Leopard wrasse aggression / transition Meleagris

[LagunaGlide]

I got 3 Meleagris Leopard wrasse all together when they were very small. They went through quarantine together and were all introduced to the main tank 130 gallon at the same time.

I would say they are 8-12 month old at this point. Two of them are significantly bigger than 1. The smaller was a picky eater early on. The two big ones are well, and spent a lot of time together while the third was kind of a loner.

Over the past 3-4 days I’ve noticed the biggest one chasing the medium one. At first the medium was standing it ground a little, but that only lasted a day. Now the big one seems to be on the hunt at all times, and chases the medium one. The little one is of no one’s concern.

I have increased feeding, and introduced a mirror from time to time to give the medium one a break, but it’s not changing anything.

The one that is being chased has changed its color and is very pale / white. I assume this is a sign of submission. Yesterday morning the medium one ate, and by noon was back on the sand for the rest of the day. This morning it ate, and is still out currently.

I don’t see any damage to the medium one, but I am starting to get concerned with how aggressive the big one is.

I would appreciate some insight as to when I should intervene, how long this may last, and any other relevant info on how this transition may progress.

These are my first leopards, so I’m hoping to get some experienced advice.

Thank you.

TL;DR: I introduced three juvenile Meleagris leopard wrasses together about 6 months ago into my 130 gallon display.

Recently, the largest has become relentlessly aggressive toward the medium-sized one, while ignoring the smallest. The bullied wrasse has turned very pale, is hiding in the sand more, but is still eating and shows no visible injuries. Increased feeding and using a mirror haven’t helped.

Is this normal dominance behavior, possibly related to transitioning to male? How long might it last, and at what point should I intervene?

 

[Baldyreef]

@helmsreef has Macropharyngodon meleagris if I'm not mistaken maybe they could help

 

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This is most likely a dominance related issue and the two larger ones are basically duking it out as to which one will become the male. If the aggression gets too bad I would recommend separating them as in the wild there would be plenty of space for the smaller one to find its own territory or space to wait it out until the larger one becomes a full fledged male. As long as the medium one is still keeping a good weight and doesn't have frayed fins or marks on the body you can probably keep them together until the larger one fully transitions, and then hopefully the aggression will die down. But if you do notice any significant weight loss or increased aggression/fin nipping I would recommend taking one of them out.

 

[helmsreef]

The hardest part about Meleagris is they need a copious amount of amphipods to graze on. And like what @saltwaterfish.com has mentioned, they are fighting it out for resources and territory. Has any of them started to transition to male? Changing to a darker color? What are you feeding them? They also fair really well with grazing on nori. It might not seem it would be a staple but they do really enjoy picking at nori.

 

[Gumbies R Us]

@i cant think

 

[LagunaGlide]

This is most likely a dominance related issue and the two larger ones are basically duking it out as to which one will become the male. If the aggression gets too bad I would recommend separating them as in the wild there would be plenty of space for the smaller one to find its own territory or space to wait it out until the larger one becomes a full fledged male. As long as the medium one is still keeping a good weight and doesn't have frayed fins or marks on the body you can probably keep them together until the larger one fully transitions, and then hopefully the aggression will die down. But if you do notice any significant weight loss or increased aggression/fin nipping I would recommend taking one of them out.

Thank you for this. It's hard to tell if there is any real damage to the smaller one currently. Lots of hiding, or moving so fast you can't get a look. Still eating this morning, hopefully they work it out before it becomes too bad. I find it wild the larger one is still attacking so aggressively considering the obvious submission.

The hardest part about Meleagris is they need a copious amount of amphipods to graze on. And like what @saltwaterfish.com has mentioned, they are fighting it out for resources and territory. Has any of them started to transition to male? Changing to a darker color? What are you feeding them? They also fair really well with grazing on nori. It might not seem it would be a staple but they do really enjoy picking at nori.

Thank you for the reply.
I try to keep the tank well stocked with pods. I have another tank that is overrun with them, so I am adding from time to time. I also try to keep an how much they are actually pecking at the rocks and not just looking and moving on.

I make my own mix of food. It's a mix of Clam, oyster, a white fish, normal sized shrimp like we eat, squid, scallops, mysis, nori, oyster eggs, and blood worms. I do add some nori on a clip a few times a week, and did so yesterday in hopes of distracting the aggressor. It worked for a little while.

The one that is being harassed there is no way to tell if it has changed at all. Every time I see it currently it is white. The bigger one doesn't really appear to have changed yet either.

I am considering trying to catch one of them, and putting them in an acclimation box in the tank for a few days to hopefully let things cool off a bit. If this is a good idea, should it be the aggressor in the box? I really don't want to remove one completely as I assume this would increase the chance of both becoming males.

 

[maroun.c]

Is the largest one hitting on the smaller one as well ?
Most probable scenario is medium.and large wrass are more dominant and started transitioning. What normally happens is either the medium one stops transitioning and once the large one becomes full male and asserts his dominance fighting might stop with a few instances of asserting dominance daily.
Another scenario is that u lose the medium wrass during or lpst the transition.
Multiple wrasses in the same tank of the same species can have many different outcomes unfortunately most endup by elimination of one of the 2 fighting wrasses.
I used to gave similar issues when the dominant fairy or leopard wrass dies.

 

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Thank you for this. It's hard to tell if there is any real damage to the smaller one currently. Lots of hiding, or moving so fast you can't get a look. Still eating this morning, hopefully they work it out before it becomes too bad. I find it wild the larger one is still attacking so aggressively considering the obvious submission.




Thank you for the reply.
I try to keep the tank well stocked with pods. I have another tank that is overrun with them, so I am adding from time to time. I also try to keep an how much they are actually pecking at the rocks and not just looking and moving on.

I make my own mix of food. It's a mix of Clam, oyster, a white fish, normal sized shrimp like we eat, squid, scallops, mysis, nori, oyster eggs, and blood worms. I do add some nori on a clip a few times a week, and did so yesterday in hopes of distracting the aggressor. It worked for a little while.

The one that is being harassed there is no way to tell if it has changed at all. Every time I see it currently it is white. The bigger one doesn't really appear to have changed yet either.

I am considering trying to catch one of them, and putting them in an acclimation box in the tank for a few days to hopefully let things cool off a bit. If this is a good idea, should it be the aggressor in the box? I really don't want to remove one completely as I assume this would increase the chance of both becoming males.

How often do you feed each day? I would recommend feeding at least three separate times per day, just to really give each one a chance to fatten up. If you did go with the breeder box I would recommend catching out the smaller one that is getting bullied so you can keep a better eye on it's weight, and give it access to more food. Just make sure to put some sand and a hide (like a pvc elbow) so it feels safe. Keep them separated for a few days to a week and then try a reintroduction. Make sure to throw some food in while you're reintroducing them so there is a distraction for the larger one and he doesn't focus immediately on the smaller one. If the aggression level doesn't change or gets worse you might have to remove one permanently otherwise you risk losing a fish.

 

[LagunaGlide]

Is the largest one hitting on the smaller one as well ?
Most probable scenario is medium.and large wrass are more dominant and started transitioning. What normally happens is either the medium one stops transitioning and once the large one becomes full male and asserts his dominance fighting might stop with a few instances of asserting dominance daily.
Another scenario is that u lose the medium wrass during or lpst the transition.
Multiple wrasses in the same tank of the same species can have many different outcomes unfortunately most endup by elimination of one of the 2 fighting wrasses.
I used to gave similar issues when the dominant fairy or leopard wrass dies.

Nope, just the two of similar size duking it out. It came about pretty suddenly. The little one just does it's own thing, and no one pays it any attention.

I am really hoping to avoid that death part. I am hoping the acclimation box trick may work, but the first step will be catching one...

How often do you feed each day? I would recommend feeding at least three separate times per day, just to really give each one a chance to fatten up. If you did go with the breeder box I would recommend catching out the smaller one that is getting bullied so you can keep a better eye on it's weight, and give it access to more food. Just make sure to put some sand and a hide (like a pvc elbow) so it feels safe. Keep them separated for a few days to a week and then try a reintroduction. Make sure to throw some food in while you're reintroducing them so there is a distraction for the larger one and he doesn't focus immediately on the smaller one. If the aggression level doesn't change or gets worse you might have to remove one permanently otherwise you risk losing a fish.

I often feed three times a day. I admit some days I miss lunch. Since this started I am feeding pretty heavy, and at least 3 times a day.