Is this velvet? Something else?

[Pau Hana Reefer]

Does my white tail bristletooth tang have velvet? Or is this something else, perhaps dust from sand tray that is in the observation tank?

Yesterday and earlier this evening, I noticed that he had a thin cloudy/white film on him. I thought I was also seeing some stuff on the very edge of his dorsal fin. I was initially wondering if it is dust from the sand. I think he was picking pieces of food out of the container with sand.

Here is a video from a few hours ago.


However, I just saw him again and he was sitting in the middle of the tank under the HOB filter return. I just captured new pictures. He’s very shy and the stuff is more apparent in some angles than others. So I took as many pictures as I could. It is much more noticeable in pictures now than 3 hours ago.

He came from a vendor that is supposed to do full quarantine, so currently in observation tank with no medications. He also came with a wrasse that died in the same tank last Friday. No signs of any disease on the wrasse and I thought he died from shipping stress.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

The fish is breathing a bit fast, but it is still eating. The tank has good circulation, but is there good aeration? Is ammonia at zero?

I can’t see the skin clearly enough, but I don’t think this is velvet….still, with the wrasse dying, you might want to re quarantine the tang anyway.

 

[Pau Hana Reefer]

The fish is breathing a bit fast, but it is still eating. The tank has good circulation, but is there good aeration? Is ammonia at zero?

I can’t see the skin clearly enough, but I don’t think this is velvet….still, with the wrasse dying, you might want to re quarantine the tang anyway.

I have a sponge air stone in the corner. Ammonia is currently at zero.

Could it be just sand “dust” that mixed with his mucus? It’s most noticeable in the pictures near his dorsal fin and above his eyes, particularly those pictures taken from behind. I’ll try to see if I can get better pictures, but he’s incredibly timid.

What would you recommend for treatment? I currently only have copper power and Prazipro on hand.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Does my white tail bristletooth tang have velvet? Or is this something else, perhaps dust from sand tray that is in the observation tank?

Yesterday and earlier this evening, I noticed that he had a thin cloudy/white film on him. I thought I was also seeing some stuff on the very edge of his dorsal fin. I was initially wondering if it is dust from the sand. I think he was picking pieces of food out of the container with sand.

Here is a video from a few hours ago.


However, I just saw him again and he was sitting in the middle of the tank under the HOB filter return. I just captured new pictures. He’s very shy and the stuff is more apparent in some angles than others. So I took as many pictures as I could. It is much more noticeable in pictures now than 3 hours ago.

He came from a vendor that is supposed to do full quarantine, so currently in observation tank with no medications. He also came with a wrasse that died in the same tank last Friday. No signs of any disease on the wrasse and I thought he died from shipping stress.

Lighting is low and pics fuzzy but when blown up, I can see the dots which based on the size is ich and not velvet. This tank appears to be a quarantine tank and makes me wonder- Are you medicating tank at all? If not, you've lost valuable time with treatment which has overtaken fish and tank will have to be treated with coppersafe at treatment level 2.25ppm for a full thirty days (do not interrupt this 30 day period) monitored by a reliable Copper Test kit such as Hanna Brand- No API brand. Also monitor Ammonia levels while in quarantine with a reliable test kit and add aeration during treatment using an air stone.

 

[Pau Hana Reefer]

Lighting is low and pics fuzzy but when blown up, I can see the dots which based on the size is ich and not velvet. This tank appears to be a quarantine tank and makes me wonder- Are you medicating tank at all? If not, you've lost valuable time with treatment which has overtaken fish and tank will have to be treated with coppersafe at treatment level 2.25ppm for a full thirty days (do not interrupt this 30 day period) monitored by a reliable Copper Test kit such as Hanna Brand- No API brand. Also monitor Ammonia levels while in quarantine with a reliable test kit and add aeration during treatment using an air stone.

No medication, only observation tank. If you recall from the other day, I had another post where he had a much bigger white speck on a fin. It disappeared the other day, right before this all started.

For copper.,. Should I ramp up or go straight to therapeutic levels at this point? And any value in freshwater dip before? I have copper power and Hanna tester.

 

[vetteguy53081]

No medication, only observation tank. If you recall from the other day, I had another post where he had a much bigger white speck on a fin. It disappeared the other day, right before this all started.

For copper.,. Should I ramp up or go straight to therapeutic levels at this point? And any value in freshwater dip before? I have copper power and Hanna tester.

Go straight to treatment level, as ramping allows disease to take hold of the fish. Freshwater dip no value unless you are doing hypo treatment

 

[Pau Hana Reefer]

Go straight to treatment level, as ramping allows disease to take hold of the fish. Freshwater dip no value unless you are doing hypo treatment

I just took an ammonia measurement and it is way too high… at 1ppm. I can’t believe this basic mistake. Relied on the badge and hadn’t taken a test in over 4 days.

Does this change anything? I’m making water for an emergency water change. I also have Seachem Prime on hand.

I tried feeding right before testing for ammonia and he barely ate.

 

[Pau Hana Reefer]

I’m at a loss about the ammonia. I’ve done over a dozen quarantine/observation tanks using the same process and never had it go above zero.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I’m at a loss about the ammonia. I’ve done over a dozen quarantine/observation tanks using the same process and never had it go above zero.

What test kit are you using? You haven’t added any copper yet, right? (Chelated copper gives false ammonia readings).

Do you have any established tank you can take bio media from?

I don’t like Prime for ammonia control (run a search on that here). I prefer water changes and Amquel.

 

[Pau Hana Reefer]

What test kit are you using? You haven’t added any copper yet, right? (Chelated copper gives false ammonia readings).

Do you have any established tank you can take bio media from?

I don’t like Prime for ammonia control (run a search on that here). I prefer water changes and Amquel.

I did not have any copper in the tank previously. Have been using API tester, but just ordered a Salifert test kit since I did add Copper Power last night. Salifert will work, correct?

I had filter floss and my sponge air stone was sitting in my main tank for 2.5 weeks before putting it in my QT. The only difference that comes to mind with this time versus all my past QTs is feeding frozen mysis almost daily. I have a bin of dry rock that just went through a tank cycle. I’ll pull one out tonight and put in this tank.

I did a 70% emergency water change last night and got it down to under .25ppm. Will be doing more water changes after work today. Dosed copper power up to 2.25 ppm (tested using Hanna).

Thanks for the tip on Amquel and for your help!

 

[vetteguy53081]

I just took an ammonia measurement and it is way too high… at 1ppm. I can’t believe this basic mistake. Relied on the badge and hadn’t taken a test in over 4 days.

Does this change anything? I’m making water for an emergency water change. I also have Seachem Prime on hand.

I tried feeding right before testing for ammonia and he barely ate.

Reason I always disagree with use of the badge. Its made for freshwater also and diminish accuracy in medication from what I see over the years

 

[vetteguy53081]

I did not have any copper in the tank previously. Have been using API tester, but just ordered a Salifert test kit since I did add Copper Power last night. Salifert will work, correct?

I had filter floss and my sponge air stone was sitting in my main tank for 2.5 weeks before putting it in my QT. The only difference that comes to mind with this time versus all my past QTs is feeding frozen mysis almost daily. I have a bin of dry rock that just went through a tank cycle. I’ll pull one out tonight and put in this tank.

I did a 70% emergency water change last night and got it down to under .25ppm. Will be doing more water changes after work today. Dosed copper power up to 2.25 ppm (tested using Hanna).

Thanks for the tip on Amquel and for your help!

Hanna best but salifert is ok

 

[MnFish1]

I would remove the sand if you're going to use copper and you don't have a wrasse - to decrease copper adsorption if you haven't already)

 

[Pau Hana Reefer]

Reason I always disagree with use of the badge. Its made for freshwater also and diminish accuracy in medication from what I see over the years

I’ve heard stories over the years of badges not working. This incident is enough to put me in your school of thought. I had a backup badge and didn’t even bother putting it in there last night.

Hanna best but salifert is ok

Good to know. I may just buy a Hanna tester as well with the number of new fish I am looking to introduce in the coming months.

Thank you again for your help. I’ve always watched you help others and I appreciate you greatly.

 

[Pau Hana Reefer]

I would remove the sand if you're going to use copper and you don't have a wrasse - to decrease copper adsorption if you haven't already)

I took it out last night before adding copper power. Thank you for looking out!

 

[MnFish1]

FWIW - the seachem alert badge is actually designed for fresh or salt water - I have not had an issue with it. the pH alert is designed for freshwater - which is why its somewhat odd that they are marketed together. Though I would not use it on a display tank for long periods - for screening for problems like in a QT system - I think the ammonia alerts work. One does have to be careful to be sure that medications used do not affect it. Additionally once wet it can take a couple days to develop the correct color - thus - it's best to keep in saltwater for a couple days before planning to use it. The color changes are not immediate when ammonia level is coming down - it takes a couple hours. Reading ammonia that is going up equilibrates more quickly.

 

[Pau Hana Reefer]

FWIW - the seachem alert badge is actually designed for fresh or salt water - I have not had an issue with it. the pH alert is designed for freshwater - which is why its somewhat odd that they are marketed together. Though I would not use it on a display tank for long periods - for screening for problems like in a QT system - I think the ammonia alerts work. One does have to be careful to be sure that medications used do not affect it. Additionally once wet it can take a couple days to develop the correct color - thus - it's best to keep in saltwater for a couple days before planning to use it. The color changes are not immediate when ammonia level is coming down - it takes a couple hours. Reading ammonia that is going up equilibrates more quickly.

I shared the same understanding of Seachem ammonia alert vs pH alert. I was using the ammonia alert these last 1.5 weeks. Agreed their marketing can cause confusion. I’ve never had an issue with ammonia alert back in 2019-2021 when I was stocking my tank. This is what led me to get comfortable this time around. When Jay asked about my ammonia levels… I decided to double check with a test kit.

Thanks for the tip of soaking prior to use. I never did that before. If I do decide to try using a the badge in the future, I will definitely try this. Appreciate the info and help!

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I did not have any copper in the tank previously. Have been using API tester, but just ordered a Salifert test kit since I did add Copper Power last night. Salifert will work, correct?

I had filter floss and my sponge air stone was sitting in my main tank for 2.5 weeks before putting it in my QT. The only difference that comes to mind with this time versus all my past QTs is feeding frozen mysis almost daily. I have a bin of dry rock that just went through a tank cycle. I’ll pull one out tonight and put in this tank.

I did a 70% emergency water change last night and got it down to under .25ppm. Will be doing more water changes after work today. Dosed copper power up to 2.25 ppm (tested using Hanna).

Thanks for the tip on Amquel and for your help!

I agree, the Salifert test should work better.

2.5 weeks is not really long enough to establish a good growth of beneficial bacteria. I usually go 6+ weeks. The dry rock you have may work better.

The background ammonia level for copper power is about 0.50 ppm - so just worry about the level if it is higher than that.

 

[Pau Hana Reefer]

I agree, the Salifert test should work better.

2.5 weeks is not really long enough to establish a good growth of beneficial bacteria. I usually go 6+ weeks. The dry rock you have may work better.

The background ammonia level for copper power is about 0.50 ppm - so just worry about the level if it is higher than that.

Really good to know about 6+ weeks and background ammonia levels.

 

[Pau Hana Reefer]

Quick update…. Just got home from work and this is the state of the tang. Still moving but breathing very heavily. I don’t know if he’s going to pull through. I think I messed up big with the ammonia. The white spots and the white fog seems clearer. But he’s clearly not in great state.

I’m worried about even doing water changes to control ammonia levels while he is in this state.