Lessons learned the hard way!

[JeremyKnight]

The last 48 hours have been a relative nightmare. Three weeks ago we decided to stimulate the local fish store with our stimulus check. We got a cleaner shrimp and a scarlet red shrimp. We also got a pistol shrimp friend for the watchman we had. Also re upped on some blue and red leg hermits. Long story short I didn’t quarantine them. Two days ago my emperor was looking rough. I was not prepared with the meds I needed to treat. I also was not able to identify what I was dealing with immediately. I spent a total of six hours scraping and looking through a microscope until I was able to verify I was dealing with a very bad velvet infestation. It took three weeks almost to the day to present the symptoms that I could tell something was wrong.

Currently I have three dead fish, and 5 in a hospital tank with copper. Also a clown that is presenting with the classic symptoms of rapid breathing and the iconic velvety appearance in a separate isolated tank with copper since she looks very bad and probably won’t make it through the night.

This experience has devastated our family watching our pets, family members, dying and nothing I could do.

Take my advice and quarantine anything you put in your tank. Regardless of what you think, it can happen to you....
This is a video of the velvet from a gill clipping.

 

[gentlefish]

So sorry for your loss. No you are not alone, I went through exactly the same thing-should have known better. Thanks for writing it up for others to learn this hard lesson.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

So sorry for your loss. What was the magnification of the microscope in the video?

jay

 

[PanchoG]

Sorry for your loss.

 

[G Santana]

Sorry for the loss but my question is, how long would you have to quarantine shrimp/crabs and hermits b4 you could safely add them to your DT?
I don't believe they could be medicated so how would you safeguard in the future?

 

[gentlefish]

Typical answer for invert QT is 45 or 76 days or until they molt. There is a good table by Humblefish for fish, corals etc and Jay has some newer and shorter times published also on R2R.

 

[arking_mark]

The 12 Commandments of Reef Keeping

Nothing good happens fast in a reef tank Triple-check before you believe any observations or make any changes to your tank Only make one change at a time in your reef tank Use the right tool for the right job Only dose what you can test for Don't chase #s, chase stability. When altering the...

www.reef2reef.com

Anytime you add anything to your tank (even quarantined livestock), your whole tank is at risk

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Typical answer for invert QT is 45 or 76 days or until they molt. There is a good table by Humblefish for fish, corals etc and Jay has some newer and shorter times published also on R2R.

If it is an invertebrate with no substrate, I’ll isolate them in a fishless system for 30 days. Corals and other things on substrate, I go 45 days.
There is a term for this depauration. It is used for example to flush oysters of bacteria to make them safer to eat.
Jay

 

[JeremyKnight]

So sorry for your loss. What was the magnification of the microscope in the video?

jay

1.25 x 10x with oil. Unless you were able to identify them as something else?

I’m slowly loosing all my fish regardless of the hospital tank and copper....

 

[JeremyKnight]

1.25 x 10x with oil. Unless you were able to identify them as something else?

I’m slowly loosing all my fish regardless of the hospital tank and copper....

If it is an invertebrate with no substrate, I’ll isolate them in a fishless system for 30 days. Corals and other things on substrate, I go 45 days.
There is a term for this depauration. It is used for example to flush oysters of bacteria to make them safer to eat.
Jay

So sorry for your loss. What was the magnification of the microscope in the video?

jay

Is there a master thread where there are microscopic videos of various types of bacteria or parasites. If not this might be extremely helpful to those of us who are not familiar with them?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Is there a master thread where there are microscopic videos of various types of bacteria or parasites. If not this might be extremely helpful to those of us who are not familiar with them?

I guess I'm struggling to see what you are in the video. It seems like a high magnification view, and if so, the movement then may just be Brownian motion.

I don't know of a master thread here for microscopic views of parasitic issues. So few people have microscopes that we are pretty much reliant on gross visual cues. I have some good fish disease texts (like Noga 2010) but most of the images in those are from stained sections and look completely different then with fresh samples like this.

For me - when I see Amyloodinium (velvet) it shows as non-motile, rather dark inclusions on the gills, abut the same width as a gill lamellae.

Jay

 

[JeremyKnight]

I guess I'm struggling to see what you are in the video. It seems like a high magnification view, and if so, the movement then may just be Brownian motion.

I don't know of a master thread here for microscopic views of parasitic issues. So few people have microscopes that we are pretty much reliant on gross visual cues. I have some good fish disease texts (like Noga 2010) but most of the images in those are from stained sections and look completely different then with fresh samples like this.

For me - when I see Amyloodinium (velvet) it shows as non-motile, rather dark inclusions on the gills, abut the same width as a gill lamellae.

Jay

I lost another clownfish last light. I attached a video of him from yesterday evening before lights out. Today I noticed my breeding long fin male has started with the same color loss. I scraped the fished side to tail and found some things that are also attached. Whatever this is it’s vicious! The hospital tank is now currently at .020 salinity and has rally pro in it and .06 copper. I’m did a cipro dip Friday for two hours to cover my bases. Any idea what this might be? My wife is ready to flip out if we loose the breading pair.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

The gross visual symptoms look like Brooklynella, but advanced velvet can look like that also. It is in a very bad way and likely won’t last the night. I wonder if you should try a freshwater dip? It may not survive it, but if it does, it will buy you some time.
You say your copper is at .06 What product are you using? That number doesn’t match with the four products most in use.

Jay

 

[JeremyKnight]

The gross visual symptoms look like Brooklynella, but advanced velvet can look like that also. It is in a very bad way and likely won’t last the night. I wonder if you should try a freshwater dip? It may not survive it, but if it does, it will buy you some time.
You say your copper is at .06 What product are you using? That number doesn’t match with the four products most in use.

Jay

Sorry typo, copper is .6 mg/L cuprimine ... I also have been fresh water dipping twice a day for five minutes. And you were right the clownfish in the video did not make it through the night, he was dead this morning. Do you feel the medication will be effective against brook and velvet?

 

[seanmcknew]

Sorry for your loss.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Sorry typo, copper is .6 mg/L cuprimine ... I also have been fresh water dipping twice a day for five minutes. And you were right the clownfish in the video did not make it through the night, he was dead this morning. Do you feel the medication will be effective against brook and velvet?

It will work against Velvet, but the trouble is that it takes time to cure, and velvet kills fish very fast. It would be less effective against Brooklynella. Rally Pro used as a dip (at a higher concentration) has been reported to help with Brook.

Jay

 

[JeremyKnight]

I wanted to add some additional information and photos from my experience dealing with velvet.... I learned to QT everything! I learned to not cut corners on anything dealing with my display system. I learned to have medicine on hand. I researched velvet on a microscopic level and found it was difficult to find any information.

Currently there are two fish remaining of the original nine. A long fin clown female who lost her mate and a melanarous wrasse. They will remain in qt until July. These are the photos of the fish I lost. And the two that as of now are alive.
I also want to thank those who helped. I appreciate it.

 

[UkiahTheTurtle]

why are the dead fish in bags?

 

[JeremyKnight]

why are the dead fish in bags?

When I get time I want to cut them up and learn about fish biology... they are frozen. Seems morbid but it’s cheaper than a marine biology degree.