Help me out of this slump!

[Acro maniac]

Here is the results from 15g new mixed salt water, aqua forest.
Salinity 1.025/ 33
Alk 6.85 dkh/ 2.45 meq. salifet
Alk 5.152 dkh / 1.84 meq. lamotte
Cal 440
mag 1440
ph 8.25
I probably be dosing up alk to match tank. Ill test tank now

 

[Acro maniac]

Dt test levels
Salinity 1.025/33
alk 8.15 dkh/2.90 meq salifert
alk 6.272 dkh/2.24 meq lamotte
cal 425
mag 1350
po4 0.03
No3 10
test results for alk are stable 7 dkh is what i go by as center between the two test .
Might pull the gfo tonight???
Ill be dosing up the alk to match dt water and commencing wc. Ill let you all know what happens post wc

 

[Acro maniac]

Post wc cell phone picture of blue voodoo melting away

Pre wc post dosing tests
alk 8.3dkh/2.96 meq salifert thats 0.15 dkh above dt
alk 5.824 dkh/ 2.08meq lamotte thats 0.448 dkh under dt
I m doing water test on dt know ill post the result when im done

 

[Acro maniac]

Post wc test
Alk 8.0 dkh salifert
Alk 5.824dkh lamotte
all other levels are identical
Not really sure its an alk issue but i could be wrong.
One thing i did notice is a slight stray current that i was not able to isolate. By shutting down pumps, powerheads, skimmer, doser and chiller. Ill look it getting a ground tomorrow.

 

[Acro maniac]

I'd say that your water change chemistry is different in alkalinity and ph than your tank water. @jsker is probably right that its shocking the corals.

I checked the ph and this is what i found...
Ph in new mix 8.25
dt prior to wc 8.05
dt post wc 8.15

 

[Scott.h]

So based on what you just posted.. there is a big variation between alk test kits. Personally I use Salifert for alk, and I know a few big coral retailers that do as well. When I test alk when I'm at line 54 it's completely pink. That's where my tank stays. 54 or 55. What you are describing sounds like an alk irritation to me. Your nutrients are high enough that 8 shouldn't be an issue at all, however, to me it sounds like alk irritation. Personally I feel there would be no harm in letting the alk fall for a bit. That said I'm sure you've done it the same way for years. For me, some sps just never liked alk at 8. Some have no issues at 8 or even higher. But past problems of tip irritation is why mine is 7.0 - Salifert.

The only other think I can think is you've changed salts and added gfo. Like I mentioned I have had bad luck with gfo. I don't use it at all. That said my highest tank is .08 (triton test). Maybe the corals have adapted to the higher phosphate levels in your tank and are reacting to you lowering it, despite feeling the need to. Stray voltage doesn't explain why it heals during the week. The only other thing you've changed is salt. My personal opinion.. alk.

 

[Flippers4pups]

We never got to the question of par. What is your par readings?

I still believe its alkalinity that's causing this. But your light intensity/photoperiod in combination with a alkalinity swing could be the real reason why this happens. I'm stretching here, but tip burn is mostly associated with alkalinity swings, not too much par.

Par high, but just not enough to bleach out due to nutrients. Alkalinity swing happens and suddenly burnt tips? I'm speculating here.

 

[Acro maniac]

So based on what you just posted.. there is a big variation between alk test kits. Personally I use Salifert for alk, and I know a few big coral retailers that do as well. When I test alk when I'm at line 54 it's completely pink. That's where my tank stays. 54 or 55. What you are describing sounds like an alk irritation to me. Your nutrients are high enough that 8 shouldn't be an issue at all, however, to me it sounds like alk irritation. Personally I feel there would be no harm in letting the alk fall for a bit. That said I'm sure you've done it the same way for years. For me, some sps just never liked alk at 8. Some have no issues at 8 or even higher. But past problems of tip irritation is why mine is 7.0 - Salifert.

The only other think I can think is you've changed salts and added gfo. Like I mentioned I have had bad luck with gfo. I don't use it at all. That said my highest tank is .08 (triton test). Maybe the corals have adapted to the higher phosphate levels in your tank and are reacting to you lowering it, despite feeling the need to. Stray voltage doesn't explain why it heals during the week. The only other thing you've changed is salt. My personal opinion.. alk.

I at work and tring to remember i beleive salifert turns pink at the 47- 48 line almost always. Fresh mixed is usually around 50-55 line.
The change in salt was 2weeks ago because i thought i had a bad batch.
Gfo only went in for the first time in years on 9/29. The issue im having started in June .
My challenge is trying to wfap my head around an alk swing 8-8.15 causing this problem. Based on salifert test.
Also still jave the issue with montis fading by weekend

 

[Acro maniac]

We never got to the question of par. What is your par readings?

I still believe its alkalinity that's causing this. But your light intensity/photoperiod in combination with a alkalinity swing could be the real reason why this happens. I'm stretching here, but tip burn is mostly associated with alkalinity swings, not too much par.

Par high, but just not enough to bleach out due to nutrients. Alkalinity swing happens and suddenly burnt tips? I'm speculating here.

I ll verify photo period i have not looked at it in years.
I believe royal blue lights 11.5 hours
mix of different blues and violets 5hours
and uv and cool white 4hours
Im not sure of par i do have a lux meter. Ill get it out tonight and look back at my log to verify numbers

 

[Acro maniac]

You called it with the alk. Depending on the salt, when he water changed the system is shocked by fluctiation. Test the system before the change and right after the water change. Steady Alk as mentioned is a key.

10 gal of new sw into a 85+ gal system, with a variance of 0.15 dkh would cause issues like im having?

 

[jsker]

Most run the dkh at 7.8 to 8.5 for growth. The ocean sits at 7.0

 

[Acro maniac]

Most run the dkh at 7.8 to 8.5 for growth. The ocean sits at 7.0

Im at 8dkh according to salifert
Is 0.15 dkh difference in a 10 gal mix going in an 85plus gallon system a swing?

 

[Mattrg02]

Im at 8dkh according to salifert
Is 0.15 dkh difference in a 10 gal mix going in an 85plus gallon system a swing?

0.15dkh isn't a swing. Going from 7-8dkh would be a swing.

That picture looked more like a feeding response by the corals, no?

Current in the water means metal is exposed somewhere. That would Leach in and cause problems. I'd track that down asap. How are you measuring current? Tank to house ground? Make sure your house ground is really at zero volts.

I work for a utility and know that imbalanced circuits coming out of a substation can lead to your ground not being at zero volts anymore. You'll get current in the neutral, which tied to ground, will cause your ground to have a potential on it.

 

[jsker]

Im at 8dkh according to salifert
Is 0.15 dkh difference in a 10 gal mix going in an 85plus gallon system a swing?

It should not, one thing I do is use two test if I am not quite sure. The kits I trust at Hanna, EOLS, and Aquforest for my alk. Alk test are very interesting when it comes to age and how the titration is stored. For example I tested Saturday and my number the week before was a 8.3 and this week it was 7.6 with not changes. I used a different kit to check and found that I was getting a wrong reading for the Hanna. Something to do with storing the titration standing up so the titration in not touching the card board top of the cap and some research.

 

[jsker]

0.15dkh isn't a swing. Going from 7-8dkh would be a swing.

That picture looked more like a feeding response by the corals, no?

Current in the water means metal is exposed somewhere. That would Leach in and cause problems. I'd track that down asap. How are you measuring current? Tank to house ground? Make sure your house ground is really at zero volts.

I work for a utility and know that imbalanced circuits coming out of a substation can lead to your ground not being at zero volts anymore. You'll get current in the neutral, which tied to ground, will cause your ground to have a potential on it.

Good point, I did not think of that

 

[Acro maniac]

Tips have tissue missing and are brittle.
Current isnt checked with a meter i can feel a slight prick in a small cut on my finger if i orientate it correctly putting my hand in the tank.

 

[Acro maniac]

If im dealing with an alk swing and my new water matches within 0.15 dkh according to a test of each. What can i do to rectify this?
You no idea how frustrating this is after this many years in the hobby.

 

[Mattrg02]

Tips have tissue missing and are brittle.
Current isnt checked with a meter i can feel a slight prick in a small cut on my finger if i orientate it correctly putting my hand in the tank.

That slight prick is bad. You need to figure out how current is flowing through your tank.

 

[Scott.h]

.1 is nothing especially considering you are doing a 10% water change. That translates to .01 to the tank.

Start unplugging stuff with a meter in the tank. Probably a heater going bad

 

[Acro maniac]

That slight prick is bad. You need to figure out how current is flowing through your tank.

I will go throught the tank tonight and try to isolate it.
I donot have a ground for the tank currently I have never need one that I knew.
Could this current by my issue???
Im going to do a search on volt/amp meter current test on aquarium, now. If you have good directions for me can you give me a link?
Thanks again