Let's talk ph swings

[LEOreefer]

so today for the first time since setting up My tank I have people over. Windows where closed and AC turned on. My ph went into a free fall from around 8.1 to 7.7. How acceptable is this swing ? I cannot run a o2 line outside and I was looking into co2 scrubbers but the media could get expensive. Eventually I will have a cheto reactor online to help with ph but not sure what to do about this.

 

[Diesel]

Foremost don't stress out and don't chase the #.
This is normal.
Next time you can turn off your skimmer when you partying.
It prevents to mix room air with tank water.
In that case you don't mix the high level of Co2 in there.
A air pump in the sump will help as well.
Ventilate the room when you have ppl over with a ceiling fan or any kind of fan.
7.7 on the ph isn't that bad only long term will be bad for stony corals.
Hope you had a great time with your friends

 

[madweazl]

Foremost don't stress out and don't chase the #.
This is normal.
Next time you can turn off your skimmer when you partying.
It prevents to mix room air with tank water.
In that case you don't mix the high level of Co2 in there.
A air pump in the sump will help as well.
Ventilate the room when you have ppl over with a ceiling fan or any kind of fan.
7.7 on the ph isn't that bad only long term will be bad for stony corals.
Hope you had a great time with your friends

Isn't an air pump just pushing the same CO2 rich air into the water? What's the purpose of running the air pump to begin with? Fans being on or off makes no difference on my tank but maybe it helps others. I personally wouldn't change anything and just let it run.

 

[Diesel]

Airpump will draw the Co2 out the water.
Of course not the best solution but it may help a bit.
If you can not bring in a tubbing from the outside and hook it up to the skimmer a Co2 scrubber might be the best for you.
Than again don't chase the PH #.
It's a widely discussed topic and if Randy chimes in he can tell you all the scientific ups and downs about it.

 

[chipmunkofdoom2]

Airpump will draw the Co2 out the water.
Of course not the best solution but it may help a bit.
If you can not bring in a tubbing from the outside and hook it up to the skimmer a Co2 scrubber might be the best for you.
Than again don't chase the PH #.
It's a widely discussed topic and if Randy chimes in he can tell you all the scientific ups and downs about it.

An air pump might help, but it depends. The pump will draw in air form around the tank and diffuse it into the water. If the air around the tank has higher CO2 (lots of people over, very stuffy closed up home, etc), then using an air pump will likely make pH lower. The air pump will be driving CO2-rich air into the tank. If the air around the tank has relatively lower CO2, then an air pump might increase the pH.

In your first post you recommended turning off the skimmer to limit gas exchange while people are over. For the same reason you recommended this, I would not recommend attempting to increase the air exchange with an air pump. The air pump would just be driving in the same CO2-rich air that the skimmer would.

 

[Reefishness]

You could dose Alk or Kalk at night. If you're just setting up the tank two part or Kalk could work just fine for you.
If this helps: on a prior tank I dosed Kalk at night for top off on a 200 gallon system and helped with this. Currently, I've just setup my 34 gallon Nano tank again, and on this tank I'm using BRS 1.1ml dosing pumps with 2 part and the pH swing is generally .03 with an occasional rise and fall of .10 over 12-13 hr span. Dose Alk at night and Ca+ during the day. I have a statement for both that reads If pH > 8.35 Then OFF to prevent going to high. Kalk will do both for you too. Good luck!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

It is remarkable how much pH can crash when people have a big party.

I wouldn't worry about these outlier events.

If the pH routinely dropped below pH 7.7, I'd work to up that low end.

FWIW, I once put in small piece of dry ice in my sump as an experiment. I started to panic as the sump pH dropped into the 5's. lol

 

[LEOreefer]

Thanks for all the advise! This is how my ph rebounded from about 24 hrs ago

 

[Diesel]

Thanks for all the advise! This is how my ph rebounded from about 24 hrs ago

As I mentioned, don't chase your PH.

 

[LEOreefer]

I won't be chasing once my cheto reactor is online I'll be all set

 

[Ghxst]

Making your own?

 

[LEOreefer]

Making your own?

Yes sir it's already done. Just waiting to hit the point in my cycle that I can add the cheto

 

[Diesel]

I won't be chasing once my cheto reactor is online I'll be all set

Great idea!
What's the volume in the reactor and did you use leds from the inside or supplemental lighting outside?
What's your plan on daily No3 supplemental dosing once your chaeto reactor is kicking in?
Any pics or is it in your build thread?

 

[LEOreefer]

Great idea!
What's the volume in the reactor and did you use leds from the inside or supplemental lighting outside?
What's your plan on daily No3 supplemental dosing once your chaeto reactor is kicking in?
Any pics or is it in your build thread?

Its the smaller phosoban reactor with led grow lights wrapped around the outside. I dont plan on dosing no3. My goal is to time the reactor the best I can so it's efficient but still leaves a little nutrients behind. All my info is in my build thread! Check it out!

 

[Ghxst]

You can see the day I turned on the alt light sched with a chaeto in back chamber. I haven't been out of the 8.15-8.30 range since. Now I'm thinking of an auto feeder with flake just to keep it all going.

 

[XNavyDiver]

Airpump will draw the Co2 out the water.
Of course not the best solution but it may help a bit.
If you can not bring in a tubbing from the outside and hook it up to the skimmer a Co2 scrubber might be the best for you.
Than again don't chase the PH #.
It's a widely discussed topic and if Randy chimes in he can tell you all the scientific ups and downs about it.

I'm pretty sure anything will want to flow from high concentrations to lower lower concentrations. Is this one of the thermodynamic laws? So if the concentration of co2 in the surrounding room is higher in co2 than the water, that is where it will go to equilibrium.

 

[Diesel]

I'm pretty sure anything will want to flow from high concentrations to lower lower concentrations. Is this one of the thermodynamic laws? So if the concentration of co2 in the surrounding room is higher in co2 than the water, that is where it will go to equilibrium.

Your Co2 concentration what is in the surrounding area will never match that as in your water.
On any given point with ppl in the room the Co2 can go up as high as between 1200 to 1500ppm on avg with no or not many ppl it's between the 700 and 1000PPM.
Outside Co2 levels are on avg around the 300ppm.
With outside air pumped into your skimmer you will reduce it 3 till four times which gives you a avg PH from around 8.2 as standard test.
Not to mention the level of macro or micro algae in the tank, dosing schedules from Cal and Alk and light schedule.

 

[greenhorn reefer]

It is remarkable how much pH can crash when people have a big party.

I wouldn't worry about these outlier events.

If the pH routinely dropped below pH 7.7, I'd work to up that low end.

FWIW, I once put in small piece of dry ice in my sump as an experiment. I started to panic as the sump pH dropped into the 5's. lol

What about 8.5?

 

[Ghxst]

Sad thing is the measured CO2 values have been over 400ppm for over a year. We currently are at 406ppm. 10 years ago it was 375ppm and 1988 was 350ppm.

Randy, if 2030 is 450-500 ppm, how much would that lower our tanks pH? I got 0.05 but haven't checked my work yet, not till the baby is asleep.

 

[Diesel]

Sad thing is the measured CO2 values have been over 400ppm for over a year. We currently are at 406ppm. 10 years ago it was 375ppm and 1988 was 350ppm.

Randy, if 2030 is 450-500 ppm, how much would that lower our tanks pH? I got 0.05 but haven't checked my work yet, not till the baby is asleep.

I think we all have to stop driving our car.......... like forever, set the AC by the trash, put 18 wheelers in a scrap yard, no more UPS or FedEx trucks driving around as we have close to a million of them everyday and I believe 0.01% is delivering our corals around and I will retire at my lake house for the last 15 to 20 years. ;Yawn and I ain't kidding