leds for a 40 gallon breeder

[Saltwatercoral2]

I am wanting to go LEDs on my 40 gallon breeder. New to the leds, so I have no idea what im buying. I want to be able to dim them with my apex. MY corals will me lps, softies, clams and anenomis. THe dimensions on the tank are 36 x 18 x 16. I am wanting to go with no more then 36 leds, anymore then that and its out my of range unless i can get rapidled, to give a discount like my buddy got in the past, So my next questions, which leds shall I get? I would like a 2 to 1 ratio, atleast as i prefer a more blue look. What size heat sink? Is there any additional things I would need. I have contracted rapid and asked, but figured I would ask here in case they tried selling me something i dont need. Thanks!

 

[CJO]

Are you doing this yourself (DIY)?

CJ

 

[ToXIc]

How To DIY LED ReefLEDLights | LED Aquarium Lighting ReefLEDLights | LED Aquarium Lighting

plus a ton more tuts..

 

[Gabe]

I have ordered from Rapid and they are good folks. Very helpful and not trying to oversell in any of the advice I have read of theirs. You will probably need a minimum of 36 LEDs if you want to be able to keep SPS, etc. As for being able to dim them - you will need a driver with PWM controls. Their dimming kits will you give you the option to purchase either ELN-60-48P or ELN-60-48D meanwell drivers. Select the -p drivers and make sure you get the correct hardware to interface with your controller. I'm not 100% sure, but I think some of the controllers will also work with the -d models and will send out the correct 0-10v signal. I have not looked into this much though and I'm pretty sure for the more complex programming of light cycles you will do well to get the PWM driver.

 

[Saltwatercoral2]

Are you doing this yourself (DIY)?

CJ

yes I am. if I decide to go this route, I cant make up my mind!

 

[wld1783]

I have ordered from Rapid and they are good folks. Very helpful and not trying to oversell in any of the advice I have read of theirs. You will probably need a minimum of 36 LEDs if you want to be able to keep SPS, etc. As for being able to dim them - you will need a driver with PWM controls. Their dimming kits will you give you the option to purchase either ELN-60-48P or ELN-60-48D meanwell drivers. Select the -p drivers and make sure you get the correct hardware to interface with your controller. I'm not 100% sure, but I think some of the controllers will also work with the -d models and will send out the correct 0-10v signal. I have not looked into this much though and I'm pretty sure for the more complex programming of light cycles you will do well to get the PWM driver.

Gabe

Rapid is one of the few quality vendors out there however we differ in our opinion on PWM along with their LED recommendations...

Our LED recommendations are based on direct PAR testing comparing MH Lights to LEDs driven at 700mA...

And yes that rumor is true... We do test all of our products on live animals and then we cut them up into little pieces and glue them to rocks...Growth Matters...

Dimming via PWM will shift the spectrum. This can be good or bad...

There is a huge difference in the spectrum of different Cree Royal Blue lots/bin.

That said we recommend dimming via current.

Saltwatercoral2

The Apex and Profilux Controllers supports both the ELN series and our Inventronics drivers. Even the Aqua Illumination fixtures use 1-10vdc

They all use a 1-10vdc output to control the driver... I'm not 100% sure.... I'm totally sure your better off with a Mean Well or Inventronics that uses 1-10vdc over PWM.

Due primarily to the spectrum shift we are not recommending PWM dimming at this time. The current facts dont support a recommendation and or products that use PWM...

Bill

 

[kgehrke]

wld1783 is there any difference between running a PWM Meanwell vs a Meanwell 1-10V dimmable but driving the 1-10V with a PWM signal?

 

[Saltwatercoral2]

Gabe

Rapid is one of the few quality vendors out there however we differ in our opinion on PWM along with their LED recommendations...

Our LED recommendations are based on direct PAR testing comparing MH Lights to LEDs driven at 700mA...

And yes that rumor is true... We do test all of our products on live animals and then we cut them up into little pieces and glue them to rocks...Growth Matters...

Dimming via PWM will shift the spectrum. This can be good or bad...

There is a huge difference in the spectrum of different Cree Royal Blue lots/bin.

That said we recommend dimming via current.

Saltwatercoral2

The Apex and Profilux Controllers supports both the ELN series and our Inventronics drivers. Even the Aqua Illumination fixtures use 1-10vdc

They all use a 1-10vdc output to control the driver... I'm not 100% sure.... I'm totally sure your better off with a Mean Well or Inventronics that uses 1-10vdc over PWM.

Due primarily to the spectrum shift we are not recommending PWM dimming at this time. The current facts dont support a recommendation and or products that use PWM...

Bill

I checked your guys site out, and you have nice deals going on, but your sold out of all the stuff I need!. Any idea when you will be getting a shipment in, and if so will it still have the same kind of deal?

 

[wld1783]

I checked your guys site out, and you have nice deals going on, but your sold out of all the stuff I need!. Any idea when you will be getting a shipment in, and if so will it still have the same kind of deal?

Gabe

All Mean Well Drivers are in stock.

We are not a fan of PWM due to the spectrum shift and will not stock PWM Drivers...

We have experienced exponential growth and we are out of stock against our wishes on the XR-E Royal Blue for a few days...BTW Its the Premium...

All kit items will be in the next couple of days, except for the 700mA Inventronics which will be in stock the first week in July....

We are flexible and leading in our prices. Let us know if a reputable company sells for less...We will match it.

The D-Day sale continues until further notice.

Bill

 

[wld1783]

wld1783 is there any difference between running a PWM Meanwell vs a Meanwell 1-10V dimmable but driving the 1-10V with a PWM signal?

kgehrke

We have not experienced this first hand but our research has led us to the opinion that current is a better way to dim....

All the Major Controllers...Reef Keeper, APEX and Profilux use 1-10Vdc to control current/dimming not PWM

Also our research has found a spectrum shift when dimming via PWM.

Bill

 

[kgehrke]

I did a little research myself. Not so much on the PWM spectral shift, I'll take your word on it. I'm going to use an Arduino to power my LED's, this would make the PWM enticing, but I already had one meanwell that was 0-10v dimmable from a groupbuy, I still need another. There are three different circuits for me to choose from, now I just have to find out which one smooths the PWM signal the best while amplifying it from 0-5v range to 0-10v range. I believe the best option is an non-inverted op amp with a low-pass RC filter. I still need to look into it more though. I'm also looking into mosfets and transistors a bit to see if they would work because they are simple, but I'm not sold on them yet.

You probably don't care much about this information but I thought I would fill you in if you run across something like this in the future.

 

[wld1783]

I did a little research myself. Not so much on the PWM spectral shift, I'll take your word on it. I'm going to use an Arduino to power my LED's, this would make the PWM enticing, but I already had one meanwell that was 0-10v dimmable from a groupbuy, I still need another. There are three different circuits for me to choose from, now I just have to find out which one smooths the PWM signal the best while amplifying it from 0-5v range to 0-10v range. I believe the best option is an non-inverted op amp with a low-pass RC filter. I still need to look into it more though. I'm also looking into mosfets and transistors a bit to see if they would work because they are simple, but I'm not sold on them yet.

You probably don't care much about this information but I thought I would fill you in if you run across something like this in the future.

kgehrke

Actually we care a lot. A simple DIY Controller for sunrise and sunset with a moon phase that does not cost $500 would be great for the hobby.

My fall project is a complete Arduino kit build with easy to do steps so anyone who visits the site can do the same.

The only other build I came across was initially a little bit over complicated, too promising and pompous in more ways than one. I might have to suffer and read through the rest if it was actually built and tested. This was a few months back.

I think you are on the right track for now, but only have done tertiary research myself not to mention my EE nephew is off the reservation with life issues. I want to keep the build at the high school electronics shop level. Should be easy with help and research...

I plan on consulting the EEs from both Mean Well and Inventronics to see how "dirty" the signal can be for effective controlling the middle of next month. If you get to them first please post their comments.

Too many small fires to put out out first like keeping Premium and Regular LEDs in stock...

 

[kgehrke]

wld1783
I'm an ME, I have some experience with electronics, but it's been awhile. I'm hoping to catch the instrumentation engineer I work with so I can make some headway.
If I find something I'll keep you posted.

 

[wld1783]

wld1783
I'm an ME, I have some experience with electronics, but it's been awhile. I'm hoping to catch the instrumentation engineer I work with so I can make some headway.
If I find something I'll keep you posted.

Thanks

 

[Hahnmeister]

PWM dimming vs. analog dimming is meaningless... they both do the same thing and will result in identical waveforms. The PWM concern as far as LED driving has to do with the driver topology itself and how it maintains a constant current. If you use analog or PWM dimming on the input pin of a Meanwell driver, they should put out the same waveform (your PWM signal needs to be fast enough). The duty cycle of the PWM dimming signal that is fed into the driver gets translated into the current level of the output because the output to the LED's usually has a large inductor on it. The exception to this is if the LED driver lacks an inductor on the output to the LED's, but if you are using drivers like this, you should really reconsider for efficiency reasons (lacking an inductor means some capacitive switching or two-transistor power regulator that is less efficient). But the dimming signal, analog or PWM, still results in the same output.

The issue isnt PWM or analog dimming, but the driver topology itself.

 

[kgehrke]

Well if you do want a smooth signal from you Arduino ~490Hz I figured out how to do it with a little ripple effect in the signal but not bad.

 

[Hahnmeister]

All it ever takes is an inductor on the output in series with the LED's. The only thing to watch out for is "ringing" and hard switching of the driver's main driving transistor... the switch will want to turn on and off but it needs to be strong enough that the inductor doesn't damage it. I have only run into a problem once while doing this... the driver turned on and sounded like an energy weapon charging up in a movie or video game.