but with motion passed to amendments.

Amendments are as follows

From the 8 species on the Trade representative PIJAC (now known as Pet Advocacy Network) proposed white list (which I posted earlier as the attached document in pdf), the amendments passed by the board would reduce this to 5 Species.

The species where often referred to by the Hawaiian cultural names so I am calculating the actual species.


The three species to be removed from the original proposed white list, so effectively not allowed to be collected by virtue of a 0 catch limit are


Not allowed to be collected

Orangespine unicorn fish (Naso lituratus)

Kole Tang Goldring surgeonfish (Ctenochaetus strigosus)

Chevron Tang (Ctenochaetus hawaiiensis)



Allowed to be collected


Yellow Tang (Zebrasoma flavescens) Total Catch limit Per Year reduced from 200,000 to 100,000

Bird wrasse, (Gomphosus varius) Total catch limit Per Year 344

Potters Angelfish, (Centropyge potteri,) Total catch limit Per Year 4,376

Brown surgeonfish, (Acanthurus nigrofuscus) Total Catch Limit Per Year 800

Thompson's Sugeonfish (Acanthurus thompsoni) Total Catch limit Per Year 2,016



Now goes to public consultation, time line is difficult to calculate however proposed timeline is Collection of above species to begin Summer 2026.

Catch limits severely reduced, whitelisted species from 40, to 8, to 5.

Smells a lot like a de facto ban.

 

[BZOFIQ]

Not a challenge but what would be reasonable to you? Or anyone in the thread for that matter?

I don't remember the price of a Yellow in 2015, 2016, or 2017 but maybe around 60 to 70 USD depending on the state of purchase?

Average price of a Big Mac in the US was 4.70. Today it is 5.79. What is that, 20, 23 percent? 23 percent of 70 is 16 so maybe 86 USD for a YT today?

My math may be wrong - early and no coffee. I guess my thought was only to ask what is a number hobbyist find reasonable while knowing that maybe collection rules have changed as has the economy which will play a r

YTs were $30-39 before covid/ban.

Absolutely Fish in NJ, which sells high quality live stock but is not considered cheap was selling them for $35 a piece about 5 maybe 6 years ago. Had a tank full of medium-ish ones when I told my friend that when I finally set up my new tank I'll get 7. We know how that went!

I'd pay $79-$89 in todays money but not $200-$400 hundred considering the quantity.

 

[twentyleagues]

Not a challenge but what would be reasonable to you? Or anyone in the thread for that matter?

I don't remember the price of a Yellow in 2015, 2016, or 2017 but maybe around 60 to 70 USD depending on the state of purchase?

Average price of a Big Mac in the US was 4.70. Today it is 5.79. What is that, 20, 23 percent? 23 percent of 70 is 16 so maybe 86 USD for a YT today?

My math may be wrong - early and no coffee. I guess my thought was only to ask what is a number hobbyist find reasonable while knowing that maybe collection rules have changed as has the economy which will play a role.

I'd be happy to see them in $100 range. Maybe a meeting of wc and bred to see prices of bred come down into the $150 range. I dont know how feasible that is. I have bred quite a few fish and its not cheap or lucrative. I do think however we have been "gouged" a bit and expect that to continue with wc at least in the near future.