Holes from over driven screws in stands.

[Flameback Pair]

I am the OP and this is getting out of hand.

On to new business. I went to the lumber store and got a quote:

--Mitchell.

 

[Fish Fan]

I am the OP and this is getting out of hand.

While I agree that this thread is now wondering, and I believe I am a part of that and for that I am sorry, I've done nothing but try to guide you from many years of woodworking experience

And right now, I am trying VERY hard to help make sure that your nice Glass Cages tank doesn't come crashing down because the stand supporting it was insufficient.

I would encourage you and everyone NOT to believe me - what do I know. But let's ask if @BeanAnimal can circle back here if he has a minute.

Let's ask @RocketEngineer if they have a minute to comment on the design of his stand that I've quoted here.

Let's see if @UncommonSense or @Troylee can weigh in on if you're stand design is capable of supporting the tank long term.

As always, I hope this helps

 

[BeanAnimal]

Okay let’s calculate some figures

70gal at 1.025SG = apx 277.673lbs.
Weight of aquarium apx 100lbs.
Weight of hardscape apx. 65lbs.

total =442.67 lbs .

You can't use density like that. You have to multiply it times the weight of the water itself to get the weight of saltwater.

Pure water weighs ~8.34 pounds per gallon. Saltwater at 1.025SG would be 8.54 (8.34 * 1.025) pounds per gallon. Let's round to 8.5 for easy math.

Rock and sand have a higher density than water, lets call them 20 pounds per gallon.

If the tank holds 70 gallons of water and we displace 10 gallons of that water with rock and sand:

60 gallons * 8.5 pounds per gallon = 510 pounds of water
10 gallons * 20 pounds per gallon = 200 pounds of rock and sand
That is 710 pounds.

The tank is likely closer to 140 pounds dry.

So we are at 850 pounds, before lights, or your mother-in-law leaning on it to look inside.

 

[Flameback Pair]

Back to the goal of this thread. If I can add some vertical support, I will cover the stand. If I can't add enough vertical support, I will be forced to start over with the stand and build a new stand.

I know this started a screw hole thread but we moved on to the whole stand.

 

[MasterClassReefs]

I am the OP and this is getting out of hand.

While I agree that this thread is now wondering, and I believe I am a part of that and for that I am sorry, I've done nothing but try to guide you from many years of woodworking experience

And right now, I am trying VERY hard to help make sure that your nice Glass Cages tank doesn't come crashing down because the stand supporting it was insufficient.

I would encourage you and everyone NOT to believe me - what do I know. But let's ask if @BeanAnimal can circle back here if he has a minute.

Let's ask @RocketEngineer if they have a minute to comment on the design of his stand that I've quoted here.

Let's see if @UncommonSense or @Troylee can weigh in on if you're stand design is capable of supporting the tank long term.

As always, I hope this helps

3 fantastic suggestions for advice there.

 

[MasterClassReefs]

Back to the goal of this thread. If I can add some vertical support, I will cover the stand. If I can't add enough vertical support, I will be forced to start over with the stand and build a new stand.

I know this started a screw hole thread but we moved on to the whole stand.

Best to take the precaution for a nice custom tank for its sake, and your home.

 

[BeanAnimal]

I am the OP and this is getting out of hand.

On to new business. I went to the lumber store and got a quote:

--Mitchell.

Without seeing more photos, it is hard to tell what is actually carrying the load or how the stand will act when shear forces are applied… you know, your mother-in-law leaning against it to look in. Think of shear force in this context as a lateral push, trying to move the stand off its legs. Strong legs with weak connections will buckle.

The tank is also hanging inside the legs. I can’t see how this force is transferred to the legs.

My suggestion is to start over.

The stand design by Rocket Engineer is a bit overbuilt, and exactly what you want if you are not an engineer. It is well thought out and allows somebody with no engineering background, and only basic carpentry and joinery skills, to build an extremely safe and reliable stand using standard dimensional lumber.

Measure carefully.

The most important part is that the four corners the tank rest on are in the same plane and that there are no high spots on any of the front, back, or side rails. If anything, a gap (sag) is better than a hump (crown) on those members. Ask if that doesn't make sense.

You can then wrap the stand in doors and wood of your choice. The suggestion is to fix the back panel with screws. This stiffens the entire stand and prevents the shear forces we talked about earlier from buckling the stand.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Back to the goal of this thread. If I can add some vertical support, I will cover the stand. If I can't add enough vertical support, I will be forced to start over with the stand and build a new stand.

I know this started a screw hole thread but we moved on to the whole stand.

I would need to see some more photos to understand if that will work. I think you will be better off starting over. See above. You will end up with a much stronger stand in the same footprint without having to worry about retrofitting supports.

If you do want to entertain the idea of fixing that stand, I need more photos of the underside and how the top is attached inside that frame. I would urge you to simply start over with Rocket's plans.

 

[UncommonSense]

I think @BeanAnimal hit the nail on the head here! (pun intended)

That is to say, I second the idea of a more robust stand design for this tank!

 

[mfinn]

I know this started a screw hole thread

you just had to ask, didn't you.

 

[Reefering1]

I know this started a screw hole thread

 

[Flameback Pair]

And right now, I am trying VERY hard to help make sure that your nice Glass Cages tank doesn't come crashing down because the stand supporting it was insufficient.

I would like to know if I could add vertical support to my existing stand without disturbing the tank sitting upon it?

 

[Flameback Pair]

I know this started a screw hole thread but we moved on to the whole stand.

Edit: I know this started AS a screw hole thread but we moved on to the THREAD BEING ABOUT the whole stand.

 

[Dogeatbird]

Depends on placement.

If you are thinking of laminating, or making a post /column thicker.

Yes a thicker vertical post will be less likely to deflect/fail.

Does this,Now thicker post still uniformly support the aquarium perimeter?

The hardest part of structural design and load bearing is maintaining post/columns are sufficient stiff and remain co-planer.

 

[Flameback Pair]

Depends on placement.

Does this,Now thicker post still uniformly support the aquarium perimeter?

The hardest part of structural design and load bearing is maintaining post/columns are sufficient stiff and remain co-planer.

I will post some pictures. Some of the decisions depend on the placement of a sump I have on order.

 

[Fish Fan]

I would like to know if I could add vertical support to my existing stand without disturbing the tank sitting upon it?

I think we'd really need a picture of what's going on under your tank to answer that question

But, I really think you should just rebuild this stand with the Rocket Engineer's plans above. It would cost you like $35 worth of wood, glue, and screws, and you'd have a sturdy foundation to add whatever outer skin you want, like your Alder.

Would you have anyone to help you that has basic tools and wood working skills? If so, it would take a weekend at most for even a beginner woodworker.

 

[Flameback Pair]

I know some housebuilders. I've built a lot of cattle fence. Rebuilding the whole thing new is a great project however I think I will pass. Plus I like going to a lot religious meetings. I would like this forum to help shore up the two stands I have, thank you.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Depends on placement.

If you are thinking of laminating, or making a post /column thicker.

Yes a thicker vertical post will be less likely to deflect/fail.

Does this,Now thicker post still uniformly support the aquarium perimeter?

The hardest part of structural design and load bearing is maintaining post/columns are sufficient stiff and remain co-planer.

Post deflection or buckling is not even remotely an issue here. The posts thickness is not a problem.

The surface that the tank is sitting on appears to be floating between the support columns. The tank appears to sitting on a plywood surface that is larger than the tank. The issues that we are concerned with is how the load is being carried by the plywood top and how it is being transferred to the legs.

 

[Flameback Pair]

Would putting a 2x in the inside corner of the posts be good and call it a day?

 

[Flameback Pair]