How to Quarantine

[deedubz]

Found this pic of my clown. No pics of other fish. Flame Hawkfish survived. Been treating with Ich X bath every 2 days while setting up. Looks and acts okay. Should I transfer to a QT with Ich X? Meds on hand: Ich X, PraziPro, Kordon Meth Blue.

To me, that looks like velvet and you'll need to act very fast. You won't have the luxury of slowly ramping it up over several days. If you haven't already done so today, you'll want to do a fw dip and a bath on their way to a CLEAN qt. You can use some bio spiral/Dr Tim's/etc in an hob filter with some biomax and a sponge to seed the qt.

I know nothing of ich x, so I can't advise there. I've only ever used coppersafe and copper power. Maybe one of these guys/gals can give you some advice
@Big G @Humblefish @melypr1985

 

[alpenreefer]

As I said in my original post. I lost several fish fast. Clown was one of the fish I lost when it hit. Picture was taken hours before it died. Only a Flame Hawkfish remains, but does not look anything like this.

Any thoughts re: "slightly" cloudy QT water or TTM tank setup for 4 week observation period? @Humblefish @melypr1985

 

[Big G]

Yep. Sure appears to be velvet. Clowns are pretty tough. They often are the last man standing in a tank wiped out by velvet. Nonetheless you need to treat him and all of the fish in your tank in a QT. The main/display tank should go fallow for 76 days to starve out ich/velvet parasites. Here's Humblefish's Emergency treatment plan for velvet. I've highlighted the new, very helpful methods he's developed to treat velvet. Time is not your friend. The damage the parasites are doing inside the gills can be difficult to overcome. That's where the highlighted areas below will really help:

Emergency Treatment for Marine Velvet Disease

I recently acquired 3 fish - Longnose Butterfly, Kole Tang, Naso Tang - with velvet. None showed visible physical symptoms right away, but they all came from a tank where velvet was known to be present so I just patiently waited. Before & after pictures will follow immediately after this write-up.

In short, the Butterflyfish didn’t make it; however the two tangs did. The only difference in their treatment was I used formalin (with Methylene Blue) on the butterfly in a bath solution, whereas the tangs got acriflavine (with NO Methylene Blue). It’s also worth noting that the butterfly & Kole Tang showed symptoms the worst, whereas the Naso only had moderate visible symptoms. Tangs are also generally considered hardier than butterflyfish, so there’s that factor to consider as well. Anyway, here is the treatment I used on them. Also note that there have been some problems with Coppersafe lately. So we are recommending Copper Power instead.

The short version:

• 5 minute freshwater dip
• Immediately afterwards, perform a chemical bath (in saltwater matching SG/temp the fish came from). You have two options:

1. Acriflavine (preferred) - Do the bath for 75-90 minutes, but remove the fish immediately at the first sign of distress. Aerate heavily both before & during the bath, and temperature control the water. The following products contain acriflavine: Acriflavine-MS and Ruby Reef Rally. DO NOT mix acriflavine with any other chemicals.
2. Formalin - Do the bath for 30-60 minutes max, but remove the fish immediately at the first sign of distress. Aerate heavily both before & during the bath, and temperature control the water. The following products contain formalin: Formalin-MS, Quick Cure, Aquarium Solutions Ich-X, Kordon Rid-Ich Plus. Use protection (rubber gloves, face mask, eye protection, etc.) whenever handling formalin as it is a known carcinogen! However, you can add Methylene Blue to the formalin bath (1 capful per 2-3 gallons of bath water.)

• After the bath, place the fish in a QT pre-dosed at 80mg/gal using Chloroquine phosphate. In theory, copper (exs. Cupramine, Coppersafe, Copper Power) should work just as well as CP. However, due to how fast velvet can reproduce you don’t have the luxury of slowly ramping up the copper level as is normally advised. Therefore, the fish needs to be placed in a QT with copper already at minimum therapeutic levels. This is the advantage CP has over copper in this particular situation.
• While in QT, use a wide spectrum antibiotic (exs. Seachem Kanaplex, Furan-2) for the first week to ward off any possible bacterial infections. Secondary bacterial infections are very common in fish with preexisting parasitic infestations such as velvet.
• Keep the fish in CP or copper (at therapeutic levels) for one month. However, you can transfer the fish into a non-medicated holding tank for observation after just two weeks (explained below). DO NOT lower the CP or copper level before transferring.

 

[deedubz]

A

 

[alpenreefer]

A

Thanks @Big G and @dwwataz. I will start up the QT with Copper and transfer the "survivors".

 

[alpenreefer]

What type of filter/circulation would you recommend? I have a HOB I could use.

 

[Big G]

Big fan of Aquaclear HOB. Use the foam filter pad soaked in BioSpira or Dr. Tims for at least overnight (in an emergency just soak and use). And a mesh bag with BioMax (by Fluval) or Seachem Matrix, also soaked with BioSpira or Dr. Tims. Have had zero ammonia with water changes every 5 days or so and zero copper absorption my the BioMax as well.

~ Gary

 

[deedubz]

Big fan of Aquaclear HOB. Use the foam filter pad soaked in BioSpira or Dr. Tims for at least overnight (in an emergency just soak and use). And a mesh bag with BioMax (by Fluval) or Seachem Matrix, also soaked with BioSpira or Dr. Tims. Have had zero ammonia with water changes every 5 days or so and zero copper absorption my the BioMax as well.

~ Gary

I'm also a huge fan of the aquaclears. I too use @Big G protocol for setting up qts. I dont have experience with the matrix, but @Humblefish currently has an experiment thread going on using it in a reactor and has had zero absorption. Pretty awesome. I've been using biomax and have had zero issues with absorption or ammonia either.

 

[deedubz]

Oh, since you're doing copper...
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/c...instruments-high-range-copper-checker.368943/

If you go with coppersafe, make sure you test frequently while ramping up. If you follow the directions on the bottle you'll heavily overdose... I'm talking 3-4ppm(double recommended) I've had luck doing .89-1ml per gallon. That got me between 1.81-2ppm. I'm not sure what the dosing directions are for copper power or how accurate they are, as I haven't used it in quite a while. Whatever route you choose, make sure you're testing often.

Good luck man. As I said, I'm finally turning a corner with my own velvet outbreak. I lost several fish myself. It's a nasty and terrible parasite. Let us know if you need any more help

 

[alpenreefer]

Great info. Best part is I already have everything. Just need to "dust off" the HOB and add a drop of oil to the impeller. Should be ready to go. I'll run it for awhile in a bucket of water to make sure. Also need to head out in the garage to assemble a mesh tank top (sim to BRS) from screen frame and 1/4" mesh.

Still don't understand why the new water looks cloudy. Ideas?

 

[Big G]

Great info. Best part is I already have everything. Just need to "dust off" the HOB and add a drop of oil to the impeller. Should be ready to go. I'll run it for awhile in a bucket of water to make sure. Also need to head out in the garage to assemble a mesh tank top (sim to BRS) from screen frame and 1/4" mesh.

Still don't understand why the new water looks cloudy. Ideas?

Micro bubbles.
Have you tried this to lube your impeller? Sometimes it needs a couple of nudges, but it is totally quiet.

 

[deedubz]

How long after mixing was/is it cloudy? Was this pre mixed before putting it in the qt?

A couple times I rushed a qt together I didn't let the salt mix entirely. Within a few hours of hob filters/powerhead/air stones running it'd clear right up

Also, I've noticed biospira will cloud the water up for a few hours if that was added already

 

[deedubz]

When I do my qt tops I make sections. This way I can have as little openings as possible. Sheet of egg crate, brs 1/4" netting, and zip ties... Won't win totm, but it will keep my wrasses in!

 

[4FordFamily]

How long after mixing was/is it cloudy? Was this pre mixed before putting it in the qt?

A couple times I rushed a qt together I didn't let the salt mix entirely. Within a few hours of hob filters/powerhead/air stones running it'd clear right up

Also, I've noticed biospira will cloud the water up for a few hours if that was added already

I’ve also experienced this, particularly with instant ocean salt.

 

[4FordFamily]

When I do my qt tops I make sections. This way I can have as little openings as possible. Sheet of egg crate, brs 1/4" netting, and zip ties... Won't win totm, but it will keep my wrasses in!

I like it a lot! @HotRocks we need to make something like that!

 

[deedubz]

I like it a lot! @HotRocks we need to make something like that!

Thank you! It takes a bit of time to cut around the borders and cutting the middle out, but there's zero room for jumping. Also, I'd rather them smack netting if they jump up vs egg crate

 

[deedubz]

I’ve also experienced this, particularly with instant ocean salt.

Red sea does it too. Fritz mixes in seconds but, given their reaction to my email about coppersafe, I switched back to RS today

 

[4FordFamily]

Red sea does it too. Fritz mixes in seconds but, given their reaction to my email about coppersafe, I switched back to RS today

No Fritz anything for me anymore.

 

[deedubz]

No Fritz anything for me anymore.

Yup. I finished my salt mix and after these guys get through qt I'm dumping my bottle of coppersafe. I got copper power in the other day if/when I need copper again

Lol, don't know how that first bit didn't get deleted

 

[Josh Kraft]

No Fritz anything for me anymore.

Can you link me to their reaction?

I have two bottles of coppersafe and am waiting for a Hanna meter